JRE MMA Show #39 with Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 0:02 (glass clinks) Yes, sir. (ice cubes clinking)

Joe Rogan 0:06 Cheers.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 0:07 Cheers. (glasses clink)

Joe Rogan 0:08 And we're live.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 0:09 And we're live. There's so much to talk about.

Joe Rogan 0:11 Obviously. So much to talk about.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 0:13 It's been years.

Joe Rogan 0:14 It's been a while. It's been a while.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 0:16 It's been a while.

Joe Rogan 0:16 And, uh, one of the reasons why you're here is 'cause I was supposed to have Jackson Win- I mean, we should just get right into this. I was supposed to-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 0:23 You think we should get into it or should we-

Joe Rogan 0:24 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 0:24 ... let the...

Joe Rogan 0:25 Let the Budweiser settle in?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 0:27 Let the Budweiser kick. I haven't even eaten breakfast. I specif-

Joe Rogan 0:29 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 0:30 ...cally didn't eat breakfast. I'm like, "I'm gonna drink beer with Joe. I already know he's getting me beer, and that way it can hit me a lot faster and I'll loosen up my lips a lot sooner."

Joe Rogan 0:37 We can do whatever you want, man.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 0:39 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 0:39 It's up to you. You're looking thick, dude. How much do you weigh now?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 0:42 Man, so I've been, um... So here's a crazy story. I go to, I go to, um, the PI to... 'Cause Dana tells me I can't go to 55, so I go to talk to the PI-

Joe Rogan 0:52 He told you you can't go? Why?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 0:54 Well, 'cause he says I'm, I'm getting old and older. Well, I should say he said old. I'm getting old. And he's worried-

Joe Rogan 1:00 The weight cut's too hard.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:01 ... the weight cut, right? So I said, "All right. I'm gonna go to the, to the PI. You guys have this amazing facility with..."

Joe Rogan 1:06 The PI stands for Performance Institute, if people don't know.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:09 Yeah. For some... There you go.

Joe Rogan 1:10 UFC Performance Institute.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:12 And, uh, they have trainers and dietician, nutrition, right? So I'm, I'm going there to meet with them to get a, a guideline and some kind of plan that we can attack so I can go to Dana, like, "Look, I met with your guys. They said it's okay." While I'm there, second day into all this, like, crazy testing you do, right? They have all kinds of tests that they run where you get on these bikes and... I mean, like, fuck, I was at like a Olympic training center (laughs) testing. Um, uh, I wanted to say Joe Silva walked in, but then that's not right 'cause he's not there anymore. So, uh...

Joe Rogan 1:43 Nick Maynard?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:44 No. Um-

Joe Rogan 1:44 Sean Shepard?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:45 ... Shelby comes in and says, "Cowboy, uh, Mike Perry really wants to fight you. You wanna take this fight?" And I was like, "Uh, well, I thought I was going to 55." And he said, "Yeah, he called you out and really wants to fight you." And I was like, "Well, fuck, okay, I'll fight him. Sure. Done. That's fine. But next one, can I go to 55?" You know? Like, goddamn. So the... how this Perry thing all started was, um, Felder's opponent got hurt. Um, I called to fight Gaethje 'cause, 'cause Vick got hurt. So I was like, "I'll go to 55, fight Gaethje." Um, and then crazy shit just happened. And then the Perry fight, they offered me and I called Perry, said, "Hey, man, I know we're training together, but this is 10 days notice. Let's do this." He's like, "Fuck yeah, man. It'd be great. Let's do this." So that's how that started and then w-... I didn't get to fight. That was the end of it for me. I went to UFC to go back to 155, then all of a sudden he's calling me out and-

Joe Rogan 2:33 So Felder winds up fighting Perry.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 2:35 Perry.

Joe Rogan 2:36 You were, you were gonna fight Perry or you were at least thinking about it.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 2:38 Yeah, I was, like, in the mix, right?

Joe Rogan 2:39 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 2:39 But I couldn't... I, I didn't get cleared because I had stitches 'cause I just fought, uh, what? I don't know, 10 days before. So, um, plus I was in the hospital having my new son, so it was kind of a weird time for everything, but I... It was wild. Wild, wild shit and now, now, now I'm fighting Perry November 10th in Denver. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 2:58 Well, what was, what was gonna happen was Jackson and Winkeljohn were supposed to be here today.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 3:07 Right.

Joe Rogan 3:08 But you had... I mean, you've been with them for how long?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 3:15 Man, I wanna say before my WC days. So I went on the-

Joe Rogan 3:21 More than 10 years.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 3:22 Yeah, easily.

Joe Rogan 3:23 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 3:24 Easily more than 10 years. I, I, I don't think there's another athlete there that's been there longer b- besides Diego Sanchez who's been there since the beginning, but-

Joe Rogan 3:33 Diego left for a little while.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 3:34 ... left for a little while, came back, um-

Joe Rogan 3:37 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 3:37 So me, you know, Holly, but she was with Wink before he, they merged. So, but, like, with actually Jackson, Jackson, I'm, like, there. I'm like the one.

Joe Rogan 3:45 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 3:45 I'm like it.

Joe Rogan 3:46 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 3:46 You know, everyone else kind of either left the gym or is retired.

Joe Rogan 3:51 So what the fuck happened? Like how, how did they decide that they were gonna corner Mike Perry? Who, by the way, I like a lot. Uh, there's noth-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 3:57 And I got noth-... and I have nothing against to say-

Joe Rogan 3:59 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 3:59 ... Perry either. I don't... This, this, this has nothing to do with, with Perry as a-

Joe Rogan 4:02 He's fun dude. I like that guy a lot.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 4:04 Yeah. So I-

Joe Rogan 4:04 I have no problem with him.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 4:05 I mean, I took him on the boat, took him shooting with me and when he was down there part of, part of the action, you know, uh, Frank Lester, who's helping him with his pads, friend of mine, you know, so he comes out shooting with me, we go out in the boat and have fun, and, um... So this has nothing to do with them. I just asked when... I went to go to 55 and then Perry called me out and wants to fight. "Sure, no problem." But I went to talk to Greg and Wink and say, "Hey, this guy's brand new to the gym." Right? "He's only been here one camp, couple of months." I said, "I don't think that it's okay for him to come in and call me out." Like, that's not, not, not right. So if he is doing that, I don't think we should allow him to, to train here for this fight. And fucking Winkeljohn tells me, "Yeah, you know, I thought you called him out and, oh, he's just a, just a shit ass and lies, like, to your face." So to me he was like, "Yeah, sure, no problem. I'll clear it up and we won't have any issues." Um, and then the next day he calls me on the phone and says, "You know what? Uh, I thought about it. If we don't have Perry, then I don't get paid and I need to get paid for this fight and, uh, uh, 'cause you just pay Greg. I don't make any money through the gym, so we're just gonna go with him." And then basically he tells me I'm no longer welcome in the gym (laughs) and he is. He said the team had a meeting. Bullshit, the team didn't have a meeting. I talked to everybody. The, the... I mean, there was no meeting, there was no hab-... So to me it's like the loyalty of Wink taking over this gym is just, is just shit, man. Turned into, like, a puppy mill. It's all, it's all about money now and not the old Jackson. When, when I used to work out... We're just getting into this, I guess, huh? All right.

Joe Rogan 5:36 Start chugging.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 5:37 Start chugging. Shit. Back when I first moved down here and I went to Greg's when the Tapout guys picked me up and introduced me and all that, right?

Joe Rogan 5:47 Back when you were on the Tapout show. Remember that-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 5:49 Show, yeah.

Joe Rogan 5:49 ... that, uh, reality show?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 5:50 Well, Mask called Greg and got me. That's how I, I got involved with them, right? I... (laughs) All right.

Joe Rogan 5:55 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 5:59 Motherfucker.I left, Leonard Garcia was fighting Roger Warter, one of my best friends. Roger Warter-

Joe Rogan 6:06 What a fight that was, by the way.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 6:08 God damn, right?

Joe Rogan 6:08 Woo!

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 6:08 Motherfucking Mexicans-

Joe Rogan 6:09 People forgot.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 6:10 ... going down.

Joe Rogan 6:10 Yeah. People forgot about that fight.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 6:12 Dude.

Joe Rogan 6:12 Go to Fight Pass. Check that one out.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 6:14 Yeah, right. Google it, bring that up. Um, Leonard's still the wildest dude I've ever met, man. Just-

Joe Rogan 6:19 I love that guy.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 6:19 So do I, man. And, um, so he calls me, like, "Cub, I need you to come down for a week. Come for one week, help me get ready for Roger." He took the fight on, like, three weeks notice. Something cr- outlandish, just like me and Leonard do, right? So I go down there. I literally never left. When I went down, first day I walked into Jackson's and Rashad, Keith, St-Pierre, Joe Daddy Stevenson, uh, I mean, the list goes on and on and on. And I was like, "Wow, this is what a real gym is like? This is what..." And they all accepted me. It was like a, like... I was, like, in the family, right? I call... I owned a house in Denver. I called my grandma and said, "I'm never coming home."

Joe Rogan 6:56 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 6:56 "I'm staying here." Sell the house, right? And I literally never went home. She would just slowly come down to visit me and bring me truckloads of shit.

Joe Rogan 7:04 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 7:05 Right? Literally. I lived in a closet, man, fuck, a third as big as this room. We had a bunk bed, me and Leonard. And, uh, if one person was standing up, the other person had to be in the bed. That's how small this room was.

Joe Rogan 7:18 Wow.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 7:18 And I lived there for two years, above, above Jackson's, and would train every day with him. Like I said, I never left. And, uh, Greg asked me, he sat me down after about, I don't know, a couple of weeks of being there, and he said, "Man, I want you to be my 55er." And at that time he had a... There was a... The list of 55ers were nuts that he had. And I was like, "Wow, fuck, Greg Jackson," who at the time was the man, man. Right? That... The gym was fuckin' 90% winning rate. And he just, he's such a knowledgeable, awesome dude, man. And to see where the gym was to where the gym is now is... It's, like, heartbreaking to me, to be honest. And I... And you wanna talk about loyalty, which is the biggest thing in this conversation that we're having right now, is how they picked someone over me through being loyal, I stuck by Greg even when the gym started going down. When Winkle John merged over, all the big pros left, it turned into, like, a puppy mill. You know? It wasn't... For, for... Back when Greg had it and it was its own school, you couldn't turn up

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 8:19 to a pro class. Like, like, some guy couldn't just come here and knock on your door. Like you say, you get weirdos here all the time. Next thing you know, he has shin pads on and he's sparring. There's literally, at the new gym, bums coming off the street, I swear to God, and will fight these... And, will come in to put stuff on a fight. That's a true story. Random bums off the street. And, uh, that would never happen back in the day.

Joe Rogan 8:39 So Greg doesn't run it anymore?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 8:40 No. He has... He's, like, so out of the loop. Winkle John runs the entire thing. And that's what-

Joe Rogan 8:45 What is, what is Greg doing?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 8:47 He kinda stepped back for a couple of years, man. Like, kinda started doing other things and just kinda got burned out, I guess. Which is why I created the BMF Ranch. I needed somewhere to go and something to do, so I created my own place. Which is Wink's argument with me right now, saying, "You be at your old place. You don't ever come here," blah, blah, blah. I said, "Well, I don't ever come here because you just... The people you let in here is outlandish." Like, anybody... You pay $150, you can get on the mats and, and spar with Holly Holmes. You know what I mean? That's, that's what it's, it's come to down there. And back in the day, it was, like, private and just us and good pros, everyone there for the same mission, trying to, trying to get better, you know? But-

Joe Rogan 9:24 I've talked to some other people that I, I don't wanna name.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 9:26 Sure.

Joe Rogan 9:26 But they've said that, that when they go down there, new guys will come in and it's literally a fight.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 9:30 It is a fight. It's... Uh, there's no, there's no, there's no A, B, C class anymore. It's like, literally, these guys come in, they wanna make a name on you. But sometimes when you're towards the end of a c- a fight camp, you don't need those new guy. You don't need that crazy sparring.

