Modern WisdomAnnihilating The Culture - Ryan Long | Modern Wisdom Podcast 345
EVERY SPOKEN WORD
150 min read · 30,001 words- 0:00 – 0:32
Intro
- RLRyan Long
What about a parade for dudes that bust quick? Like, that- that's what-
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs) The premature parade.
- RLRyan Long
I got... Yeah, yeah. The premature parade.
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- RLRyan Long
And, like, I identify, that's my orientation, where girls are like-
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- RLRyan Long
... "Why's your busting so quick?" And you're like, "Wow. That is... You're gonna shame my identity like that." (wind blowing)
- CWChris Williamson
Ryan Long, welcome to the show.
- RLRyan Long
We're here. Yeah, yeah. I, I thought we were recording. I was, I was trashing everybody in the industry. I was fucking, I was getting into it, dude. (laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
You're in full flow already. Yeah,
- 0:32 – 4:08
Andrew Cuomo's Daughter is 'Demisexual'
- CWChris Williamson
you're right. Trending headline right now, big headline, Andrew Cuomo's daughter has come out as demisexual. Did you see this?
- RLRyan Long
Yeah, she's hot too. Did you see her?
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah, it's weird.
- RLRyan Long
Yeah, yeah. Um, uh, demisexual is, like, the, that's the epitome of, like, I want in the club. And you go, "I don't know if I'm..." You know, "Are you gay?" No. And you go, demisexual is the, the funniest one, like-
- CWChris Williamson
You change nothing.
- RLRyan Long
... where you're like, "Yo, I'm interesting."
- CWChris Williamson
You change nothing at all.
- RLRyan Long
You change nothing. Yo, you go, "I'm, I'm attracted to, like, people's personalities or something." (laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs) So, for the people that don't know, it's like, uh, they only feel sexually attracted to someone when there's an emotional bond. Like, how that qualifies as an orientation.
- RLRyan Long
Yeah, honestly, I feel so... Uh, you know, I'm just, uh, I'm sad that she had to go through that. And, um, you know, coming out of the closet, that's hard for people. You know what I mean? When you come out and you go, "Listen, I am attracted to people who I like their personalities." (laughs) And everyone's like, "Oh, my God." Like-
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- RLRyan Long
... "Your life has been so hard."
- CWChris Williamson
Shocking.
- RLRyan Long
"Take, they should make a separate parade for you. They need a, they need a demi bri- a de- demi pride parade." (laughs) Do you know what was making me laugh? The idea of... Do you know how there was an article saying that they have, they're going to have kink in the, like, whether they should have kink for ki- like, in the pride parade? You know, like, the guys' ball. I wanna go, I, I wanna do a street thing where asking people if, like, wearing the leather and stuff, saying that, uh, we're trying to campaign to get kink at the Thanksgiving Day parade. So... (laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs) You got the turkeys all dressed up in leather.
- RLRyan Long
(laughs) Yeah, yeah, yeah. We think that that's the only reason to go. But the demi parade, they need their own parade. That's, um, it's a tough affliction.
- CWChris Williamson
Well, it says everything now, right? That, like, demisexual is, is, like, the biggest counterculture that you could have. Like, that you actually have to take a little bit of time before you get involved in some sort of sexual explicitness.
- RLRyan Long
Yeah, yeah. I mean, I don't know if they take time, they just have to like the personality. I think you could still be a ho and be demi.
- CWChris Williamson
Oh, okay.
- RLRyan Long
(laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
That's... All right, yeah, yeah. That's interesting. So, it doesn't actually need to take time to get the emotional bond. You just need to like their personality.
- RLRyan Long
What about, uh, a parade for dudes that bust quick? Like, that-
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs) The premature parade.
- RLRyan Long
I got... Yeah, yeah. The premature parade.
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- RLRyan Long
And, like, I identify, that's my orientation, where girls are like-
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- RLRyan Long
... "Why's your busting so quick?" And you're like, "Wow. Wow. That is... You're gonna shame my identity like that."
- CWChris Williamson
Well, what about the alternative? What's, like, the opposite of a demisexual? Like, the guy that will just sleep with anything, doesn't care at all? If the person that wants to wait and needs the emotional connection doesn't sleep with the person that wants to fuck them within three seconds, is that discrimination?
- RLRyan Long
Yeah. Well, no. And, and, what, what I'll tell you is probably the best way of describing all this stuff is it's all, like, girl stuff. You know? And even, like, the dudes that are on board with it, it's girl stuff. So, it's like, what she did was essentially they've taken a really long route to, like, have a, a term for just, like, what every girl a little bit is. You know what I mean? So, it's like, the, the, uh, l- th- the, this demisexual is the end of the line where now every single girl can have, like, an interesting term.
