The Joe Rogan ExperienceJRE MMA Show #79 with Vinny Shoreman & Liam Harrison
CHAPTERS
- 0:03 – 2:03
Birthdays, aging pains, and getting injured in embarrassing ways
Joe welcomes Liam Harrison and Vinny Shoreman back and immediately riffs on birthdays, getting older, and how silly injuries happen outside the gym. Liam jokes about pulling a muscle while bowling, and they compare it to Joe’s own random injury moments.
- •50th birthday banter and ‘you don’t look your age’ jokes
- •Liam pulls a muscle bowling despite being an elite fighter
- •Joe shares how a serious neck tweak happened in the shower
- •Discussion of stiffness from travel, sitting, and hectic schedules
- 2:03 – 4:44
Lomachenko’s insane record, Luke Campbell’s toughness, and Vinny’s A&E visit
The conversation shifts to boxing—especially Lomachenko’s amateur record and the discipline required to make weight so many times. They praise Luke Campbell’s performance against Lomachenko, then Vinny recounts injuring his groin lifting weights and heading to A&E (ER).
- •Lomachenko’s amateur/pro accomplishments and weight-cut longevity
- •Luke Campbell’s distance management and ‘warrior’ grit
- •Vinny’s ‘fan girl’ moment at the fight and the long travel day
- •A&E explained; Vinny’s groin strain from lifting and quick medical access
- 4:44 – 8:42
Hot yoga reality check: toughness, hydration, and sauna-like benefits
Liam reports taking Joe’s hot yoga suggestion and being shocked by how hard it is, especially compared to fight training. Joe explains why he loves it (even high), and they dig into hydration and research comparing hot yoga’s effects to sauna use.
- •Hot yoga humbles high-level athletes (balance, endurance, mental grind)
- •Joe’s ‘feel every muscle fiber’ explanation and mind-body connection
- •Hydration strategies during hot yoga (large water intake)
- •Harvard/sauna parallels: inflammation reduction and mortality correlations
- 8:42 – 13:33
Knee surgery, NHS wait times, stem cells/peptides, and Vinny’s hip limitations
Liam details a meniscus injury that locked his knee, leading to surgery and a rapid return to fighting—plus frustration with delays in public healthcare. Joe discusses stem cells and peptides like BPC-157, while Vinny shares long-term hip rotation issues and a leg-length discrepancy complicating rehab.
- •Meniscus ‘bucket handle’ style locking injury and extreme pain
- •Private vs public healthcare timing; long waits as a downside of socialized medicine
- •Joe’s stem-cell success story for chronic knee swelling
- •BPC-157 discussion (tendons/ligaments) and Vinny’s hip/leg-length problems
- 13:33 – 16:16
Fighting for ONE Championship and adapting to small gloves
Liam explains why he loves ONE Championship and wishes it arrived earlier in his career. They talk rule sets (kickboxing vs MMA gloves), how small gloves change impact and cuts, and Liam breaks down a fight where one defensive habit cost him the outcome.
- •ONE Championship production quality and career opportunity timing
- •How bouts get set as kickboxing-glove vs MMA-glove rule sets
- •Small gloves: sharper impact, more cuts, different defense requirements
- •Liam’s mistake using long guard; one knockdown swung the scoring in a 3-round fight
- 16:16 – 19:24
Bare-knuckle boxing, Lethwei, and why ‘no gloves’ sounds better than it is
Joe brings up the Paulie Malignaggi vs Artem Lobov upset to illustrate how equipment changes outcomes. They discuss bare-knuckle’s growth (especially in England), Lethwei’s headbutts, and the brutal reality of cuts and hand damage that changed Joe’s mind about removing gloves in MMA.
- •Malignaggi vs Lobov: skill vs format adaptation
- •BKB’s popularity surge in the UK and why audiences crave ‘less rules’ violence
- •Lethwei as an extreme rule set (headbutts) and notable fighters/seminars
- •Cuts and hand trauma as the biggest argument against going gloveless
- 19:24 – 22:51
Small gloves, instinct under pressure, and unlearning bad habits
They widen the lens to MMA examples (e.g., elite kickboxers getting clipped) and how small gloves punish tiny mistakes. Joe and the guests explore why fighters revert to ingrained habits when chaos hits and why it’s harder to ‘relearn’ than to learn correctly from scratch.
- •MMA examples of ‘anyone can get caught’ with small gloves
- •Defense systems that work in big gloves can fail in tiny gloves
- •Instinct overrides new tactics under pressure; comfort habits return
- •Teaching issues: retraining karate mechanics into Thai-style kicking
- 22:51 – 24:11
Legendary kick power and style translation: Cro Cop, Hoost, Aerts, and MMA variables
Joe uses Mirko Cro Cop’s iconic body-kick damage to highlight how certain styles and physical traits translate across rule sets. They compare explosive strikers to methodical technicians and discuss how different rules (clinch, elbows, takedowns) radically reshape what ‘best striking’ means.