Joe Rogan 9:44 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 9:44 Right?

Joe Rogan 9:45 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 9:45 You need, you need the guys you trust. And-

Joe Rogan 9:46 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 9:47 Not some random guy I don't know.

Joe Rogan 9:49 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 9:49 So it's just, it's, it's asinine to me, man, what, what they've turned that place into.

Joe Rogan 9:54 Well, it's crazy that that still happens in MMA, because you're never gonna find that in boxing.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 9:58 No.

Joe Rogan 9:58 In boxing, all sparring is controlled.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 9:59 Controlled.

Joe Rogan 10:00 You bring in the sparring partners. You know who you're working with.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 10:03 So, I mean, we talk loyalty again. To me, with Greg, his name is on that building. It's not... It's Wink. Jackson Wink, right? Jackson fucking Wink. Your name's first even. When it came time to, to pick the decision and they said, "We wanna go with Perry," why the fuck didn't you stand... Because Greg's still with me. He's like, "Yeah, I'll just come to the ranch and we'll sort this out." And I'm like, "What the fuck are you talking about?"

Joe Rogan 10:30 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 10:30 You tell me I can't come into the Jackson Wink gym, but you're gonna backdoor and come to my fucking house and we're gonna train to fight me while Perry is there at the gym. You see everything he does. And then you're gonna come and you're gonna train me. Not to mention you're holding classes there and he's watch... I mean, you might not be training him to beat me, but there's a lot of people there that have trained with me for fucking years. So to me, that was the, the point I was saying like, "Man, can we just not have him there for this camp?" I mean, there's a lot of secrets, um, that I... That, like, inner secrets that I have, like, you know, I'm f- I'm fucking scared to death to fight. Like, that's... That's the thing he can... That they can tell him. Like, or they tell him, "You know, go get Cowboy mad. You know, that's... He doesn't fight well when he's pissed off. So fucking piss him off. Poke at him, poke the bear, piss him off. Get him out of his element. Give him the..." You know? Shit like this, that-

Joe Rogan 11:15 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 11:15 Right?

Joe Rogan 11:15 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 11:16 So... And there's a lot of other things, small, dumb things that I do. And-

Joe Rogan 11:19 Tendencies-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 11:19 Tendencies.

Joe Rogan 11:20 ... that they've seen over-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 11:21 Over the year-

Joe Rogan 11:21 ... a decade.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 11:21 Or ten... Yeah, of... Right?

Joe Rogan 11:23 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 11:24 Um, to me, that's-

Joe Rogan 11:25 It's very intimate. The, the relationship-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 11:27 Very.

Joe Rogan 11:27 ... between a coach and a fighter is, is-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 11:29 Very intimate.

Joe Rogan 11:30 ... is, is very intense. So for someone to violate that in that way... And, you know, I, I don't think there's anything wrong with guys from a camp deciding to fight each other. And you gotta work that out. But for them to tell you that you can't train there-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 11:42 If it was Carlos Condit, I agree with you.

Joe Rogan 11:43 Right. Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 11:44 We'll figure it out.

Joe Rogan 11:45 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 11:45 "All right, Carlos, you go that way. We- we-"

Joe Rogan 11:47 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 11:47 "These are your times, your hours."

Joe Rogan 11:48 Respect each other.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 11:49 Right.

Joe Rogan 11:50 Friends.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 11:52 Right.

Joe Rogan 11:52 Training partners.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 11:52 The new guy who just came in... Like I said, I got nothing against Perry. He's, he's looking for a, uh... He wants a home, right? He's look... He felt like Jackson's is his fit.

Joe Rogan 11:59 He's great. I like that guy a lot.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 12:00 So-

Joe Rogan 12:00 Nothing's gonna him. I mean, what is he gonna do?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 12:03 Right. And, and I just said, "Hey, Frank was gonna go and train with him wherever."I heard stories he was looking to go to Vegas anyway. I don't, I don't have any idea, man. I was just, I was just like, "Man, could we just not do it for this fight?" And then Winkeljohn called me on the phone, didn't even have the fucking balls or the backbone to say it to my fucking face when I was right there with him. Called me on the phone like, "Oh, uh, yeah, we're actually gonna, uh, go with Perry. You know, he pays money." It's, again, it comes back to the money. I'm like, ugh.

Joe Rogan 12:34 So Perry pays him a percentage and you don't because you-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 12:36 I only pay Greg. I've, for my-

Joe Rogan 12:38 Okay.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 12:38 ... entire career, I've ever been there because I don't like Winkeljohn's style. I don't like his, way he holds meds. I don't like the way he trains people.

Joe Rogan 12:44 What's different about what he does?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 12:46 It's the same thing for, for you, for me, for John, Sam. They're all the ex- All... It's a cookie cutter. Everything's exactly the same and it never changes. It's... I don't understand how you could be a coach of the, one of the greatest, at one time, the greatest gyms on the planet, you know? And then don't ever evolve, don't ever change, and don't run class. And it's, it... To me, it's... He just drove that place into the ground, man. Turned, literally turned it into a puppy mill. It's only about making money. And for you guys who don't know what I'm talking about a puppy mill, when someone has a dog and they just fucking breed it and sell the puppies and breed it and sell the puppies.

Joe Rogan 13:20 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 13:20 That's- That's what's happening. That's the, the infrastructure of this gym. Now let's talk about training there. Let's talk about coaching, right? Greg's supposed to be the, the, the general, right? I'm just a soldier. How come I have to be now a general and a soldier? That's the mi- That's ro- What's with the... It's fucking up in my, in my career. I can't... I need someone to tell me what to do, tell me what not to do, and I had to start my own school at the ranch, bring in my own coaches, but then now I'm making all the executive decisions. When we're training, what we're training, what we're doing. And I'm not... I'm no longer just a soldier.

Joe Rogan 13:52 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 13:52 I'm having to fucking run this whole thing. Um, it's not, man.

Joe Rogan 13:56 That's a problem for fighters.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 13:57 It's a problem for me, too.

Joe Rogan 13:58 You need

Narrator 13:58 Yes, sir.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 13:58 I like to... I'm a fucking super alpha male, and I like to communicate with my coaches and get everything done. And the guys I have are fucking standing by me and I love them to death, but I need someone to be like, "You know what, you crazy fucking bastard."

Joe Rogan 14:09 You're going too hard.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 14:09 You're going too hard.

Joe Rogan 14:10 You need to taper off.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 14:10 Let's taper off. Let's pump the brake. Or let's pick it up.

Joe Rogan 14:13 Right, right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 14:14 You... The, the, the fucking fun fuck off part of your life is taking-

Joe Rogan 14:17 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 14:17 ... over into your training. Can we step it up a little bit?

Joe Rogan 14:19 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 14:20 I need that. I need, I need fucking direction. I need, "Today we're working on this." Not just me going in there saying, "Ah, let's fucking wrestle today."

Joe Rogan 14:28 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 14:28 You know what I'm saying?

Joe Rogan 14:29 Right, right, right, right. Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 14:30 So, um-

Joe Rogan 14:31 You know what to do, but it's also nice for someone else who knows what to do, who's completely objective-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 14:37 It's be-

Joe Rogan 14:37 ... to stand on the outside.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 14:38 Because there's been s- I'm, I'm in this so long, there's-

Joe Rogan 14:40 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 14:40 Like I could literally, Joe, never spar from now till the Perry fight and probably not even do one jiu-jitsu roll and I would be okay to fight, like mentally.

Joe Rogan 14:49 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 14:50 But that's probably not a very smart idea, right?

Joe Rogan 14:52 Right, right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 14:52 Like some-

Joe Rogan 14:52 It's not you at your optimum.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 14:54 Exactly. Um, so it's just, it's fucking asinine to me. And, and the coaches down there. So not only can somebody just ring the doorbell and show up and train, pay the money. Well, you can pay the $25 to drop in or you pay the $150 a month, come to any class you want. But if you're a coach, you can just coach the class. S- It's that, that... It's that asinine to you. I see a new striking coach, a new wrestling coach, or a new jiu-jitsu guy in there twice a week probably.

Joe Rogan 15:20 And they're coaching the class.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 15:21 The... Our wrest- Main wrestling coach of Jackson Wink, the greatest school in the fucking world is a reception to a chiropractic upstairs. He's greatest credentials was he was a junior assistant coach at a college, don't know the college name, who got fired for selling the kids steroids. That's our wrestling coach at one of the greatest schools in the world.

Joe Rogan 15:44 Is he a good coach?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 15:45 No, he's terrible. He's fucking god-awful terrible. He watches videos on YouTube and tries to teach people things that don't even fucking work. It's, it's, it's asinine. Which is another reason why I had to hire my own coach and bring him in. (laughs) You know, it's like, it's like, "Whoa, whoa. Wait, what?" And now they don't even drill. They just go live and they wanna know why people get hurt every day. It's like, you can't just go in and say, "Okay, and we're wrestling. Go."

Joe Rogan 16:07 So do you think that people just get burnt out on doing things the right way and they just, they just figure, "Look, I'm just gonna do this the way that makes the most money"?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 16:15 Well, I think... Man, I wish I had, I had the answer for that. I do because I'm not in that position to... I'm not running a gym and that's... I've never done that because I don't want to... Me showing up to class every single day would wear me the fuck out.

Joe Rogan 16:27 Yeah. It wears everybody out.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 16:28 It's got to.

Joe Rogan 16:29 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 16:29 But you should have an infrastructure set in place that takes you... Especially if you're the greatest at one time, right? If your winning percentages are in the 80s and 90s and now they're in the 20s. Like I, I don't... I have no clue what our, what our rating record of the gym is, but it's, it's n- (laughs) it's nothing like it used to be, right?

Joe Rogan 16:47 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 16:47 And it's fucking... It's asinine to me, man.

Joe Rogan 16:51 So the way you were doing is that you have the BMF Ranch-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 16:54 Correct.

Joe Rogan 16:54 You have everything set up. You bring in all your sparring partners and you would be doing all your training out there. And how would Greg interact with that?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 17:00 He would, he would, he... We'd either show up down at Jackson's and spar, because they still have got... There's still bodies down there, right?

Joe Rogan 17:04 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 17:04 There's still guys. We'd show up down at his bar, we'd bring all the guys down. Or Greg would come up, you know, three or four times a week to the ranch and we'd just-

Joe Rogan 17:10 And how far is your ranch from-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 17:11 50 miles about.

Joe Rogan 17:13 Okay.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 17:13 Yeah, a good hour. Solid hour drive (laughs) into the vast Nolans of New Mexico.

Joe Rogan 17:18 New Mexico. Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 17:19 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 17:19 Do you like living out there?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 17:20 I do. I love it. I fucking love it. So I sold my house. I moved here. I fucking planted roots. Now, I could never, ever sell my place. I'm stuck in New Mexico. I'm moving back to Colorado. I'ma buy-

Joe Rogan 17:33 Why would you never sell it?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 17:34 Because I'd have to sell it to like a crazy cult leader. So if anybody out there-

Joe Rogan 17:37 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 17:37 ... listening wants to operate a cult, I have the-

Joe Rogan 17:39 Are you talking to one right now?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 17:40 I have the, I have the perfect house.

Joe Rogan 17:42 Talk to me about what kind of acreage are you talking about?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 17:44 Yeah. Well, I got 40 acres.

Joe Rogan 17:46 What do we got here?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 17:46 40 acres. Plenty of rooms, buildings.

Joe Rogan 17:49 Go ahead. What kind of animals are in your vicinity?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 17:50 Um... Oh, well.

Joe Rogan 17:52 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 17:52 Yeah. You-

Joe Rogan 17:52 This might be where we start.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 17:54 There's, there's... About an hour drive, you can run into some elk.

Joe Rogan 17:56 Mm.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 17:56 We have, uh, we got antelope, um, everywhere. Which is crazy thing about antelope, but do you know they don't jump fences?