- 4:08 – 13:12
Ryan's Thoughts on 'OnlyFans'
- RLRyan Long
yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
If you were a girl, do you reckon you'd do OnlyFans? 'Cause I spend far more time than you'd expect thinking about whether or not I'd do OnlyFans if I was a girl.
- RLRyan Long
Really? Well, you can as a guy, right? But there's, like, a wage-
- CWChris Williamson
It's different.
- RLRyan Long
Only, there's the guy wage gap, right?
- CWChris Williamson
It's... Yeah, there is. There's a gender wage gap. Terrifying.
- RLRyan Long
Yeah. Do you know what else there is? That, I, I've been talking about this on stage. But there's a, there's a red hair wage gap, I don't know if you know that.
- CWChris Williamson
More or less.
- RLRyan Long
Where people with red hair make less money. They make less money. And some people think it's 'cause of the jobs they take. Like, there's less money in being a carnival operator or backyard wrestler or, uh, biting the heads off chickens. But, um...
- CWChris Williamson
I thought...
- RLRyan Long
(laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
I thought the-
- RLRyan Long
(laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
I thought you meant that they made specifically less on OnlyFans. That people were like, "I don't wanna see that ginger pubic hair."
- RLRyan Long
No, they make less money just in general. But I identify as part of the community. I have a few reds in my beard. I think you probably do too, right?
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah, me, me too. Me too, yeah, exactly. We're a very, very ostracized people.
- RLRyan Long
Uh, I don't know if I would, to be honest. I, I mean, it's hard to... I, I think I always had this conversa-... It's always funny to, like, that conversation, like, if I was a girl. And people always say this with races, right? They're like, "If you were a Black guy, like, would you think like this?" And I'm like, "Well, am I still me or am I a different guy?"
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- RLRyan Long
Like, 'cause if I'm still me, like, I have a pretty contrarian, like, personality. Like, my guess would be that I would find myself, like, in whatever counterculture, you know, surrounded me then. But if, like, if you're like, "Well, you're, uh, you have a different brain," well, then you're like, well, yeah, then, yeah, I'd be different in that scenario if I'm a different guy. (laughs) But with a girl, if I, if I'm me, I think that I'd be a, you know, probably doing some version of comedy or, you know, something like that as a girl.
- CWChris Williamson
What-
- RLRyan Long
But if I'm, like, some... Yeah, so it's hard to say 'cause if, if I'm me still, probably not. But...
- CWChris Williamson
What's the... Is there a difference in male comics and female comics in terms of what they get paid?
- RLRyan Long
I mean, why, why do you, why don't you get into your opinions on that? (laughs) No, I mean is there a difference in terms of how much they get paid? Yeah, not this evening. Not this time, I don't think-... yeah, yeah. There's guy comedy and, (laughs) and we go, "Okay, guys. Uh, I hope you had fun at that person. Now we're going to do the, uh, there's some girl comedy persons show." (laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs) Oh, shit. I didn't know. I didn't know that it was that bad.
- RLRyan Long
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
I mean, when you think about the Netflix specials and stuff, not a massive amount of women on there.
- RLRyan Long
No, ............................ I think that, um, I think that, uh, there is, like, a difference in if you're masculine versus feminine, like, how you do well. But it's the same thing in real life, you know what I mean? If, uh... I mean, there's, you're commanding a room full of people, you know what I mean? So it kind of is just like a masculine art form to begin with. And people are comfortable hearing a, a woman talk about different things than a man. And there's, there's, there's... Like, here's a perfect example. Like, if you were at, like, a, a bar or something like that and some girl comes up to you and kind of, like, makes fun of you, you might not feel something about that, right? But if a guy came up to you and he kind of, like, tried to just come out of nowhere and take a dig at your personality or something in front of your chick, you're like, "Yo, what the..." Like, so there's just different... You know, the girl, a girl could come steal your hat at a bar and it's not going to be a fight, whereas a guy can, right? But then there's vice versa with that, right? So on stage, it's the same thing. Like, everyone is willing to, like, take, take different, uh... You know, you're allowed to kind of do different things based on, like, the culture of... People that are on dates, right? So if you're a girl, you want to make sure that girl doesn't think you're, like, trying to steal her dude. And there's... If you're a guy, the same thing, right? So there's, like, just these, all these, like, dynamics that are no different than real life.
- CWChris Williamson
Demisexual, that's the solution. Everybody stay demisexual and then you're all safe from it.
- RLRyan Long
It literally solves all problems. And it solves the problems of, if every girl is in, like, the victim class, then, you know, you kind of, you know, don't really have to hear it about it anymore (laughs) because it's just everyone.
