CHAPTERS
- 0:00 – 1:25
Topuria’s move to lightweight: walking weight and why 145 became miserable
Joe and Ilia open by talking about Topuria’s shift from featherweight to lightweight and the realities of his everyday weight. Ilia explains how the constant strain of cutting 25–30 pounds started to sap enjoyment and energy, motivating the change.
- •Topuria’s walk-around weight (80–82 kg / ~175–180 lbs) vs. fighting at 145
- •Why heavy weight cuts became the hardest part of competing
- •Desire to close the 145 chapter and truly enjoy fighting again
- •Mention of his prior 155 bout (Jai Herbert)
- 1:25 – 4:43
The case against weight cutting: safety, fairness, and fixing weight classes
Joe argues weight cutting is ‘sanctioned cheating’ and bad for fighters and fans. Ilia agrees it creates a competitive trap, and they brainstorm structural fixes like adding more divisions and enforcing limits via testing/monitoring.
- •Weight cutting as a normalized but unsafe competitive advantage
- •Bigger fighters (e.g., Islam) making 155 and public misconceptions
- •Proposal: use out-of-competition weigh-ins to force weight-class moves
- •Argument for smaller gaps and more weight classes overall
- •Dehydration’s effect on the brain and performance
- 4:43 – 7:22
How weight cuts change your personality—and why some fighters still defend them
Ilia describes weight cutting as a mind-altering experience that makes him irritable and singularly focused. Joe contrasts that with fighters who claim cutting helps them ‘dial in,’ and they trade extreme examples across divisions.
- •Ilia’s analogy of deprivation and the mental shift during cuts
- •Dominick Cruz’s ‘weight cutting helps focus’ vs. big-cut reality
- •Extreme cut examples: Pereira at 185, du Plessis, Khamzat
- •Anthony ‘Rumble’ Johnson’s huge swings and Ilia’s early misses
- •Ilia’s history: bantamweight → featherweight → lightweight
- 7:22 – 9:59
Origin story: judo at 4, wrestling in Georgia, MMA discovery in Spain by pure chance
Ilia recounts his early martial arts path and the family move that accidentally led to MMA. A chance encounter with a BJJ practitioner and Gracie videos sparked a lifelong obsession.
- •Started judo at age 4; later Greco-Roman wrestling in Georgia
- •Moved to Spain at 15 and stumbled into an MMA/BJJ gym
- •His mother spotting cauliflower ears leading them to the gym
- •Learning MMA from zero knowledge and ‘falling in love’ immediately
- •Why he recommends wrestling first for aspiring MMA fighters
- 9:59 – 11:01
Building elite striking late: studying boxing greats and developing a style
Despite starting boxing at 17, Ilia explains how he accelerated his striking development through obsessive practice and film study. Joe highlights how unusual it is to reach such a high level with a relatively late start.
- •Decision to become well-rounded for elite competition
- •Training obsession with his brother: first in, last out
- •Studying Chávez, Canelo, and applying techniques in sparring
- •Finding his personal style through repetition and experimentation
- •Joe’s amazement at his striking level given the timeline
- 11:01 – 14:40
Spain’s first UFC champion and the ‘born vs. bred’ champion debate
They discuss how Topuria rose without an established national MMA pipeline, becoming Spain’s first UFC champion. The conversation expands into what makes champions: environment, inner drive, and mindset.
- •Topuria as Spain’s first top-15/top-5/UFC champion progression
- •Early Spanish UFC presence (e.g., Enrique ‘Wasabi’, Joel Alvarez)
- •Amateur and early pro path; difficulty finding opponents in Europe
- •Joe’s ‘born vs. bred’ framing with examples like Marvin Hagler
- •Ilia’s mindset: ‘If someone did it, I can; if no one did, I’ll be first’
- 14:40 – 24:45
Favorite fighters and ‘dominate vs. just win’ philosophy (plus Chandler/Bilal debate)
Ilia and Joe nerd out on fighters they love watching—especially Merab’s relentless cardio—then pivot into what makes compelling champions. Ilia draws a line between training to win and training to dominate, criticizing ‘wild’ styles as entertaining but not instructive.
- •Merab as a ‘machine’ and how he changes inside the octagon
- •Volkanovski regaining the belt; Ilia’s attitude toward losing a title
- •Paddy vs. Chandler: entertainment vs. technique and skill development
- •Bilal Muhammad: doing what it takes to win vs. fans’ expectations
- •Ilia’s personal goal: entertain, dominate, and be worth the PPV money
- 24:45 – 27:46
Rogan’s rule changes: ditch the cage, no standups, carry positions between rounds
Joe lays out an alternate MMA format aimed at purist ‘real fighting’ incentives. Ilia probes the idea, and they discuss how rounds, standups, and the cage shape strategy and spectator appeal.