Joe Rogan 18:03 Yeah, they won't jump fences.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 18:04 It's crazy, right? You can just literally corner them into a-

Joe Rogan 18:06 Mm-hmm.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 18:06 ... into a, into a, you know-

Joe Rogan 18:07 They occasionally jump a fence. They've been known to jump a fence occasionally, but it's very, very rare.You know they evolved, um, before the Ice Age? They evolved to get away from cheetahs. Apparently-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 18:18 How are you so smart? That's what I want to know.

Joe Rogan 18:20 (laughs) I'm not smart. I just remember things.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 18:21 Dude is fucking insane.

Joe Rogan 18:23 There was a, uh, a mass extinction of, uh, giant land mammals, it was somewhere around 12,000 years ago in North America. And before then, there was cheetahs. There was actual North American cheetahs.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 18:34 Right.

Joe Rogan 18:34 There was a North American lion that's bigger than the African lion. How about that shit? Giant ass fucking lion. And that's where these fucking things evolved.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 18:42 Did you want another chew of this? (laughs)

Joe Rogan 18:44 Yeah, I'm gonna try that shit. I swallowed it last time.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 18:47 That's the only... That's the main... Whenever I meet people for autographs, they're like, "Dude, I can't believe you got Rogan to fucking take a chew."

Joe Rogan 18:52 I did not just take it. I swallowed it. I didn't know what I was doing.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 18:55 Like a man.

Joe Rogan 18:57 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 18:57 All right. Round two. Here we go.

Joe Rogan 19:00 Round two.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 19:01 (laughs) Mm. So good.

Joe Rogan 19:04 What kind is this?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 19:06 It's, uh, Wintergreen Copenhagen.

Joe Rogan 19:08 Stick it under your chin, right?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 19:09 Under your lip. Under-

Joe Rogan 19:11 (laughs) It's under your chin. You can put it under your chin if you want. Yeah, take just a little one.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 19:16 Too late.

Joe Rogan 19:17 Too late.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 19:18 Take a giant one. Take a big old upper lipper. (laughs) Yes. So there's that, um, there's turkeys out there.

Joe Rogan 19:28 Turkey's great.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 19:28 Duck... I love turkey. I'm a bird hunting fanatic, man.

Joe Rogan 19:31 Yeah?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 19:31 I love... Oh, man, I love birds.

Joe Rogan 19:33 How many acres you got out there?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 19:34 40 acres.

Joe Rogan 19:35 Oh, wow. That's nice.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 19:36 40 acres.

Joe Rogan 19:36 You got a mule too? 40 acres and a mule, remember?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 19:39 (laughs) Um, but birds, I, I'm, I'm like a bird junkie.

Joe Rogan 19:43 How'd you find that spot?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 19:45 Um, so when I moved out there and after I was in, um, the gym for, like, a year and a half with Leonard, I was like, "Bro, you're, like, winning a bunch of UFC fights now. I'm in the WC. Uh, we're starting to get a little bit of money. Let's get a house together, right? Let's, let's find a house." So I started looking kind of in the remote areas around where I knew I could commute in, but I wanted somewhere I could ride my dirt bike, shoot guns, just be cowboy. And, um, we found that place, and I called my grandpa, and I said, "Hey, I think I found a house." And he said, "I'll be right there." And he, him and my grandma drove, and he walked up to the lady, and he handed her an envelope full of cash, and said, "Well, take it."

Joe Rogan 20:30 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 20:32 And... Just like that.

Joe Rogan 20:33 Wow.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 20:34 Yeah. It was probably 60 or 70,000 less than they were asking, but he had real cash, real cash, and said, "Well, take it."

Joe Rogan 20:43 Wow.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 20:43 "My grandson wants it, and, um, well, take it."

Joe Rogan 20:48 Wow.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 20:48 And I was like, "Oh, I was just showing... Like, f- okay. Uh, thanks, Grandpa."

Joe Rogan 20:55 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 20:55 Right? Like, uh, w- he just bought me a house? And, um, he, like, believed in me no matter what I did. I used to be one... a magician. I used to, like, love m- magic, right? So he'd always buy me magic shit and sit there and watch me do it in... He was such a fucking cool dude, man.

Joe Rogan 21:09 You used to do magic?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 21:10 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 21:11 Did you ever do shows?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 21:12 No, no. N- I mean, when I was, like, 12, 13, I, I would do shows to my grandma and grandpa and my friends, and I still have, like, a toolbox full of magic stuff. I should bust it out and bring it out here one time.

Joe Rogan 21:22 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 21:22 There's some cool, cool s- things, yeah.

Joe Rogan 21:23 You should. Are you good at it?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 21:25 Um, not, like, good, like, I w- you wouldn't be like, "Whoa, that was blue." But there's some, some of that sleight of hand stuff is pretty fun, and, like, the coin, coin magic is good and-

Joe Rogan 21:35 How do you keep this shit from going in your mouth? You just... 'Cause it doesn't... For me, it doesn't seem want to stay put.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 21:41 Well, you keep drinking on top of it. You gotta, like, bury it with your tongue-

Joe Rogan 21:43 All right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 21:43 ... and then drink over it.

Joe Rogan 21:44 Mm. (laughs) I'm trying.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 21:48 I fucking love it. So yeah, um, greatest dude, man. Taught me a lot. Taught me a lot about loyalty and respect, man. And, and I called my grandma on my way here today, and I said, "I'm gonna fucking set fire to this bridge to Jackson's," and she wrote me back and said, "Well, you need to, like... Are you attacking them logically, or are you out of anger? Which, which direction are we going here?"

Joe Rogan 22:16 Powerful, Grandma.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 22:18 Right?

Joe Rogan 22:18 On the ball.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 22:19 Which direction are we going?

Joe Rogan 22:21 Good way of thinking.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 22:22 And, uh, she said-

Joe Rogan 22:25 I should probably start spitting soon, huh?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 22:27 (laughs) Yeah, you gotta, you definitely gotta spit.

Joe Rogan 22:29 I didn't spit all last time.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 22:29 She said, "Make sure... You know, always in life, don't ever paint yourself into a corner." Like, these are major lessons she always gave me. "Don't burn bridges you can't cross."

Joe Rogan 22:37 Mm-hmm.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 22:39 But she told me today, "Fucking let it go. Let them have it." They, they, they want to step across the line. They drew the line in the sand. Let them want to burn their own... Make them feel so bad they want to burn their own fucking gym to the ground, you know?

Joe Rogan 22:51 Mm.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 22:52 It's like, to me, having the moment for Greg to say, "You know what, Wink? My name's on this fucking gym. Cowboy's been with me from the start." There's been times two or three camps ago where I've trained Greg maybe one or two times, and I still write him a check. I still write him a check, and I pay him because he got me into this motherfucker, and loyalty to me is the, the top, top of the line thing, right?

Joe Rogan 23:17 It's top of the m- line to me too. That's why you're here.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 23:19 Right.

Joe Rogan 23:20 And that's why they're not.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 23:21 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 23:22 And, you know, and it's unfortunate because I liked Greg a lot, and I, and I respect-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 23:25 I love Greg.

Joe Rogan 23:26 I don't know much about Winkeljohn other than his work-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 23:28 Right.

Joe Rogan 23:28 ... what he's done with Holly and a lot of other people. And, uh, I was real torn up about this. That's why I contacted you.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 23:34 Sure, sure.

Joe Rogan 23:35 You know, when y- when you told me that they were gonna-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 23:37 This is, like, a crazy scenario all around for everybody across the board. Like, wait, what are you... Like, what? What the fuck you mean? What's happening here?

Joe Rogan 23:44 Yeah. Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 23:45 You know, and... It's, it's, it's crazy. It's wild. I appreciate you sticking by my side. Um-

Joe Rogan 23:52 Well, it was a, it was a situation where I didn't know what to do.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 23:55 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 23:55 You know, I was like, I, I can't just ignore it.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 23:59 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 24:00 I would have to bring it up when they were here, and then I wouldn't get a full representation of it.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 24:04 Sure. I mean, uh, do you feel like you're getting a full rep- There you go. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 24:10 (laughs) I love it. I think I gotta figure out how to do this right.It's a skill you learn, how to tuck it in your...

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 24:16 Yeah, if you're-

Joe Rogan 24:16 And it's all over the place. It's in my mouth. Feel it.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 24:18 Mine's just in a little ball right here, I don't know.

Joe Rogan 24:21 Mine is not.

Narrator 24:22 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 24:23 Mine is not controlled. I'm gonna wind up swallowing this again.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 24:25 So if your name's on the, on the thing, like... Right? There you go. Put it... Spit it out.

Joe Rogan 24:31 (spits) I just don't have any control over it.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 24:32 Now, now you gotta open another beer and rinse it. You gotta give it a rinse.

Joe Rogan 24:36 A wrench?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 24:36 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 24:38 Oh, rinse. I thought you said wrench it.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 24:40 Yeah. Open a beer, rinse it out, spit it out. That way you don't get it any more swallowed. That way you're not sick again.

Joe Rogan 24:44 I wasn't sick last time. I was fine.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 24:46 Okay. Good, good.

Joe Rogan 24:46 It was weird. I swallowed the whole thing.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 24:50 Um... Fuck yeah. I missed you, man. I missed you. It's be- it's been a while.

Joe Rogan 24:57 It has been a while.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 24:57 So much has happened. I'm glad we got that kinda out of the way.

Joe Rogan 24:59 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 25:00 I'm sure I'll circle back on my drink a little bit more and...

Joe Rogan 25:01 Yeah. I'm sure too. It's, um... It's unfortunate. And I know what it must be like to try to keep the lights on in a big gym. And now they have dorms, it's huge. Giant-ass place, huge overhead, I'm sure. All these people coming in, coming out. And then, you know how fighters are. Not you, but some fighters, they don't give a fuck about loyalty. They just care about themselves, they're on their path. It's a...

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 25:21 Dude.

Joe Rogan 25:21 It's a very solitary, singular sport.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 25:22 And selfish. A very selfish sport.

Joe Rogan 25:24 You kinda have to be, right?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 25:25 Yeah. And I think that's kinda where the team got... Cowboy's really selfish, he has his own gym now. Well, I had to.

Joe Rogan 25:32 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 25:32 I fucking had to, man. For the better of my family and me, I had to keep evolving. I couldn't spiral down this drain with you guys.

Joe Rogan 25:41 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 25:41 You know? And now Michelle Waterson just built a new gym. She's doing the same thing in her backyard. Love her to death, you know.

Joe Rogan 25:46 She's doing that too?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 25:47 Doing it too. Her and her husband built a badass little gym all Onnit-

Joe Rogan 25:50 Has she decided to do that?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 25:50 All sponsored by Onnit, fucking-

Joe Rogan 25:52 Really?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 25:52 Yeah. It's bitchin', man.

Joe Rogan 25:53 Power on it.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 25:53 It's cool. Yeah. Good for her. Go you Michelle, whoop, whoop.

Joe Rogan 25:56 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 25:57 Um, you know. But if you look at the track record since Wink has taken over the gym, everyone's left. I mean, s- it's like, you don't see a pattern here, Wink? Like maybe you should change something up or just not allow

Joe Rogan 26:09 Well, he's been fighting for a long time.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 26:12 Sure.

Joe Rogan 26:12 And then training for a long time. I mean, he was a badass kickboxer before he ever got into training.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 26:18 Right.

Joe Rogan 26:18 And, you know, I think one of the things that happens with people, they just get this whole selfishness of the sport. It wears people down to a certain extent. There's camaraderie, but there's also selfishness. And they're all constantly going against each other.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 26:32 Sure.

Joe Rogan 26:32 And, you know, having a gym like that, the expenses, the overhead, and then, you know, dealing with people that are just grabbing, grabbing, grabbing. It just... It's gotta get overwhelming. And you see a guy like Mike Perry, who, you know, is a potential big star. He's a colorful kid, he's a knockout artist. He, he fucking loves to fight. If I was a coach, I'd be like-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 26:52 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 26:52 "This is the kinda guy I want in my gym." He's a fucking animal, you know. It's a, it's a great asset. I get it.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 26:58 And I'm, I'm super excited to fight him.