- CWChris Williamson
That's true. I had this quote. Uh, Carl Benjamin, guy from Over Here, said, "In the same way that constant access to porn is deforming men's expectations of women, OnlyFans is deforming women's expectations of men." That was something that I'd never really thought about, the fact that the way that the girls that perhaps do OnlyFans or maybe have a friend that does OnlyFans, or even a friend that, I don't know, is on the, the outside, you know, they just do foot stuff maybe, or, I don't know, something else-
- 13:12 – 18:07
Crypto
- RLRyan Long
- CWChris Williamson
Have you got any money in crypto?
- RLRyan Long
Yeah. I got like, I don't know, like 30 grand or something.
- CWChris Williamson
All right. Have you learned anything over the-
- RLRyan Long
I just have a-
- CWChris Williamson
... the last year? 'Cause it's been-
- RLRyan Long
I just have Ethereum and Bitcoin. Dude, my body just fucking made a fortune sh- like, sh- he went long Bitcoin, short Dogecoin, and like short, like le- mad, like, leverage short of Dogecoin. And like, but it, but he, he, he, uh, uh, what do you call it? Um, hedged it by, by having long Bitcoin in his mind, but that trade he like destroyed on. But no, I kind of, I kinda just have probably like 70% Ethereum, 30% Bitcoin. I just have it... So, I think my buddy said this and I maybe agree a little bit. I'm sure like if you're, like, you know, you're into crypto more that it might sound stupid, but it is to me a little like of a f- like fashion. It's almost like a little fashionable. And I think I agree with that. But, you know, I don't have like some crazy percentage of portfolio in there or something. What? You b- is that, are you like a big, big fan of crypto?
- CWChris Williamson
No, not at all.
- RLRyan Long
I think you talk about-
- CWChris Williamson
Not at all. No.
- RLRyan Long
Oh.
- CWChris Williamson
I, I've got like a few grand in that was like FOMO coin. I just thought, "Right, I've, I need to put something-"
- RLRyan Long
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
"... I need to put something in because everybody else is talking about it."
- RLRyan Long
Yeah, you do.
- CWChris Williamson
Managed to snipe, not quite at the top, but not far off the top on a buy. And I'm like, "Right, okay, well this was, this was a fun way to lose five grand."
- RLRyan Long
Yeah, and you got your cut too whilst you were at the top. (laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah. It's a fun way, fun way to lose five grand. (laughs)
- RLRyan Long
I did, I just did a... I just did a sketch, um, e- uh, Elon Musk groupie support group about like all the dudes there were just like... You know what I mean? Just hanging on his word. And he don't even move the markets anymore. So, I, that's, uh, I did that with... So my bu- that guy Danny, I was just, just managed him, he runs, he... We used to, I used to run, uh, the video department and I was part owner of this website called The Hard Times, and they have a website called The Hard Money, which is like a financial satire site. It's pretty funny. Still we're doing it. It's like a collaboration with those guys.
- CWChris Williamson
That's pretty cool. Did you see, uh-
- RLRyan Long
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah, it's interesting-
- RLRyan Long
I'm not gonna... I'm just leaving it. I, like, I, I don't, I haven't sold it. I didn't even... I bought it on Coin, like, uh, Coinbase. Like, like those fees are so ridiculous too. Like, but I was just, because my, all my banking is so screwed up just 'cause like I immigrated here not long, that long ago. And there's just so... Uh, it's like, I literally was just like, "Screw it. I'll take a hit." And I just like, when it, when it was down a lot, I bought, you know, I just kind of bought in and I'll probably leave it for 10 years or something. I'm not gonna think about it.
- CWChris Williamson
It's weird to me because so many of the people that are passionate about Bitcoin or blockchain or whatever just seem to be passionate about making money. But it's all guarded-
- RLRyan Long
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... underneath like, "Yeah, man, but decentralized, it means that the people in the Third World can make their payments from wherever they want." It's like you don't care. You don't care about people-
- RLRyan Long
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... in Ghana being able to send money back to their grandmother.
- RLRyan Long
(laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
You care about the fact that it doubles every couple of months.
- 18:07 – 23:43
John McAfee
- RLRyan Long
like a lot going on, right?
- CWChris Williamson
Man, I watched this documentary-
- RLRyan Long
But-
- CWChris Williamson
... this like miniature documentary on YouTube about John McAfee.... last night. Have you looked at this?
- RLRyan Long
Yeah, no, I-
- CWChris Williamson
Have you looked at all of this shit? It's crazy.
- RLRyan Long
(laughs) I used to pay attention to him. He was the man. So, the John McAfee stuff's wild, yeah. And he legitimately said, you know, and this isn't getting any coverage because of whatever, you know, maybe while I'm in my little, you know, circles of getting coverage but (laughs) to, to the real world, the guy ... Well, yeah. Here, you, you can ... I don't know if you were gonna, like, intro it or whatever. But-
- CWChris Williamson
You go away, man. You tell, you tell the story. I'll jump in.