- •Cro Cop’s terrifying body kicks as the gold standard example
- •Explosiveness vs methodical technique in cross-sport success
- •Why some elite kickboxers might struggle more in MMA contexts
- •Rule-set variables: clinch limits, elbows, takedowns, and rhythm changes
- 24:11 – 31:27
Dutch/Moroccan evolution, Badr Hari vs Rico, and PED talk
Vinny explains how Dutch-style kickboxing has evolved, especially via Dutch-Moroccan fighters with sharper boxing, knees, and new angles. They pivot to Badr Hari’s return and rematch with Rico Verhoeven, including the controversy around testing and the obvious ‘Instagram physique’ jokes.
- •Shift from classic Dutch combos toward more intricate, knee-heavy attacks
- •Dutch-Moroccan pipeline and why those fighters are ‘lethal’
- •Badr Hari’s layoff, rematch questions, and strategic concerns vs active Rico
- •Testing controversies and humor about visible PED use
- 31:27 – 53:57
Sparring smarter: reducing damage, preserving longevity, and S&C integration
Liam explains how he’s changed his sparring approach—less hard kick sparring, more controlled work—to extend his career and avoid accumulating injuries. Joe ties it to Thai play-sparring culture and broader training philosophy (flow, playful learning, and building athletic balance).
- •Hard kick sparring risks: accidental clashes, foot/knee injuries, escalating intensity
- •Play-sparring still develops timing/vision with far less wear-and-tear
- •Thai and jiu-jitsu ‘play to learn’ mindset vs ego-driven gym wars
- •Strength & conditioning and mobility work as the missing longevity lever
- 53:57 – 57:19
Running vs joints: low-impact options, sport-specific conditioning, and ruined knees
They discuss how fighters adapt conditioning as their bodies age—switching from outdoor roadwork to treadmills, sprints, and low-impact machines. Joe brings up examples like Kamaru Usman’s knee issues and emphasizes that endurance can be built many ways, but knee preservation is critical.
- •Low-impact conditioning tools (special treadmills, bikes, climbers)
- •Why fight conditioning is burst-based vs long slow runs
- •Outdoor running’s knee cost and why many fighters abandon it
- •Examples of elite cardio without running; balancing performance and durability
- 57:19 – 59:26
Ultra-endurance mindset: Cam Hanes, Courtney Dauwalter, and mental toughness
Joe detours into ultra-running to illustrate extreme human endurance and the psychology of not quitting. The story of Courtney Dauwalter’s minimal sleep and massive winning margins becomes a case study in mental resilience that impresses even hardened fighters.
- •Colby Covington training with ultra-runner Cam Hanes
- •240-mile races with near-zero sleep and what that implies about grit
- •Courtney Dauwalter winning by huge margins and racing while impaired
- •Contrast between ‘tough-looking’ personas and real endurance toughness
- 59:26 – 1:02:02
MMA cardio, Ortega’s work rate, and the many ways to win (or lose)
Liam describes pad work with Brian Ortega and how MMA conditioning (especially from grappling) can be on another level. They discuss strategy choices—why fighters fall in love with striking—and how MMA’s multiple win conditions also multiply the ways things can go wrong.
- •Ortega’s relentless pace and improved conditioning post-Holloway
- •Wrestling/grappling as a unique cardio engine builder
- •Strategic temptation to chase KOs instead of using best skills (Ortega’s BJJ)
- •MMA volatility: dominant striking can be erased by a quick submission
- 1:02:02 – 1:06:39
Camp structure debates: S&C-heavy approaches, sparring needs, and ‘levels’ lessons
Joe outlines competing training philosophies—like Marinovich-style camps prioritizing conditioning—while Liam argues vision/timing must be tested near fight time. They connect this to Anthony Yarde’s preparation rumors and the shock fighters feel when they meet truly elite opponents.
- •Two schools: skill-first vs conditioning-first camps and why both can work
- •Liam’s ‘eyesight’ (timing/reads) as a key readiness indicator
- •Anthony Yarde sparring controversy as a cautionary tale
- •Learning ‘levels’ through experience: Liam’s first big step-up loss as a teenager
- 1:06:39 – 2:36:53
Thailand life: Cambodia boxing chaos, Thai gambling rules, cheating, and Saenchai’s longevity
Liam tells wild stories from Thailand—being pushed into a pro boxing match in Cambodia with dubious officiating and mismatched weights. The discussion expands into Thailand’s stadium gambling culture, dirty tactics (liniment on gloves, alleged poisoning), why Saenchai can thrive at 40, and how ONE Championship may shape the sport’s future; they close by circling back to boxing megafights and pound-for-pound debates.
- •Cambodia pro boxing story: last-minute deal, weight confusion, bizarre counts and restarts
- •Bangkok vs Phuket fighter depth; fighting frequently just to survive financially
- •Thai stadium gambling as the only legal betting outlet; incentives that distort sport integrity
- •Saenchai’s style, low-damage approach, and star power model; ONE’s growth + kickboxing popularity problems; boxing talk (Joshua–Ruiz, Lomachenko footwork/dance, Crawford/Spence, Hagler debate)