Joe Rogan 27:00 I know you are.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 27:00 Because this is one of those fights where we're gonna go in the middle of the ring and we're gonna, we're gonna fucking fight.

Joe Rogan 27:06 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 27:06 The old school fucking-

Joe Rogan 27:08 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 27:08 ... let's fight.

Joe Rogan 27:09 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 27:09 So, um, fucking, I'm pumped on it. I love the kid. You know, he's cool, he's crazy. Him and I would get along just great. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 27:17 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 27:17 We do. So, uh, I got nothing... Like I said, nothing about him or Frank. Frank is... Coach who... Well, that's what Perry's working with, with Frank, the... Another striking coach who-

Joe Rogan 27:26 Frank Lester.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 27:27 Lester, who is holding, holding the, the infrastructure of the gym together, almost single-handedly. You know, there's a co- a couple of wrestling guys and, um-

Joe Rogan 27:37 Is Brandon Gibson still there?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 27:38 Yeah. Brandon's still there. Brandon has a full time job. He just got promoted again, well, in his government job. He has like a real government job.

Joe Rogan 27:45 He has a job job?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 27:46 Job... Real-

Joe Rogan 27:47 On top of being a big time trainer?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 27:47 Super job. Yeah, yeah.

Joe Rogan 27:49 How the fuck's he do that?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 27:51 Man, I have no idea. He has like a nine to, nine to six job. (laughs) Maybe, maybe seven to six job.

Joe Rogan 27:58 Really?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 27:58 He's every morning up early, takes care of his family. He's a great dude. I got nothing bad... Nothing but love for Brandon Gibson, man. Nothing really. Him and I just separated only because I need to... I just want a different angle of striking. It wasn't... It was... I mean, it had nothing to do with, "He's a bad coach. I lost my fight, I'm firing you." It's just fucking... Just trying something new.

Joe Rogan 28:18 Mm-hmm.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 28:19 Just, just trying something new, that's all. Uh, but yes. Gibson's still there, but Gibson kinda just works, you know, with John Dotson, with Condit. Kinda... I mean, he doesn't have the time to go in there and just hold that gym together.

Joe Rogan 28:30 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 28:31 So he, um... Like I said, he has a real job and he just got another promotion. So he's like the top of the... He started off as a lifeguard, worked his way all the way up to the city. Now he's damn near governor.

Joe Rogan 28:40 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 28:41 (laughs) I think that's next. Governor is next for Gibson.

Joe Rogan 28:44 It's not hard. I had Gary Johnson in here. I think I could be governor in New Mexico.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 28:48 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 28:49 No, no offense, Gary.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 28:50 Well, let's legalize pot and, uh, mushrooms.

Joe Rogan 28:52 Is it not legal there?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 28:54 It's, it's recreational. I mean, it's um, medical right now.

Joe Rogan 28:57 You gotta have AIDS.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 28:57 Yeah. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 28:58 Is it one of those places?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 28:59 (laughs) It's one of those places.

Joe Rogan 28:59 You have to have AIDS. There's just a lot of places where you gotta have AIDS. Like that, that's so... That's how it used to be a lot of places. But like Vegas used to be like that, and now Vegas is Loosey Goose, open wide. Vegas got full on dispensaries.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 29:12 Man. Fucking Vegas, man. Vegas is definitely a two night town, man. It's-

Joe Rogan 29:16 Yeah. It's rough on the liver.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 29:18 It's rough on everything. Just... It just takes you-

Joe Rogan 29:20 (laughs) The soul.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 29:20 It takes you the fuck in, man.

Joe Rogan 29:22 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 29:22 I was just there last night. I was out there for a big Monster conference and it's just like, you, you sit in your room and you're like, "Well, I could just go down and, uh, gamble, I guess." And then you start gambling. Have you ever played Baccarat?

Joe Rogan 29:34 I don't play shit.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 29:35 I have never either and I decided we, we tried Baccarat. Like 007. I was like, "We'll be like 007. We'll go in there." I played with, with one of the higher ups in Monster and he took us down there and we played this game and, uh... Fuck, we won a shitload of money. A shitload of money. There was like five-

Joe Rogan 29:52 That's the trick.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 29:52 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 29:53 You want some of this?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 29:53 Yeah, I'll take some of that. I don't really smoke much pot, but-

Joe Rogan 29:56 Let's see.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 29:56 ... I'll do it just so I'm with you.

Joe Rogan 29:57 Take care with that.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 29:58 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 29:58 That stuff is... That they grew that on the moon.

Narrator 30:00 I saw a video of him breakdancing the other night.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 30:02 You breakdance?

Joe Rogan 30:03 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 30:03 I do. I used to. I used to really breakdance.

Joe Rogan 30:05 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 30:06 So I'm at the Monster conference...

Narrator 30:07 Did we lose the glass top?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 30:08 I'm at the Monster conference and, um, Monster now has a breakdancing team.

Joe Rogan 30:12 (laughs) They're what?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 30:13 Yes.

Joe Rogan 30:14 Monster got me some badass bags, man.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 30:16 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 30:16 Shout out to Hans.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 30:17 Hans... Yeah, Hans' a good dude, man.

Joe Rogan 30:18 (clears throat) He's a great dude.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 30:18 Yeah. He, uh, he takes care of... He takes care of a lot of people. Uh, again, the infrastructure of Monster-Great, right?

Joe Rogan 30:24 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 30:24 Great infrastructure for Monster.

Joe Rogan 30:25 Great, yeah. Oh, yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 30:26 So the ambassador, Hans, takes care of it, takes care of his people.

Joe Rogan 30:29 Loyalty, family, super friendly, great guy.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 30:30 Exactly, right? So, uh, I seen the Monster. I was gonna tell you, I seen the Monster bags laying back there, fucking ... (whooshing sound)

Joe Rogan 30:35 I just got 'em. Um, Gaston Bolanos. It was his idea.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 30:40 So-

Joe Rogan 30:40 A little bit more of that or you're gonna get crazy.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 30:42 Okay.

Joe Rogan 30:42 We'll start talking about space soon.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 30:46 (bell rings) Doing drugs with Joe.

Joe Rogan 30:47 It's not drugs. It's nature.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 30:49 You're right.

Joe Rogan 30:49 We're doing nature, bro.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 30:50 All right, I'm with you. Um, so the breakdancers, they start break dancing, and then halfway through their show, they stop it.

Joe Rogan 30:57 Look at this. (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 30:59 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 30:59 Ah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 31:00 So they, they set up a battle between t- me and this other guy, right? And we just have to go out here, and we have to breakdance. I used to breakdance back in... years ago.

Joe Rogan 31:08 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 31:08 But on a slippery floor with cowboy boots. And I didn't properly stretch.

Joe Rogan 31:13 (laughs) Yeah, that's not good.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 31:15 Oh, it was so fun, man. I, uh, I-

Joe Rogan 31:16 Look at you. (laughs) Cowboy boots.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 31:19 Yeah, cowboy boots, Monster shirt, getting down, doing a little breakdancing. It was so fun, man.

Joe Rogan 31:24 Look at you. (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 31:26 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 31:28 Dude, we have a bunch of guys from 10th Planet that started out as breakdancing, uh, Gio Martinez-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 31:34 It was your-

Joe Rogan 31:34 ... and Richie Martinez.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 31:34 ... core strength, everything about it.

Joe Rogan 31:35 Ba, ba, ba. Yeah, man. You can do-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 31:37 Insane.

Joe Rogan 31:37 ... a one-handed push-up with your foot, a one-handed handstand with your feet up in the air and you twist them around.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 31:41 Dude.

Joe Rogan 31:42 That's some crazy control over your body.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 31:44 It, it was-

Joe Rogan 31:44 It's like yoga on steroids.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 31:46 It's... It- it's so hard. It's so hard. It's, it's even harder to do after 12 years of never even doing it again. And then-

Joe Rogan 31:54 I'm sure.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 31:54 ... they're like, "And go." Like, "Oh-"

Joe Rogan 31:57 With cowboy boots on.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 31:58 We go. Here we go.

Joe Rogan 31:59 Yeah. Here we go. We had a bunch of these guys come in, and, uh, Eddie called me up. He goes, "Do, do, do, do, do." You know how Eddie gets crazy? He goes, "Listen, man, breakdancing, breakdancing, breakdancing is the thing. It's the thing. These guys are so fucking strong, I can't even control 'em. Breakdancers, man, these guys are like 140 pounds, and they're like... it's like ch- holding onto a live wire."

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 32:17 Yeah, I... Yeah, they're s- they're so strong.

Joe Rogan 32:19 Yeah. What is that guy's name? B-Boy Pocket Kim? Is that what his name is? What is his name? I've... I put him on my Instagram way back in the day. This is a Korean kid that is... it doesn't even seem like a human can do what he does.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 32:32 That's how I felt yesterday when those guys were dancing. I was like, "How are you doing-"

Joe Rogan 32:34 He spins all on one hand. He's on one hand, hopping up and down in the air and spinning around. And you're like, "Are those..."

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 32:41 You buy that?

Joe Rogan 32:42 Pocket Kim, yeah. Watch this motherfucker. This guy is such a beast. It's crazy to watch. There's a bunch of these guys now. They're con... There's, there's a Stance Elements.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 32:51 Oh, with the red shoes?

Joe Rogan 32:53 Is this one guy? Yeah. Look at this motherfucker. Look at this motherfucker. I mean, what the fuck is he doing?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 32:58 (sighs) It's called air tracks.

Joe Rogan 32:59 That is crazy.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 33:00 It's called air tracks, what he's laying right there. That's-

Joe Rogan 33:01 But that is crazy.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 33:03 Yeah, it's like flaring in the air. That, that is damn near impossible to do.

Joe Rogan 33:08 That guy is a freak.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 33:09 Yeah, he's doing air tracks.

Joe Rogan 33:09 He's the freak of all freaks. The... It's crazy what he can do. And there's a few of those guys. If you go to that Stance Elements. Click on that Stance Elements, Jamie. The, these guys are... There's... I didn't know about this until, uh, Tim Ferriss put it on his Instagram. He put Pocket Kim on, and then I, I went and watched these guys. These guys are doing just insane physical acrobatics along with music.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 33:34 But I feel like the kids now are doing insane everything.

Joe Rogan 33:37 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 33:37 Snowboarding, dirt biking.

Joe Rogan 33:39 Jujitsu, everything.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 33:40 E- everything is, is-

Joe Rogan 33:41 Mm-hmm.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 33:42 ... on a whole 'nother pl- playing field, right?

Joe Rogan 33:43 Mm-hmm.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 33:44 Yeah, they're-

Joe Rogan 33:44 And MMA fighters, these young guys that are coming in.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 33:46 Are, are not just o- solely one, one discipline, right? They have everything.

Joe Rogan 33:51 Right. Yeah, you s-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 33:51 They're MMA fighters.

Joe Rogan 33:52 You're seeing these new guy... Like, Zabit is one of my favorite guys to watch. Zabit Magomedsharipov. Say that five times fast.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 34:00 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 34:00 He's s... He, he... It's like these new high-level guys are coming in, and you, you're looking at 'em, you're like, "Oh, okay, we just hit the new evolution." There's a-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 34:08 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 34:08 ... new evolution going on with these young guys coming up. It's fascinating. I mean, but, uh, that's to be expected, right? With everything, I guess. Especially with social media. You get to see these guys, like on Instagram. You get to see the moves that that guy's doing. And all these other breakdancers get to see it. They would have to see it live.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 34:24 Right.

Joe Rogan 34:24 Now they're seeing it in Korea. They're seeing it in Japan. They don't have to travel, and they're seeing these moves, and they're trying to pick them up.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 34:28 You can slow it down, rewatch it, and learn-

Joe Rogan 34:30 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 34:30 ... and learn and learn, right?

Joe Rogan 34:32 It's a crazy time.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 34:33 Crazy (laughs) t... And not only, not only do we get to watch, but we also get the shit-ass guy in his basement that gets to talk shit about that.