- RLRyan Long
Yeah. So, so, McAfee, he, you know, he invented Mac, um, uh, McAfee Antivirus, became a big guy. Then he became, like, "I'm gonna be the exposing government secrets guy." He was paying money on the dark web to get all this stuff, went to jail in Mexico. And there's lots more to that. But he was, like, heavy on the podcast scene. Like, he was out there saying, uh, you know, conspiracy stuff, or however you wanna put it. And then he made all these videos in jail being like, "I'm ... would never kill myself." Like, he has a tattoo. He goes, "This is a tattoo that says I would never kill myself. I love my wife, I love my life, and I'm still in perfect mental state, but I have a feeling they're trying to ..." And he just kept making these videos being like, "They're trying to kill me. I will not kill myself." And then the next day they're like, "Suicide." (laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
John McAfee-
- RLRyan Long
Yep.
- CWChris Williamson
... found dead in Barcelona or something.
- RLRyan Long
He's com-
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah. Fuck, man.
- RLRyan Long
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Did you see ... So, I watched this, Jake Tran is a YouTuber. He makes sick sort of short documentaries. If anyone wants to find out more about this-
- RLRyan Long
Okay.
- CWChris Williamson
... McAfee situation, I'll put the, uh, find the link and put it in the show notes. Um, he made the antivirus software in a day and a half.
- RLRyan Long
Really?
- CWChris Williamson
Took him a day and a half to code it. And within a month, four million companies were using it. And then within two years, half of the Fortune 500 companies had it on their, on their computers. And it took him a day and a half. And then he got ... Some-
- RLRyan Long
Wow.
- CWChris Williamson
Some guy that he lived next door to supposedly poisoned his dogs, and then the next day that guy was found dead. And John McAfee was like, "Don't know what you're talking about. Don't know what you're talking about."
- RLRyan Long
Oh, my God.
- CWChris Williamson
"Nothing to do with me."
- RLRyan Long
I didn't know that part of the story.
- CWChris Williamson
Wild man. He was in some, some cri- not Venezuela, but some equally mental country. And, uh, yeah. And then he had Shwacked, didn't he? Hash, like, dollar sign whacked on his, uh, tattooed on his arm, and that was a- also his crypto that you could buy, but it was, "I'll never be killed." And then the final thing was he said, um, he tweeted out that 16 terabytes of government secret data is going to be released, and, "I can't stop it if anything ever happens to me."
- RLRyan Long
If he dies.
- CWChris Williamson
But that hasn't come out yet.
- RLRyan Long
Which, that sucks. Yeah, that's a bummer. It did seem like that ... Yeah, he, he, he was really hard on the, "If I die, everyone's going down with me." And then he died and no one ... (laughs) Was still waiting for the package.
- CWChris Williamson
I know. Well, is it ... 'Cause he's got a lawyer that's tweeted something else as well saying, um, "I'll, uh, uh, I've, I can't stop it. Once the wheels are in motion, there's no way for me to stop it." It sounded like he was setting off a nuclear reaction or something. But yeah, I mean, I mean-
- 23:43 – 28:33
The Power of the Internet
- CWChris Williamson
- RLRyan Long
(laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
This is where-
- RLRyan Long
It seems insane.
- CWChris Williamson
This is where the internet gets things so much quicker than even anyone else, because I was seeing Dan Bilzerian is the ultimate man-child. I was seeing videos with those sorts of titles 18 months-
- RLRyan Long
Oh, the internet turned on him. Yeah, yeah, right.
- CWChris Williamson
... or two, two years ago. And this was before-
- RLRyan Long
Yeah, and that he didn't have his body. Okay, no, actually.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah, yeah, exactly. But you start to see that well before even, like, the other internet ... It, you think, there's so many layers to the level of investigation that people are prepared to do.
- RLRyan Long
I know what you mean.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah.
- RLRyan Long
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
They were so ahead of the curve with that.
- RLRyan Long
They're ahead of the curve with, like, we don't like that anymore too, with things. Yeah, as soon as ... (laughs) Like, there, there is a very ... If you're on that pulse of the internet, when people are talking about that stuff and you go, "In six months you'll hate him," you know what I mean? Like, you can kind of already see the turn. Like, Elon Musk was a perfect example of that. Like, where-
- CWChris Williamson
How do you mean?