- •Proposal: matted ‘basketball court’ space with boundary penalties
- •No standups; restart next round in the same position (e.g., mount)
- •Why giving strikers a reset is strategically unfair
- •‘If the crowd boos, tough’—purist view vs. entertainment
- •Discussion of round structure and why 5-minute rounds work
- 27:46 – 34:25
Global competition ideas and the ‘one league’ dream
Ilia proposes a country-vs-country world championship format, then a team-based Champions League model like soccer. Joe likes the ideas but raises practical concerns about injuries and the UFC’s dominance compared to other orgs.
- •Country team format across weight classes; aggregate wins decide winner
- •Club/team concept: sign top fighters by division and compete seasonally
- •Injury/availability challenges and the need for substitutes like soccer
- •UFC as the premier org vs. credibility of ‘world champions’ elsewhere
- •Differences in opponent variety: UFC demands all-around skill sets
- 34:25 – 42:23
Fedor’s missing UFC prime and Cain Velasquez’s legal ordeal
Joe shares his biggest ‘what-if’ fight—prime Fedor vs. prime Cain—and why Fedor never fought in the UFC. The conversation turns serious with Cain’s case and Joe’s strong views on justice and protecting children.
- •Prime dream matchup: Fedor Emelianenko vs. Cain Velasquez
- •Why Fedor-UFC never happened: contentious negotiations and control issues
- •Cain Velasquez case summary and the emotional context as a parent
- •Debate over sentencing, danger to society, and calls for a pardon
- •Brief political/cultural tangent on how society treats child predators
- 42:23 – 57:55
Conor McGregor: comeback odds, testing pool, age, partying, and PED talk
They debate whether Conor returns, what kind of opponent makes sense, and how time away changes an athlete. Joe and Ilia also discuss steroid realities—healing after injuries, testosterone exemptions, and modern testing limitations.
- •Joe’s skepticism: if Conor wanted it, he’d already be back in camp
- •Aging curves after 35 and how lifestyle accelerates decline
- •Drug-testing pool discussion and speculation about what fighters can evade
- •TRT era loopholes and examples like Vitor Belfort’s body changes
- •Ilia’s stance: cheating would ruin self-respect and the legitimacy of wins
- 57:55 – 1:07:34
Lightweight title path: Islam first, no contender fight, and the promise after vacating 145
Ilia states he won’t take a #1 contender fight and wants Islam directly. He says he vacated 145 with an understanding his next bout would be for the title, and Joe agrees the matchup is the clearest, biggest fight.
- •Joe’s matchmaking: Topuria vs. Islam as the immediate title fight
- •Ilia’s refusal to take a contender bout; willingness to wait
- •Claimed promise/expectation tied to vacating the featherweight belt
- •Why Ilia believes he’s earned it (Volkanovski + Holloway KOs)
- •Alternate big fights mentioned: Charles Oliveira; broader 155 landscape
- 1:07:34 – 1:20:40
Paddy rivalry and the Spain stadium dream: Bernabéu, Europe prime time, and the Georgia insult
Ilia explains why the Paddy feud is personal—comments about war and Georgia crossed a line. They also explore how enormous a Spain PPV could be, including the logistics of prime-time scheduling and the European market opportunity.
- •Ilia’s preferred spectacle: fighting Paddy in Spain at Santiago Bernabéu
- •Bernabéu capacity/roof and why stadium shows could work there
- •Europe prime-time events and broader platform/rights speculation
- •Origin of the beef: Paddy’s tweet joking about Russia bombing Georgia
- •Paddy’s ‘disarming’ persona as a promotional weapon vs. his resume
- 1:20:40 – 1:30:53
Inside a brutal 145 cut: 12-week deficit, fight-week water loading, and even ‘wine dehydration’
Ilia gives a detailed, step-by-step breakdown of how he cut to 145, from months-long caloric deficit to fight-week water manipulation. He describes the psychological toll, the rehydration protocol, and the lengths he went to—like drinking wine to accelerate dehydration.
- •Diet from week 1 of camp: strict calories, one cheat meal weekly
- •Fight-week protocol: water loading, removing carbs/sodium/fiber
- •Timing and preferences (sleeping ‘on weight’ the night before)
- •Using wine to dehydrate faster (and why he stopped)
- •Rehydration: electrolytes first, then carb-heavy meals for performance
- 1:30:53 – 2:26:59
Training philosophy and evolving MMA: separating disciplines, long combinations, body work, and judging issues
They close by talking shop: how Ilia structures training outside camp, how he uses long combinations and body attacks, and why modern fighters must be elite everywhere. The conversation widens to refereeing/judging quality, what made UFC successful, and mindset advice about process, habits, and avoiding social-media illusions.
- •Outside camp: boxing/wrestling/BJJ trained separately, then ‘mixed’ in camp
- •Tactical examples: Emmett breakdown, calf kicks as ‘leg jab,’ body punching
- •Power + technique: Ilia’s ‘find the moment’ mindset and finishing intent
- •Referee/judge mistakes and why standups/separations can change careers
- •UFC growth drivers (TUF era), new talent pipeline (Contender Series), and process-oriented success