Joe Rogan 34:40 Yeah, there's a little bit of that.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 34:41 A lot... There's a lot of it, that-

Joe Rogan 34:42 You can't pay attention to that, cowboy.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 34:44 I, I... It, it burns my soul.

Joe Rogan 34:46 Yeah, but you're too good to pay attention to that.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 34:47 I, I hate... I wish I was too good to say that. But I, I get... It's just like if I was coming here, and someone out in the parking lot said something to me, I'd say, "What the fuck?"

Joe Rogan 34:55 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 34:56 "What the fuck are you talking to like that?" You know? Like, we'd have-

Joe Rogan 34:58 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 34:58 ... it'd be a moment there, yeah.

Joe Rogan 34:59 Oh, yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 34:59 Yeah, so-

Joe Rogan 35:00 For sure.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:01 ... that's, that's how I still feel today. But, um-

Joe Rogan 35:03 Well, that's why you're a cowboy.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:04 Yeah, true.

Joe Rogan 35:04 That's why you're who you are.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:06 True.

Joe Rogan 35:06 You know what'll help you a little bit with this?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:08 Yes.

Joe Rogan 35:08 A little of that new mood?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:09 New mood, the- the super new mood.

Joe Rogan 35:10 Get you some of this super new mood.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:11 The super new mood. The super new mood.

Joe Rogan 35:12 (laughs) Get you some of the real new mood.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:13 That's it. That's a gift from me to you.

Joe Rogan 35:15 Thanks, sir. Appreciate it, brother.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:15 I'm, I'm glad you enjoyed that. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 35:17 Yeah, man.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:18 Um, your, your buddy Paul.

Joe Rogan 35:19 Paul Stamos?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:20 Paul Stamos in light... Fuck. Okay.

Joe Rogan 35:22 Woo.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:23 Let's, let's back this up. Let's-

Joe Rogan 35:24 Back it all up.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:24 ... let's, let's take, let's take this train back just a-

Joe Rogan 35:27 Beep.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:27 Yeah, just a little bit.

Joe Rogan 35:27 Beep.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:27 Okay.

Joe Rogan 35:28 Beep.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:28 So you speaking about DMT. I'm... Okay, let, let me... Let's back it up one more.

Joe Rogan 35:34 One more. Beep.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:35 I've never done any drugs in my entire life, ever.

Joe Rogan 35:37 You did a lot of drugs in here already. I did nicotine, you did alcohol.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:39 I did... We're back, uh, we're backed up. Remember, we're backed up.

Joe Rogan 35:42 Scooch.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:43 I've never done any drug ever. Never, ever.

Joe Rogan 35:45 What year was this?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:47 Two years ago.

Joe Rogan 35:48 Oh, you did booze.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:49 Well, I don't... That's a... That's legal.

Joe Rogan 35:51 Oh, legal.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:52 Legal drugs.

Joe Rogan 35:53 The law.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:53 Oh, duh.

Joe Rogan 35:54 Oh, it's under the law.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:56 Um...

Joe Rogan 35:57 You're a product of drugs.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 35:58 I am a product of drugs. Very-

Joe Rogan 35:59 This is not a bad drug.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 36:00 ... pharmaceutical drugs, right?

Joe Rogan 36:01 Budweiser's a fantastic drug. It's made for great jokes, fun times, right?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 36:05 I love it.

Joe Rogan 36:05 How many fucking good times-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 36:06 Hey.

Joe Rogan 36:06 ... have people had because of Budweiser?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 36:07 God bless you, Budweiser. Salud. So-

Joe Rogan 36:12 It's a good drug.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 36:13 I've never, I've never-

Joe Rogan 36:13 Well-regulated. You know, you know what one bottle does. That's what I like.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 36:17 Makes you want two.

Joe Rogan 36:18 Surprises. Yeah, but-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 36:18 You know what one bottle does? Makes you want two.

Joe Rogan 36:20 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 36:20 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 36:20 But that's, that's on you, man. One bottle. You gotta have some goddamn self-control. One bottle, you know what a bottle of Budweiser does. It's really clear.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 36:29 True.

Joe Rogan 36:30 It's like you eat a fucking pot brownie. Who... It could be anything, you know? You could be... You... Who knows what the fuck you're getting?

Narrator 36:36 They got that limit in Utah. Everything is 3.2%.

Joe Rogan 36:39 Poor people in Utah. You know, they're rebranding?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 36:41 They should pay more.

Narrator 36:41 I know.

Joe Rogan 36:41 Did you know the mor- Mormons are rebranding? I found out this last night.

Narrator 36:44 Oh.

Joe Rogan 36:44 They don't call them Mormons anymore. Eric Griffin was telling me calling a Mormon a Mormon is like calling a small person a midget.

Narrator 36:50 Wow.

Joe Rogan 36:50 Yep.

Narrator 36:51 What do you call them?

Joe Rogan 36:52 Uh, Latter-day Saints.

Narrator 36:53 Oh, wow.

Joe Rogan 36:54 Shout out to the Latter-day Saints. Magic underwear.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 36:56 Magic underwear? Goddammit. So no drugs, okay?

Joe Rogan 37:01 No drugs.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 37:02 Doc, he hear you talking about DMT. Everyone's on this DMT ride. You're sponsored by this little company called Onnit, which is now a fucking huge company, which I love. By the way, the gut health... Nah, nah.

Joe Rogan 37:13 Oh, yeah. Probiotics, man. Everything.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 37:16 That's my, that's my favorite. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 37:17 Do you eat kimchi or anything like that? You ever eat, uh...

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 37:19 No.

Joe Rogan 37:19 You should. You should. Get, get involved, get involved with some probiotics. You know, uh, uh, kefir is really good. Kimchi is really good.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 37:27 Now your people are like, "Oh, you're talking about your diet again." (laughs)

Joe Rogan 37:29 Oh, man, it's good, dude. It's good. People need to know. Like, you gotta take care of your internal, you know? But it's... You don't-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 37:35 I'm with you.

Joe Rogan 37:35 You don't see that gut health, man, but it affects your depression, your mood, the way your brain works, where your immune system functions. Gut health is everything. Those little Onnit packets are key, man. I don't-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 37:45 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 37:45 I don't travel without those bitches.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 37:46 I don't, I don't go a day without them.

Joe Rogan 37:48 I ate all my... I don't need-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 37:48 They're new pack-... They got new packets for them now. They're not-

Joe Rogan 37:50 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 37:50 ... in the same old box, more high-tech-

Joe Rogan 37:52 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 37:52 ... cool street-looking box now.

Joe Rogan 37:53 Well, they exist on the substrate that's in those capsules. That's one of the way- the ways you don't have to refrigerate it. It's so good for travel.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 37:58 Right.

Joe Rogan 37:59 'Cause y- it's just... I think you should have a variety of probiotics, but I think it's one of the most critical things that people don't think about. Anyway.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 38:06 Anyway.

Joe Rogan 38:07 So drugs.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 38:07 Drugs.

Joe Rogan 38:09 Drugs.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 38:09 Aubrey said, "Hey, why don't you come out? We got a little group of people doing some DMT."

Joe Rogan 38:15 Did he do the whole ceremony?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 38:16 Just music, chants, everything.

Joe Rogan 38:19 Eco rose.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 38:20 Everything. The th- the whole thing. We smoked tobacco out by the fire, talked about-

Joe Rogan 38:24 Oh.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 38:24 ... what we were gonna...

Joe Rogan 38:25 I wanna play some of that eco rose.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 38:27 Talk, talk about, talk about what direction we wanted this to go, you know, what, what, what we wanted the journey to consist of. Uh, I call my best friends up, take them with me, and we go out there, and we fucking... We do this. We sit in this room. We go through the chants and the ceremony. And I'm scared to death because I've never done anything, right?

Joe Rogan 38:49 You should be scared.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 38:50 Scared. Never done any... I wish... That's it. Waking, waking up the spirits. (laughs) You just have that? That's your... That's on the...

Joe Rogan 39:05 Oh, dude, this can take... This can make me trip. If I listen to this, if I eat a pot brownie, listen to this, and get in the tank, I'll start tripping.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 39:13 All right.

Joe Rogan 39:16 'Cause when you do DMT and you're... And you hear this, they dance for you.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 39:21 Right.

Joe Rogan 39:21 The whole... The, the experience. You realize what this is? This is like a technology to maximize DMT.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 39:27 And while, while you're on this DMT, this is playing in the background-

Joe Rogan 39:32 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 39:33 ... on a, on a drum and chants, and yeah, that's... (laughs) That's what's going on. I wasn't in a super spooky night camera room like this, but it was... You know, it was... Aubrey has a nice...

Joe Rogan 39:46 He knows what the fuck he's doing.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 39:47 He knows what the fuck he's doing.

Joe Rogan 39:49 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 39:49 You know, the...

Joe Rogan 39:50 He's doing it the real way. Like, he might be a beautiful man.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 39:52 You feel really spiritual in the room.

Joe Rogan 39:55 Yeah. He might be a beautiful man with a beautiful body, and looks like he's running a sex cult, but what he really is doing is doing it the right way.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 40:02 You say it looks like-

Joe Rogan 40:03 But legitimately, legitimately doing it the right way.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 40:07 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 40:08 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 40:08 I can maybe sell the ranch to Aubrey and the sex cult.

Joe Rogan 40:11 Well, listen, Aubrey and I are partners.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 40:14 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 40:14 We'll talk after this podcast is over. I just need to know what kind of zoning you have and whether or not you have water on the property.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 40:19 There we go. I do.

Joe Rogan 40:20 Make sure you have water. You got a well?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 40:22 I have a well. Two wells, actually.

Joe Rogan 40:26 So what happened?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 40:27 All right. So this music is playing. They load the pipe, which to me lo- looked like pink cocaine, right?

Joe Rogan 40:32 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 40:32 Like dust, pink dust. They load it in this pipe, and he says, "Just light it, and you wanna breathe fresh air out of the corner of your mouth," like, as you're taking this harsh smoke in.

Joe Rogan 40:44 Smells like burning plastic.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 40:45 Oh, it gets... It's, it's harsh. And he says, "Just hit it until you can't anymore." I'm like, "What the fuck does that mean? I feel like I can hit this forever." So I hit it, and I hit it, and then all of a sudden, I say, "Oh, you hit it until you can't anymore," and he starts getting wavy, and then I just... The pipe falls out of my mouth, and I fall back. The entire world comes, like, zooming into me, like, maybe like, whoa, pitch black, and I shoot through this fucking kaleidoscope of colors, maybe 10 seconds, and blow out the top like Superman out of, out of the top of this tube of color into pitch total black darkness. And I'm looking at myself from, like, the third person, and I'm just hovering in midair, and everywhere that I've ever been injured or hurt is glowing bright, like, super white, like the whitest white fire I've ever seen. Like, my head's on fire, my arms and fists are... And I feel like something out of a fucking movie. I'm just suspended in air, burning, and I keep, like, asking myself questions. And then, and then I don't know if, if it's me, but I answer back to myself, right? And I'm bugging the fuck out because you can still hear this music going. I can hear the people giggling next to me. I can hear the next guy lighting the lighter, and he's now going. And meanwhile, I'm just burning, and I'm talking to myself about whatever question I answered, right? And then all of a sudden, just as fast as I came in, I kind of... Eyes woke, and I woke up, and I still see the rest of the guys in the room 'cause they, like, systematically go around the room in an order. They're in, they're in, they're in, she hits. Now the pipe comes around again, and now it's my turn again. Now I'm really excited. I almost wish halfway through the trip you could fucking hit it again and go back in.So, I hit it and this time, I'm thinking, "Yeah, I-I wanna go back to that again. I wanna go back to where I just was." So, I fucking hit the pipe, hit the pipe, hit the pipe. Now, I hit the pipe so goddamn hard and I hold my breath, I fall over to the side. I fido- fall to my left side and I'm tipped over. Well, I sit back up because you're still there, right? You're not, like, in another dimension. You're not out of your body experience. So, I sit back up, but the entire trip now is sideways. And I'm looking at my, this trip, I'm looking at crazy black rainbows and I can't explain what the fuck a black rainbow looks like, but they're waving with sparkles and black into a keyhole that's turned sideways, and through the keyhole are crazy light, shapes, and darts. And every time I almost get to this keyhole, it just sucks back more. Something's gotta remove that... Yoink. And then I crawl to it again, I try to get in the keyhole and it sucks back again. And there was no words spoken. This one, it was me just trying to get to this sideways keyhole and I'd just get my hand to crawl through it and it would fucking take off again. And I woke up. And that was, that was my DMT experience.