- RLRyan Long
... it was ... You ... Well, I saw the, the, he- you know, he was like on this cool shit poster, dude, and everyone was kind of like, "Elon Musk is sick," and doing the Rogan appearances and all that stuff. And I could see the bumbling underneath of people being like, "This guy's a loser." Like, you know what I mean? And, like, not even the way that the media hated him, where the media, you know, lies about him and doesn't like guys like him. I could see that people was like, regardless of that stuff, it's like, "This guy is an annoying..." Like, I could just see the, the fumblings of that, the same way they turned on White Claw. Like, there was a minute-
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- RLRyan Long
... where White Claw, everyone loved-
- CWChris Williamson
Or Juul.
- RLRyan Long
And then ... Yeah, like all that stuff, like, you could see that it was turning, like, quick, like, you know what I mean? You can see how quickly it, it, uh, turns.
- CWChris Williamson
They're trying to launch in the UK at the moment, White Claw.
- RLRyan Long
Oh, it doesn't have it there?
- CWChris Williamson
No. Well, it, it does now, but only just.
- RLRyan Long
Oh. Well, I'm in Canada and they didn't have it in Canada when I came here. And when I came here I was like, "This is the best." And that was for, like, three days. I was telling everyone, I was like, "This White Claw thing's a game changer." I was here for about a week before it turned into, like, "Yo, if you drink White Claw, you're gay, dude."
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- RLRyan Long
(laughs) I can't take ... Like, it had about a week till it was ... They were giving it the, like, the, you know, the treatment like you're drinking a cooler. You know what I mean? Like, the ... (laughs) It- it- it switched hard. I think the beer companies, like, un- low-key, like if you work for, like, Bud, they launch like the underground, like ... (laughs) I don't know, maybe they own White Claw. But maybe that's what it is, the beer-
- CWChris Williamson
Well, so does this-
- RLRyan Long
... companies have their underground brand for White Claw.
- CWChris Williamson
Dude, I had this woman on there.
- RLRyan Long
... ............................
- 28:33 – 41:03
The Culture War
- CWChris Williamson
Did you see this, this Oli London story, the guy from the UK who got surgery to look like a, a Korean person? You see this?
- RLRyan Long
Yeah. (laughs) That guy, he's from UK?
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah.
- RLRyan Long
That guy rules.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah.
- RLRyan Long
Him and Rachel Dolezal, uh ... (laughs) J- Rachel Dolezal was, like, giving him props. (laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
I don't know, man. It feels-
- RLRyan Long
"I always wanted you." I can't wait to ... Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
It feels like one of your sketches. It feels exactly-
- RLRyan Long
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... like one of your sketches.
- RLRyan Long
I haven't been able to really do a trans sketch that I felt like was good enough to make without it seeming like hacky. I actually filmed one and then didn't even release it, 'cause I didn't feel like it was good enough, and I rarely do that. 'Cause the trans stuff is the one that ... Like, exactly, like doing something like transracial, it just, I don't know, feels like hack to me, like boomery or something. So I couldn't, I could, I couldn't ... Uh, I've, I've never been able to think of something with trans stuff that I didn't think ... You know, I get a million people who'll be like, "Do, like, a trans guy winning, like the ... Trans woman winning an Olympics." I go, "I'm not doing that." But it was making me laugh, I just went to a hot dog eating competition, uh, two days ago. (laughs) So the Amer- Do you, do you know how eating, the competitive eating in America-
- CWChris Williamson
I've seen it, yeah.
- RLRyan Long
I was ... I'm not gonna do this, but it was, like, making me laugh, the idea of if a trans ... Well, 'cause, because the, the winner for the guys wins ... You eat 78 and the winner for the girls was like 23. Like, it's not even ... (laughs) Like, the difference is so wild.
- CWChris Williamson
Oh, okay. So an eating competition would be a real difference between the two?
- RLRyan Long
Yeah, yeah, probably more than anything, yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah. Because boys are socialized to eat more than girls.
- RLRyan Long
(laughs) Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's the reason. Dude, there's this one guy, Joey Chestnut. It ... By the way-
- CWChris Williamson
I've heard of him.
- RLRyan Long
... he's this-
- CWChris Williamson
I've seen him on the internet.
- RLRyan Long
It, it's in- it's incredible. And, uh, the announcers take it seriously. My favorite part is there's one guy who keeps ...
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- RLRyan Long
He goes-
- CWChris Williamson
Has he got walkout music?
- RLRyan Long
They all- Oh, yeah. They have walking music. They, they announce it, like, kind of a mix between wrestling and basketball.
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- RLRyan Long
And the one guy pukes and the announcer goes, "A reversal!"
- CWChris Williamson
Oh, no. (laughs)
- RLRyan Long
(laughs) Like... They call it a reversal when a guy pukes.
- 41:03 – 53:34
Winston from Mumford & Sons
- RLRyan Long
- CWChris Williamson
You've been following this story about the Mumford & Sons thing? Because obviously you were in a, you were in a band. I guess this might have a special place in your heart.