Joe Rogan 43:54 You've only done it once?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 43:55 Only done it one time. I wanna do it again.

Joe Rogan 43:57 Yeah, you need to do it again.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 43:58 So, they talk about marijuana-

Joe Rogan 43:59 We should do it together.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 43:59 Okay. Done. They talk about marijuana being a gateway drug. Um, no, DMT is a gateway drug for me.

Joe Rogan 44:07 What's a gateway dru- drug too?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 44:09 It allows you to do other drugs, and now I do a lot of mushrooms.

Joe Rogan 44:13 Well, it's one of those things, wh- it lets you know that all your ideas about what drugs are, are out the window.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 44:20 Right.

Joe Rogan 44:20 All your idea, all y- all your ideas about what reality is are out the window because you didn't think that this was a part of reality. How could anybody ever think it before you experience it?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 44:31 But what I don't get is things that sh- shapes and colors that I couldn't... Almost like you don't see today, where I could see them there.

Joe Rogan 44:41 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 44:41 And I could have exp- Like, the shapes and the movements, it was just so weird. Like, you're right, like, reality is, like, "What the fuck?"

Joe Rogan 44:48 How is that reality? And it seems more vivid than reality.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 44:52 More vivid. But the cool thing I wanna tell people listening, like, you can just open your eyes, right? I mean, you would be real hazy and kinda gone, but I could open my eyes. I could see the candles burning over there. I could hear lighters going. And then you're like, "Oh, I'm, I'm okay. I'm not in another dimension."

Joe Rogan 45:08 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 45:08 "I'm not gonna get stuck in this crazy other world."

Joe Rogan 45:11 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 45:11 And then I'd close my eyes and then I'd go back into it.

Joe Rogan 45:13 Mm-hmm.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 45:14 And... Yeah, you're... Y- I mean, it's like the most, the realest dream you've ever seen, right?

Joe Rogan 45:21 Yeah. There's another one called 5-MeO-DMT, 5-methoxy-DMT and it's, uh-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 45:27 Is that the one we're doing tonight?

Joe Rogan 45:28 ... different. That's a different one. (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 45:30 W- the, well, that, that one makes people really scared. No.

Joe Rogan 45:33 That's a different one because you just, you just, you cease to exist on that one.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 45:36 Right?

Joe Rogan 45:37 It's more powerful, actually.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 45:38 Jesus.

Joe Rogan 45:38 More, more potent. Yeah, which is crazy to think. There's something more potent than DMT, but it's more psychoactive in some ways and it's, uh, it's one of those weird ones that doesn't have visuals either, but you just go to, you go to everything. You go to heaven.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 45:52 Dude.

Joe Rogan 45:52 You, you become a part of it all.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 45:53 It was just how, it's crazy how clear and sense you could make of the unsenses, right? Like, I try to explain now and it, it sounds weird, but when I was in it, it's like, "God, everything's so clear."

Joe Rogan 46:06 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 46:07 Right?

Joe Rogan 46:07 But you realize how much of what's holding you back in this life is like insecurity and fear and, and, and it, it just, just not knowing, you know, and, and confusion and all this. And then it just sort of like pours water on the stuff that's dirty and cleans-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 46:24 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 46:24 ... all the bullshit out and goes, "No, it's all love."

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 46:27 Right.

Joe Rogan 46:27 "It's all happiness, friends, experiences, life, camaraderie." Those are the important things. That's the... You have a part- You have a chance in this life to spread more of that and ke- help other people spread more of that and keep this ball rolling. And that could really change the world. It changes the world because the people that you impact ripple out and they, they impact-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 46:45 Sure.

Joe Rogan 46:45 ... other people. Or you could just get caught up in arguing with people online. You know, you can get caught up (laughs) -

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 46:50 (laughs) You can get caught up in the water, over the dirt, and just the chaos of it all. It doesn't take much to get me caught up, so they-

Joe Rogan 46:56 But that's also why you're a great fighter, you know? The, those things go hand in hand. If you're a person who just accepted bullshit, maybe you wouldn't be the guy that gets up in the morning when you don't want to.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 47:04 True.

Joe Rogan 47:04 Maybe you wouldn't be the guy that takes those fights on short notice and goes, "Fuck it." Maybe you'd be the guy that would be like, "You know what? This is not the right move for my career."

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 47:12 Right.

Joe Rogan 47:12 "I have to sit back. I have to..." You're not a, you're, you're a wild man and that's why people love you, but that's also... That needs to be kinda... It needs to be, uh, appreciated, but also managed.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 47:22 Right.

Joe Rogan 47:22 Like, the chaos of your personality and, and how you approach things. I mean, you almost fucking died in a cave for some-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 47:28 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 47:29 ... time, bro. I mean-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 47:30 That-

Joe Rogan 47:30 ... this is what you do, right?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 47:32 That's, that's my other drug, adrenaline.

Joe Rogan 47:34 Yeah, yeah. You gotta-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 47:35 Adrenaline, man.

Joe Rogan 47:36 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 47:37 It, uh...

Joe Rogan 47:37 The things that people are scared of, you flock to.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 47:41 Yes.

Joe Rogan 47:41 It's like you wanna prove that you're not scared of them. What-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 47:43 And I am. I'm just as scared as you are.

Joe Rogan 47:45 Sure.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 47:45 Like skydiving. I love it because it's like, "Woo."

Joe Rogan 47:50 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 47:51 And we go.

Joe Rogan 47:51 Yeah. Y- there's no, there's no if, ands or buts when you jump out of a fucking plane.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 47:55 I'm flying planes now. Getting my pilot's license.

Joe Rogan 47:57 Really?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 47:58 Yeah, I'm, I'm putting... I've... I started a little while back. I quit for a while, but now I'm, I'm back, I'm all in, I'm flying, and, uh, I'm loving it, man. I'm-

Joe Rogan 48:07 I was just telling you, I watched that Lynyrd Skynyrd documentary last night.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 48:09 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 48:09 Don't, don't fly a shitty plane. That's how we lost Lynyrd Skynyrd.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 48:13 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 48:13 They, they needed to get their fucking plane fixed. Drugs.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 48:18 I mean, drugs.

Joe Rogan 48:18 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 48:18 Fucking drugs.

Joe Rogan 48:19 Fucking pill heads, man. Speed it up.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 48:20 The next time I'm on in two years and I come back, I'll be fly- I'll fly out here, man.

Joe Rogan 48:24 Yes (laughs) .

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 48:24 I'll fly out here.

Joe Rogan 48:26 Yeah, man. Uh-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 48:27 It'll be so, so wild, man.

Joe Rogan 48:28 That's a, that's a bold move, man. Learn how to fly. I mean, that's the ultimate, right?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 48:33 S- that's, that's, that's, uh-

Joe Rogan 48:34 I enjoyed drinking beer with you, buddy. This is-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 48:36 Me too, brother.

Joe Rogan 48:36 ... we could see a little campfire. We could fucking set, we'll slice some deer.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 48:39 Exactly. We should. We should definitely do that one of these days.

Joe Rogan 48:42 You should come to us, uh, to Lanai with us.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 48:44 Okay.

Joe Rogan 48:44 You would love it, man. It's the craziest hunting ever. And it's like one of the most ethical... You have to kill them.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 48:49 Sure.

Joe Rogan 48:49 There's 30,000 deer on this one island. Three... No, 20,000 deer and 3,000 people.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 48:54 Let's, let's touch that, uh, little subject for a minute about we now have to kill these animals. Why? Because there's so many people out there that are like, "Fuck you, hunters."

Joe Rogan 49:04 Well-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 49:04 "What are you doing?"

Joe Rogan 49:05 Well, it's-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 49:06 "Why, why would you wanna take a life?"

Joe Rogan 49:08 Yeah. Well, the, the Lanai is a different example because th- it's an island.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 49:11 Sure.

Joe Rogan 49:11 It's a 200 island filled with deer and there's no wolves and there's no mountain lions. Like s- people have to eat them. They're fucking everywhere.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 49:16 Yeah. Because if they don't-

Joe Rogan 49:17 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 49:17 ... they're just gonna-

Joe Rogan 49:18 They'll overpopulate. They'll get sick.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 49:19 Then they're gonna die. Yeah. Of course.

Joe Rogan 49:21 Yeah. Yeah. But y- yeah, I mean, I think the, the hunting thing, the anti-hunting thing is probably real similar to what we're talking about with psychedelic drugs. It's people who haven't experienced it, they don't-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 49:31 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 49:31 They don't know what it-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 49:31 They're set in their ways.

Joe Rogan 49:32 Yeah. They don't know what it really is. And they s- a lot of them still... I mean, 97% of the people in this country eat meat. Th-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 49:38 I'm one of them.

Joe Rogan 49:39 Yeah. That's-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 49:40 I love it.

Joe Rogan 49:40 That's a crazy number, but you think about how many people get hated on for hunting. That means, for sure, some of those people that are hating also eat meat, which is one of the most-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 49:48 Of course they do. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 49:49 ... crazy hypocrisies ever.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 49:51 C- crazy, right?

Joe Rogan 49:52 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 49:52 I mean, when you look at it like that.

Joe Rogan 49:54 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 49:55 With the numbers.

Joe Rogan 49:55 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 49:56 'Cause they are. They're like, they... As they're eating their hamburger, on the same breath, they're telling you what a piece of shit you are for killing ducks.

Joe Rogan 50:02 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 50:03 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 50:04 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 50:06 And-

Joe Rogan 50:07 It's disconnection.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 50:07 Do you think vegans, um, if a mosquito lands on them, do they, do they slap it and kill it?

Joe Rogan 50:11 I talk about that all the time. Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 50:13 And do they kill mice that are nibbling in the corner of their house and making noise so they can't sleep? Do they set a mouse trap out?

Joe Rogan 50:18 That's a good question. Some of them-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 50:20 Or do they shoot, do they shoot the fly with the badass new salt fucking shotgun?

Joe Rogan 50:24 The salt guns are the shit. (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 50:26 Ooh, are you... Me, I'm picking them bitches up. I ain't even let... (laughs)

Joe Rogan 50:28 I open the door and let them ruff them in from the horse shit. Come on in, boy. They got-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 50:33 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 50:33 ... they got a little bit of-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 50:35 Blap.

Joe Rogan 50:35 ... a little bit, a little blapping to do in here.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 50:37 Blap. Blap.

Joe Rogan 50:37 So, uh-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 50:38 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 50:38 Yeah. Do they... I mean, does, does-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 50:39 Some of them do.

Joe Rogan 50:40 Does a mosquito or a fly not have a soul?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 50:42 I went to an ashram once and, uh, the lady had, uh, ant spray out.

Joe Rogan 50:46 Uh-huh.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 50:46 And I was like, "What are you doing with that?" She's like, "Oh, we have an ant problem here." I go, "You got an ant problem here?" (laughs)

Joe Rogan 50:51 I go, "So you kill them with the spray?" I go, "That's fucking crazy." This is an ashram.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 50:55 Right?

Joe Rogan 50:55 This is a Buddhist ashram and you, you are spraying ant spray. You're poisoning. Death from the sky.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 51:02 From the sky.

Joe Rogan 51:02 Yeah. You're like, you're fucking s- air warfare on these-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 51:05 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 51:05 ... poor little beings 'cause you don't like that they get too close to your garbage.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 51:10 (whistles) Hey.

Joe Rogan 51:11 It's heavy.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 51:12 It's heavy. It's crazy. When, wh- when you put it in perspective like that-

Joe Rogan 51:15 Mm-hmm.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 51:15 ... they don't have an answer. They're like, "Whoa, whoa."

Joe Rogan 51:17 What do you do when you wash yourself? What about all those microbiome on your body? You're killing all that shit with soap.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 51:21 With soap.

Joe Rogan 51:23 What are you doing?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 51:23 What are you doing?

Joe Rogan 51:24 It's a holocaust.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 51:25 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 51:25 Every time you wash your asshole, it's a holocaust. You're killing all these life forms.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 51:30 Right.

Joe Rogan 51:30 Right? There's no th- no if, ands, or buts. Every... I mean, it's just a matter of what li-... And then the other problem is there's real evidence that somehow or another, plants communicate with each other. That they have-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 51:42 Of course.

Joe Rogan 51:42 ... some sort of an, if not awareness, they have some sort of, uh, information exchange between each other. And they change their taste based on whether or not other ones are getting eaten. It activates certain responses in the plants and they, they become like really bitter and disgusting to animals so that animals don't eat them.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 51:59 Right.

Joe Rogan 52:00 You know, and they do this with like... They can have a recording. They can play-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 52:03 Sure.

Joe Rogan 52:03 ... a recording of caterpillars eating leaves next to a plant and it'll change its flavor profile. It excretes some sort of a chemical so that-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 52:08 It's the same.

Joe Rogan 52:09 ... it discourages predation. You know, there's some intelligence to those things.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 52:12 But that's just... I think that's just evolving, right?

Joe Rogan 52:14 Mm-hmm.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 52:14 It's having to. It's like, "Ooh."

Joe Rogan 52:16 Yep. Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 52:16 "Ooh, we're, we're doing... We're, we're no longer gonna exist if this happens. We have to, we have to evolve with the change." Which you talk about us becoming who we are today-

Joe Rogan 52:26 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 52:26 ... from F- from super primates to, to... Right?

Joe Rogan 52:29 Uh-huh.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 52:29 And I think now, we're caught in an era where the weak are still allowed to coexist with us.

Joe Rogan 52:38 (laughs) Yeah, there's a little bit of that. They don't wanna be weak.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 52:41 And it drives me fucking cray.

Joe Rogan 52:42 They can't help it.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 52:42 They don't wanna be weak. Right.

Joe Rogan 52:43 They can't help it.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 52:44 But, but... Yeah, you laugh at that-

Joe Rogan 52:46 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 52:46 ... but it's true.

Joe Rogan 52:47 Yeah, yeah, yeah. True.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 52:47 It's true.

Joe Rogan 52:48 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 52:48 And I just had a baby boy and I can't wait to stand on the sidelines of these soccer games and-

Joe Rogan 52:55 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 52:55 ... football games. And I can't wait to show up to fucking track day and I'm bringing fucking medals and trophies because my kid's not getting a fucking participation ribbon.

Joe Rogan 53:05 Ah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 53:06 He's here to win. Right? We're, we... When do we draw the line back of, of... You don't just, just because you are weaker, you, you get a participation ribbon? There's no more competition and, and-

Joe Rogan 53:18 Well, there's no understanding of psychology. You can't protect people from bad feelings like losing. Those... That's what propels you.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 53:24 And-

Joe Rogan 53:24 That's what makes you better.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 53:25 ... that's what we're... that's what they're doing. So-

Joe Rogan 53:27 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 53:27 ... you're telling me if my kid's an awesome, awesome football player and he's on the team running touchdowns, he has to sit the bench because Tommy didn't get enough time to play? And not only that, Tommy, you're his weak ass dad who fucking secretly emails the coach behind my back?

Joe Rogan 53:42 Ah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 53:43 Oh. You know what I mean?

Joe Rogan 53:44 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 53:44 Like that shit to me... What the fuck?

Joe Rogan 53:47 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 53:48 So, I, I can't-

Joe Rogan 53:49 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 53:49 I'm so excited to, to, to join this new, new journey of-

Joe Rogan 53:53 Parenthood.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 53:54 ... parenthood. It's so-

Joe Rogan 53:55 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 53:55 ... crazy, man, these kids. And-

Joe Rogan 53:57 This is not all parents though. You know, some parents realize how stupid it is. There's parents out there just like you.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 54:03 Sure.

Joe Rogan 54:03 They're just like, "This is ridiculous."

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 54:04 Ridiculous.

Joe Rogan 54:04 Like kids have gotta... This is a guy that's, uh, his, his daughter goes to school with, uh, my daughter and, uh, I always gravitate towards him 'cause he got a neck tattoo.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 54:13 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 54:13 Like immediately I'm like, "Anybody-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 54:15 I...

Joe Rogan 54:15 ... with a neck tattoo, I'll relate to this motherfucker."

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 54:16 Well, because that's a life decision.

Joe Rogan 54:18 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 54:18 Yeah. You're... You neck tat, you... Motherfucker, we gonna be all right because we're, we're... I don't have a neck tat, but-

Joe Rogan 54:24 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 54:25 ... I know how you're living. So I'm with you. I'm with you.

Joe Rogan 54:27 And these kids were playing rough and, and he looked at me, he goes, "What ever happened to like getting hurt?"

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 54:31 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 54:32 "What ever happened to like falling down and learning how, oh, well, you shouldn't do that. That hurts."

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 54:36 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 54:36 "Well, now learn how to fall better. Now learn how to not-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 54:38 (laughs) Yeah.

Joe Rogan 54:38 ... do that anymore. Well, this, this thing was gonna make you slip and scuff your knee. It's okay."

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 54:43 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 54:43 Like that's part of learning. You can't nerf the world.You can't nerf the fucking world. When you nerf the world, and then you empower these people that have lived in a nerfed environment, that's a problem. They haven't experienced real adversity, and they're mean.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 54:56 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 54:56 And one of the reasons why they're mean is 'cause they're scared.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 54:58 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 54:59 Like, a lot of these, these people on social media that are really mean, they're the ones who are the most scared, and they're the ones who are the m- most weak, for sure. And th- the fact that they're so vulnerable is what's leading them to lash out and try to hurt other people, 'cause they're so easy to hurt.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 55:15 Of course.

Joe Rogan 55:15 And they're so damaged. And that's, that's literally a, the, the results-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 55:20 But how-

Joe Rogan 55:20 ... of living in a nerfed world.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 55:21 But e- e- these people that you say are so weak, how is that satisfying them to disable somebody that-

Joe Rogan 55:29 It's not. They don't know what to do. They're, they're hurting, and they just lash out.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 55:32 Like, how, how are they writing an email, like-

Joe Rogan 55:34 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 55:34 ... "I'm gonna get this motherfucker. Send." And they're like, "Ooh," and then they see this ... Like, what? That-

Joe Rogan 55:39 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 55:39 That's gratifying for them? They're like, "Oh."

Joe Rogan 55:41 Th- It's not even. It seems like it would be, because they're just t- they're trying to hurt you. They're trying to, like, get you. But then it eventually comes back and gets them. It's like, they have to understand, LeBron James isn't doing that.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 55:53 No.

Joe Rogan 55:54 (laughs) Like, no winners are out there doing that. This is loser behavior.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 55:58 Yes.

Joe Rogan 55:58 Like, you, you're lashing out at others who are doing while you're not. Unless there's like... If you have a legitimate-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 56:05 But, but the-

Joe Rogan 56:05 ... problem with someone-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 56:06 ... you talk about LeBron, like, w- In the NBA, they don't just sit him down because the other d- player 22-

Joe Rogan 56:13 Hasn't got enough playing time.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 56:14 ... hasn't got enough play time.

Joe Rogan 56:15 Right. Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 56:16 No.

Joe Rogan 56:16 No.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 56:16 "Motherfucker, go ahead and score again."

Joe Rogan 56:18 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 56:18 "Okay? We with you right here."

Joe Rogan 56:19 Yeah, yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 56:19 "We, yeah."

Joe Rogan 56:19 We gotta make some money.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 56:20 Right? It's good, it's good in the, when-

Joe Rogan 56:22 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 56:22 ... when we're paying to watch it on TV, but-

Joe Rogan 56:23 Mm-hmm.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 56:24 ... when your kid's in it, I, I don't get it, man.

Joe Rogan 56:26 Mm-hmm.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 56:26 But I haven't experienced it yet. I've j- only had friends who have, so I'm fucking so excited to ...

Joe Rogan 56:31 It's fascinating just to watch them evolve, watch their little minds grow, watch, talking to them, you know, just experiencing life through these new eyes and seeing them learn things.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 56:39 He's definitely gonna be a little fighter. He's a just a rotten-

Joe Rogan 56:42 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 56:42 ... son of a bitch.

Joe Rogan 56:42 Of course.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 56:42 He sleeps with his hands up.

Joe Rogan 56:44 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 56:45 And we have this ... He sleeps with his hands up, both hands up. I'm like, "What are you doing?"

Joe Rogan 56:49 Oh.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 56:50 And then he just, like, flexes them out, and he'll put them back, and he flexes them out. I'm like, "What are you doing, man?"

Joe Rogan 56:54 He's getting ready. (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 56:54 It's so cool.

Joe Rogan 56:55 Loosen it up.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 56:56 And I put him in this little jumper, and he has two, he has a blue frog and this red fish. And I don't know what this red fish did to him, but that motherfucker would just slide sideways and just look stank on him out of, for ... just sit there and stare at him.

Joe Rogan 57:07 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 57:07 20 minutes. No movement, no crying.

Joe Rogan 57:10 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 57:10 Just slouched over, and he, and he corner peers at this red, at this red fish. And he's just ... And I'm like, "What? Dude, what are you doing?" And he, you know, and I'll like, and I'll spin him and, like, play with him, and then he just f- finds him again and just has a staring contest with this fucking thing.

Joe Rogan 57:24 That's hilarious. He's practicing.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 57:26 He's practicing. Like, damn.

Joe Rogan 57:27 Wow, I think that shit definitely carries on through the child.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 57:30 It has to, right?

Joe Rogan 57:31 It has to.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 57:31 It has to.

Joe Rogan 57:32 It has to. I mean, there's only ... Th- there's things that people learn, like, well, why are kids scared of monsters? Well, it's just, you have to be careful of predators.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 57:39 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 57:39 You know? It's one of those-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 57:40 Of course.

Joe Rogan 57:40 It's ... There's, there's lessons you learn. You see things that are scary. Like, why do people have like a fear of snakes? Why do peop-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 57:46 Are we out of beers? This is the last one?

Joe Rogan 57:47 No, we got a whole shelf in the back.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 57:48 Oh, perfect. Okay. We got-

Joe Rogan 57:51 These Budweisers go down so smooth.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 57:53 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 57:53 They do go down so smooth. It's ... Yeah. I mean, I think y- for sure that some of your personality is gonna be transferred through your DNA. Your life lessons.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 58:01 God, I can't wait, man. I'm so excited.

Joe Rogan 58:03 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 58:04 So cool to see, see him, and, uh-

Joe Rogan 58:08 How early are you gonna start training him?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 58:09 Right away.

Joe Rogan 58:11 So he never knows anything else?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 58:12 N- He's ... And, and not only, Joe, is he not gonna ... he's g- not gonna know anything else, but we're dirt biking, we're wakeboarding, we're fucking scuba diving, we're ... Every crazy thing I do, he's gonna do, and he's gonna be fucking launching huge air, and he's gonna get around his other kids, and he's just gonna think that's just what you do.

Joe Rogan 58:31 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 58:31 Like, this is-

Joe Rogan 58:32 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 58:32 "Oh, you guys don't do that?"

Joe Rogan 58:34 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 58:34 "Oh, that's ... I've been doing that for five years."

Joe Rogan 58:37 That's what he says. "We do." Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 58:37 Yeah. That's what I thought. It's just so... He won't know any different. And, um, yeah, I'll, I would definitely train him in wrestling and jujitsu and kickboxing. Absolutely. Absolutely. And I'm gonna be the dad, when he goes and beats a kid up at school, I'm like, "What? Danger, you fucking animal. How could you?"