- RLRyan Long
Yeah, yeah. The- i- m- this one's, like, funny because it is like... The truth is y-... If you're in a band and you're gonna get out there with your dissonant opinions, you better not be the freaking, you know, b- playing the, (laughs) the, the cheese grater with a stick, 'cause it-
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- RLRyan Long
Like, you can't... you better not be (laughs) guy number 12 in the band. You know what I mean? (laughs) You better, you better not be the washboard, the, like, backup washboard player if you're gonna get out there with your frigging opinions. Especially... So, you know, it's just like at a company, right? Like, imagine you had, like, 10 founders of a company and one guy's out there. So, I get why... I- if they're like, "Hey, all we have to do is shut up." It's like, "You're gonna get out there and, like, we're getting all this heat, and you're saying, saying all this stuff 'cause you wanna, you know, be this guy that's part of the culture war and you're ruining our lives. Listen..." That's what we were saying, because he posted Andy Ngo's, uh, book or whatever. That's... That was his whole thing. He said Andy Ngo's book was good against why Antifa is bad. But imagine, like, the rest of them, like, behind closed doors they're like, "Yeah, yeah, I mean, we all love Andy Ngo." Like, i- imagine the rest of them know.
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs) Yeah, but we weren't stupid enough to tweet about it, yeah.
- RLRyan Long
Yeah, yeah. If you go to their dressing room, it's just, like, all of them, like-
- CWChris Williamson
Andy Ngo.
- RLRyan Long
... speed reading Andy Ngo.
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- RLRyan Long
Like, they're just... They're just-
- CWChris Williamson
Photos of Andy on the wall. All the inside of the tour bus has got, like, shr- there's a shrine to him at the end of the night.
- RLRyan Long
(laughs) Yeah.... but they're just like, "We have to. We can't s- say this publicly." (laughs) Of course, we all love Andy Ngo. So that was... I, I don't know. Or, or they all... Or they were just like sick of this guy's shit. So it's hard to know what the scenario is. But I would say that in, in my opinion, in a band or a TV show or a job or anything, it's like, listen, if you are not the singer or songwriter in a band, you won the lottery. Like you legitimately... You were friends with a guy who got really famous, and now you're a millionaire because of it. That's legitimately what happened. So right wing or left wing or opinions or anything like that, like you do what he says. Like you're be-... That's in my opinion. I, I would kind of, uh... I've seen a lot of musicians that get famous on both sides that they start thinking they're, you know, more important. Like this guy is like, you know, "I need to get out there with my opinions." It's like your opinions? You're like the, you know, like the spoon player from- (laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
Slipknot. Number... Guy num- guy number 21 from Slipknot. Yeah.
- RLRyan Long
(laughs) Yeah, yeah, yeah. Guy who plays the 19th garbage lid.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- RLRyan Long
(laughs) So-
- CWChris Williamson
It was interesting. So I had a look at this, I had a look at this article and he said, um, this is talking about Winston Smith, "He blamed a viral mob for his decision to leave the band permanently. 'I failed to foresee that commenting on a book critical of the far left could be interpreted as approval of the equally abhorrent far right.'" Then he said, "Winston said his Mumford & Sons bandmates had asked him to stay with them after the tweet, but when he decided to step back from the band, 'Another viral mob came after me, this time for the sin of apologizing.'"
- RLRyan Long
Yeah, yeah. Go on.
- CWChris Williamson
It's like once you've put yourself in there, you, you're gonna get wrecked no matter where you are.
- RLRyan Long
He was, he was literally doing the thing where he's like, "Oh, crap, I'll apologize." Then everyone's like, "Yo, why'd you apologize?" He's like, "Okay, I don't apologize." I mean... (laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
"There's only two buttons. I've only got two buttons."
- RLRyan Long
(laughs) This guy doesn't have the temperament to be... You know. And even if you read what he says, it's like, I agree kind of. It's like, you know, he- he's... E- even what he just said now, he's like, "Well, I guess like me not being l- you know, left wing makes me right wing now." And you're like, "Yeah, you're right. That's how they see it. Yep, that is correct." (laughs) He-
- CWChris Williamson
That's it. It literally says it here. "Being labeled erroneously just goes to show how binary political discourse has become. 'I criticize the left, so I must be the right or s- or something.' "
- RLRyan Long
Yeah, but you're like, "Duh."
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- RLRyan Long
Like you don't... You're not aware of this? Like this is a... Like this is just news to you now? Like this guy is gonna be... Now he, now what? He goes on like the Dave Rubin tour, like saying shit that we all like thought in 2013 from Bernie's show?
- CWChris Williamson
Apologize on The View. He goes and apologizes on The View.
- RLRyan Long
Or he go- goes the other way. So I don't know, man. I, I... Obviously that sucks. Like if you're, you know, whatever, some guy in some band and you're famous and you got all these opinions and you post anything you think and your life's over, but, uh, that is the, that is the situation. So I, I, I... I'm a big... And, and you know what? I, I mean, I'm not... I- I shouldn't trash him because he goes, "This is what I want to do and now I'm gonna go say what I want to do." And he m- he may- maybe he's pretty rich right now. So to be honest, like maybe there's nothing more to be said than that's what this guy didn't... You know, now he can go start his one-man ukulele show-
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- 53:34 – 1:05:50
Success in Modern Society
- RLRyan Long
But, uh, have, have you ... Do you ever read the book, like ... I mean, a lot of this stuff we're, um, applying to politics and, and marketing, and it's all always like, for one, what's your goal? But, you know, like, Tipping Point? Have you ever read any of those kind of books? Um, I, I, I, I'm not sure if it's Tipping Point or one of the other ones. It might have been another Malcolm Gladwell book. But I think it m- I think it might be Tipping Point. But he talks a lot about that with, with, uh, Vans and Airwalk. Um, but it's like there's two ways to go, right? If, if your brand is, like, taking off really quickly, you know, option one is you pour as much gasoline on it as possible and try to, like, milk it as quick as possible. And that, you know, you kind of need to decide whether you're that kind of brand or whether you can actually pivot those fans into something else. Or ... And then there's option two, where you actually push back against it, which, you know, it's like, you know, again, if I do like a big video that was popular with, like, conservatives. Then the next week, I tried to do something like, that was aga- ... Like I did ... The next week, I came out where it was like, "It's not always PC culture." And then I kind of ... When, uh, I felt like-... it was- I- you know, I was doing, like, a lot of videos about, like, Fox and CNN being bad. And then if I felt like I was kind of too biased towards one side, I tried to go the other way. So I- in a lot of ways, I tried to, one, like that's a little, like, less clean of a branding, but you're just like, "Listen, I'm not going to stray away from who I actually am," which is, like, that I- I'm not going to say one side's good and one side's bad. Like, I'm just everyone's people and I think that I'm focused on that. And then- and then if you start finding yourself, like, growing too quick and it's the wrong way, you kind of- you pour... What's the opposite of gasoline? Like-
- CWChris Williamson
Like sand or something? Yeah.
- RLRyan Long
Yeah, yeah. Sand. Yeah, you pour some sand on- sand on it a little bit. So I think that I'm... Being naturally contrarian, I maybe do it too much, but I think I- a lot of times I pour sand on my own, like, growth just out of, uh, spite for, like, not being, you know, looked at a certain way.
- CWChris Williamson
What are you being pulled through by then? Is it just, "I want to find something that's funny here?" Is it just, "I want to find the funniest thing and try and go after that"? Or is there a more sort of central thrust that you've got?
- RLRyan Long
I think it's like, how do you be the greatest artist? Like, how- how can I be... You know, I- I- I really do love the idea of looking back at, like, a body of work and being, like, super proud of it, you know, and not looking at it and being, like, all... And I- I've done, you know, I was in a pretty successful band before comedy, and then I was in, uh, you know, I used to make TV and all, like, traditional before I kind of moved to America. And- and I mean, you know, every... Like, you look at things and you go, "Ugh, that's when I got crappy." And there is this other element of like, listen, if you can figure out how to make money and you can figure out how to, uh, you know, monetize what you're doing and then be bigger, like all that stuff's going to help. Like even just the smallest things of, you know, having a lot of success in New York, you can have- you can kind of go do spots in whatever clubs you want a little easier, right? So there's this... You do need... You can't just be, like, in your basement, so you do need to look at all of this stuff and be like, "No, I do need to grow." And I... So, "All right. How much time should I put into stand up? Is this- is that lacking? Like, how much time have- should I be doing the videos?" Like, and then when- when you're doing the videos, you go, "Am I kind of getting away from comedy? Am I getting preachy?" Whatever it is, right? So just, like, doing those analysis on yourself. But I think if you say what the goal is, is to... When you're- when I'm, you know, 60, kind of look back and be like, "Pretty sick, like, stuff that I made." You know? Be like- They'll have, like, eight standup specials and, you know, like, I'm like, "All right, you know, six of those were pretty freaking good," and just be like that, you know, "That movie I made, like, that was actually a really good movie," and... Like that. Just looking back at stuff and being like kind of... Which I have a lot of things in my life that I- I look back on art-wise and I'm like, "Pretty cool." You know, you'll be like, "All right, that was good." But then I have other things where I look back and I go, "Yeah, we were getting off track there. That sucked." (laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
It's so funny, man, because I wonder how many people that have got success at the moment or, uh, we're seeing sort of flying up through the echelons of whatever it is, YouTube podcasting, standup comedy, acting, movies, whatever, actually would look back and say that they were proud of the body of work that they're- they're looking behind, or whether they look back and say, "Well, that was just... It fed the algorithm. It- it sort of told people what they wanted to hear. It was a bit hacky."