Joe Rogan 58:57 His name is Danger? Your son's name is Danger?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 58:58 His first name's Daxon. Now, my name's Donald Anthony Cerrone, so his name's D-A-C, my initials, and then S-O-N, so he's my son. Danger Cerrone. Daxon Danger Cerrone.

Joe Rogan 59:08 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 59:08 And I'm gonna say, "Danger, what are you doing in here? You can't be beating these kids up. And then as soon as we get in the hallway, fucking fist bump, whatever you want, boy, let's go."

Joe Rogan 59:16 Ah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 59:17 (laughs) That's gonna be ...

Joe Rogan 59:18 Well, you already have evidence now on video.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 59:20 That's right.

Joe Rogan 59:21 My parents are gonna go, "You need to watch this video."

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 59:23 Yeah. I mean, that's ... If, if, if he's in there, you know, defending his sisters or doing whatever he has to do, I'm with him.

Joe Rogan 59:30 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 59:30 Get you some, boy.

Joe Rogan 59:32 What's gonna, the world gonna be like just when he's-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 59:35 In 10 years.

Joe Rogan 59:35 Yeah, when he's d- Think about how weird it is from 10 years ago, how weird is gonna be 10 years from now?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 59:39 Well, I remember in my high school, we had beepers.

Joe Rogan 59:43 That's right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 59:43 Beepers.

Joe Rogan 59:44 You remember when people had beepers that also could send text messages? Like, what the fuck? You're taking it too far.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 59:49 And I had a vo- I could leave a voice message on mine.

Joe Rogan 59:52 Oh, yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 59:52 You could talk in voices, you could call in and do it. But yeah, I mean, these kids, your kids are, have no idea what it is to pass a note.

Joe Rogan 1:00:00 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:00:01 Or call, um ... Uh, Mr., um, Mr. Rogan, um-

Joe Rogan 1:00:08 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:00:09 I was, I was just wondering if, uh, I could talk with Sarah. Would that-

Joe Rogan 1:00:13 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:00:13 ... be cool?

Joe Rogan 1:00:15 Ah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:00:15 It's after nine o'clock, idiot. Click.

Joe Rogan 1:00:18 Yeah, that after nine o'clock deal.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:00:20 Right?

Joe Rogan 1:00:20 Yeah. You have to be-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:00:21 Now they're just-

Joe Rogan 1:00:22 ... real careful what time you call.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:00:23 Texting-

Joe Rogan 1:00:23 'Cause this set a bad precedent.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:00:25 Picture taking. But I think the-

Joe Rogan 1:00:26 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:00:26 ... picture taking has also taken a lot away from life. Like, even me, I get caught, and I'll go to lunch with three of my friends, and two minutes into lunch, we're all on Instagram.

Joe Rogan 1:00:35 Yep.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:00:35 Who's Rogan got on the show today? You know? (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:00:38 Yeah. Yeah. I know. It's, it's, it is a problem. You, you lose a lot of your life to these fucking things.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:00:44 A lot of it.

Joe Rogan 1:00:45 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:00:46 And, and it sucks you in. But it's also so awesome, because-So much is learned, like you said.

Joe Rogan 1:00:51 It s- it needs to be managed. It needs to g- like, I don't think most people-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:00:55 Like I said, right now, if you wanna talk about ... We were just discussing the different kinds of, um, releases on the bow.

Joe Rogan 1:01:01 Right.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:01:03 Well, maybe, I don't know about you. I c- literally, two seconds after I leave here, I can YouTube it and I can, I can-

Joe Rogan 1:01:08 You know it all.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:01:09 I can know it all.

Joe Rogan 1:01:10 Yeah, it's crazy.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:01:10 I can have experts on every single release, make my own judgment-

Joe Rogan 1:01:14 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:01:14 ... and decide what I wanna do.

Joe Rogan 1:01:15 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:01:16 And that's crazy nowadays, you know? And that's ... The world is so much better in a sense, I think, because you can do that. But it takes away a lot of the bullshit people used to have. Do- probably when you were in school and the guy tells you, "I'm this, this, this, and this-"

Joe Rogan 1:01:32 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:01:32 ... there's nobody-

Joe Rogan 1:01:33 No Google search.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:01:34 ... oth- other than Jimmy saying, "Uh-huh. Yeah. I was there."

Joe Rogan 1:01:38 Yeah. Yeah. (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:01:40 Right? (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:01:41 Yeah, you never knew. Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:01:42 Never ... Now, you just go ahead, like, "Wait, wha- ?"

Joe Rogan 1:01:46 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:01:46 "Nah, man. That, uh-"

Joe Rogan 1:01:47 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:01:48 "... that's, that's negative. You, you are not a gold medalist." Right?

Joe Rogan 1:01:53 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:01:53 Right? (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:01:53 Well, you'll still see some of those guys. They're still floating around. There's a few of those guys that are still floating around-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:01:58 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:01:58 ... that, that somehow or another made it through the net, and they're like-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:02:01 (laughs) The dark ... They came into the dark net.

Joe Rogan 1:02:03 They're floating around right now, like, k- kinda like skating on the boundaries of incredulity. There's-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:02:09 It's so bizarre.

Joe Rogan 1:02:10 Yeah, there's a lot of frauds out there. They're still, still kinda operating.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:02:14 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:02:15 Fake black belts, fake gold medalists, fake ... Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:02:19 Why would you wanna be a fake black belt?

Joe Rogan 1:02:21 They don't know any better. They just, they just been lying their whole life mostly. It's like the demons that you experience when you do mushrooms, they got their own demons. And, you know, maybe it was childhood molestation.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:02:32 You think, so you think those people that lie, that it's just nat- that's just what they do?

Joe Rogan 1:02:36 They were probably beaten as kids. Their parents were shit. Everybody lied to them. They lied to everybody.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:02:40 But why does it have to be that person? Why does it have to be that person? Why does ... Why, why can't it be the rich kid that was born in Beverly Hills that has everything?

Joe Rogan 1:02:48 And he lies, too?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:02:49 He's still a liar. He's still-

Joe Rogan 1:02:50 Could be, too.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:02:50 Why can't he be a pi- just as big of a piece of shit as them?

Joe Rogan 1:02:52 He could be, but I bet a lot of those, uh, like, real severe liars-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:02:56 (clears throat)

Joe Rogan 1:02:56 ... they come from abuse, 'cause they have to, like, create a false life. But you get a lot of abuse in rich households, too.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:03:01 Sure.

Joe Rogan 1:03:02 Especially, like, even though maybe the dad has to work 16 hours a day as a banker or something like that. He's never home. The mom's on drugs. No one's taking care of the kids. They're hanging around with a bunch of other lost kids in their school, and they're all doing drugs together and fucking off and-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:03:14 (laughs) Right.

Joe Rogan 1:03:15 ... there's crime and all kinds of shit just to be- just to have e- excitement in their life 'cause they're so bored and confused and lost and lonely, and they start lying, too.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:03:24 Right.

Joe Rogan 1:03:24 A lot ... I mean, it all comes from the same place, whether it comes from a rich kid or a poor kid. It comes from your life being fucked up and you, you not, you not liking who you are, you know?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:03:34 So, you need to eat mushrooms.

Joe Rogan 1:03:35 That'll help.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:03:36 And deal with the demons.

Joe Rogan 1:03:37 Deal with the demons. And then go do something. Go do something so that you know that you could, you could e- experience some nerves, you know, and, and you could, you could rise to the occasion.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:03:47 Sure.

Joe Rogan 1:03:48 You know what I mean? And learn about yourself that you can overcome, that you can make mistakes and fail, and then try it again and succeed. And then what ... The, the bad feelings that you get, like, when you're worried about losing, you know?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:04:00 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 1:04:00 And these, these, these fears. It's because winning is so high, man. I've seen you win so many times. I've called so many of your fights. And, you know, I look right in your eyes whenever you win, and there's-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:04:10 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:04:10 ... this psycho... Like, "This dude's on fire right now."

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:04:12 I love it.

Joe Rogan 1:04:12 He's just like-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:04:12 There's no other ... I c- I couldn't even explain to you that feeling, because-

Joe Rogan 1:04:18 No one can.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:04:18 ... nobody can.

Joe Rogan 1:04:19 No one can.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:04:20 It is like-

Joe Rogan 1:04:20 You have to do it.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:04:21 Other than, "Fuck! Fuck yeah!" Right? Like, that's-

Joe Rogan 1:04:25 Right. (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:04:25 ... the, "Fuck yeah!" That's the feeling.

Joe Rogan 1:04:27 (laughs)

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:04:27 You know what I mean? Like, that's-

Joe Rogan 1:04:29 But it's "fuck yeah" times like a million.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:04:31 Woo.

Joe Rogan 1:04:31 You know?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:04:32 You know? And, and, God, it's, it's the highest highs, man.

Joe Rogan 1:04:35 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:04:35 It's just insane how, how cool it feels. Um-

Joe Rogan 1:04:39 I've seen, like ... W- with you particularly, like, KOs.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:04:43 Right.

Joe Rogan 1:04:43 Like, there's something about KOs when you just crack someone and then it's over, and then you're, you're walking around and like-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:04:48 (sighs)

Joe Rogan 1:04:48 You're, you're like glowing. Like-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:04:51 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:04:51 ... you're like-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:04:52 Yeah. I'm in my DMT f-

Joe Rogan 1:04:55 You did it.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:04:55 (sighs)

Joe Rogan 1:04:55 Yeah, you did it. You went through all the fucking demons and all the darkness and all the fear and all the insecurity, and then you landed, and then it's over.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:05:04 And then it's just as fast as it started, it's over, and that's crazy. It's like-

Joe Rogan 1:05:08 Yeah. Yeah, it's over.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:05:09 ... whoo, and now you're back.

Joe Rogan 1:05:10 And then, and then it's like, "Hey, four weeks from now, blah, blah, blah fell out."

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:05:14 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:05:14 What are you gonna do? Like, we're gonna fucking do it again.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:05:16 We're, we're gonna start over.

Joe Rogan 1:05:18 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:05:18 We're gonna start all over. And then people are always asking me like, "How, how long are you gonna fight till?" I'm gonna fight till I don't love it anymore, Joe. I really am, man. That's ... I don't have an answer for anybody. Like-

Joe Rogan 1:05:27 It's a good answer.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:05:28 The day that I wake up and I'm like, "Nah, uh-uh."

Joe Rogan 1:05:34 What we need is medical science to catch up, where they could fix everything 100%.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:05:38 Right.

Joe Rogan 1:05:39 Like head injuries-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:05:40 Everything.

Joe Rogan 1:05:40 ... node injuries, everything. Just put, put people in some sort of microwave machine, where they just, "Whrr. Bang."

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:05:48 Ding.

Joe Rogan 1:05:48 Bring you back to 100%. Thank you, sir. So then fighting becomes a matter of temporary injury rather than permanent injury.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:05:56 And then it's a whole, and then it's a whole nother-

Joe Rogan 1:05:58 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:05:59 ... ball of wax.

Joe Rogan 1:06:00 It's a whole nother ball of wax.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:06:00 'Cause everyone's fighting 100% healthy.

Joe Rogan 1:06:03 Yeah, and you also don't have to worry about, like, your long-term health, which is, like, one of the big problems with fighting.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:06:09 Yeah, you're like, "You wanna arm bar me and break it? Great."

Joe Rogan 1:06:11 Yeah.

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:06:11 Did you see the guy who got his motherfucking arm bar cracked the last fight? Um, was it last Friday?

Joe Rogan 1:06:17 Who?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:06:17 Lincoln, Nebraska.

Joe Rogan 1:06:18 I didn't see it. Who got arm barred?

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:06:20 (sighs) A guy from Colorado.

Joe Rogan 1:06:22 I watched the Cross fight-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:06:23 God, I feel like such a shit-

Joe Rogan 1:06:24 ... and I watched the-

Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone 1:06:24 ... 'cause I don't