- RLRyan Long
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
"It was a bit melodrama, but whatever. I-I- he- I'm on my yacht. It doesn't matter." I- I definitely think that starting with the end in mind of thinking, "Yeah, I want a good body of work that I'm proud of, that other people think is cool-"
- RLRyan Long
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
"... or other people think is interesting or insightful," or gives them a- a perspective-
- RLRyan Long
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... that they don't see elsewhere, that- that by its nature will bring some success with it. But as you said there, you can be too heterodox. You can be the guy in the basement, totally anti-marketing. "I don't need an Instagram. I don't need a YouTube channel." It's like, well, you're- you're going to still be in your basement. Like, you need to play the game-
- RLRyan Long
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... but know that it's not about the game.
- RLRyan Long
That's a good way to put it. I really like that. Yeah. You need to play the game, but it's- it's not... The- the game's there to help you get what you want so you can, you know, you can operate your business the way that you want it to. Yeah. And- and you make them, and they're- everything is little choices, and that's why I'm, like, a big proponent of, like, instincts on stage. Like, when I'm on stage, I'm not having a dis- conversation of, "Should I do this or should I do that?" It's like I'm trusting, you know, the years of doing it. And you- so you- when you do the opposite of your instincts, as long as they're not, you know, getting malaligned, malaligned or whatever that word would be, you kind of... Here, like a perfect example on like a little scale, like if you look at everyone in the, like, internet game, for the most part, that does, like, videos like me, they all take their videos and then they cut them with subtitles and they usually put it in a box with like the title over top of it, right?
- CWChris Williamson
Meme bar it, yeah.
- RLRyan Long
They meme bar it. And I- I don't do that, and I know that it- it hurts my views, especially on platforms on phones. But it is this thing where, going back to, like, the body of work thing, you know things are gonna change and here and there. But I'm like, I do like- like looking at all the- having all these sketches that like look the way that they're supposed to look and maybe they don't get shared as much right now, but I think if someone that like cares about good things looks through all my stuff, they kind of will look at it like it was a- a sketch that was made, like, in that context and not, you know, this like internet thing or something. I don't know. So to me that's like a sacrifice I'm willing to, like, make because I've... Like, how I want it to be seen or something.
- CWChris Williamson
People really struggle to work out what's a trend and what's, like, an evergreen addition to the body of work.
- RLRyan Long
Yeah, yeah. Totally.
- CWChris Williamson
So there's- there's certain new things that get added on that you're like, "Well, this wasn't a thing before, it is a thing now, and it still will be in 20 years time." This is...
- RLRyan Long
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... a game changing pivot or an extra little limb that we've added on to whatever the thing is that-
- RLRyan Long
Totally.
- CWChris Williamson
But sometimes it's just a little...... wiggle in the market or a, a little trend that comes through, and you're gonna look back. I was listening to Tim Dillon, and he had one of the dudes from Curb on. I can't remember the guy. It wasn't Larry, it was somebody else. And, um, he was talking about this guy. You're talking ... Uh, this dude was so out of touch with a lot of the, the trends and stuff-
- RLRyan Long
(laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
... that were going on at the moment.
- RLRyan Long
Right.
- CWChris Williamson
But found Tim's content hilarious. But obvi-
- RLRyan Long
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
He didn't have a fucking clue about TikTok, like didn't really understand how podcasts worked. He obviously not finger on the pulse, but fucking epic comedian who really understands his craft. And-
- 1:05:50 – 1:11:07
The Hardest Part of Ryan's Work
- RLRyan Long
from that platform.
- CWChris Williamson
Desperately. What's the-
- RLRyan Long
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
What, what's the hardest thing that you do as part of your process at the moment? Is it writing? Is it scripting? Is it editing? Is it actually shooting the stuff? What is it?
- RLRyan Long
Like always-
- CWChris Williamson
Artistically.
- RLRyan Long
I, I guess I always ch- Uh, yeah, yeah, but like sometimes I'll be like when I'm writing, I'm like, "Oh, writing's like the hardest part." And then when I'm filming I'm just like, "Okay, let's just get the filming over." And then when I'm editing it's like, "Fucking editing sucks." And my chick's like, "You know, maybe you just don't like filmmaking."
- CWChris Williamson
All of it.
- RLRyan Long
(laughs) Yeah. So it d- it just depends. You know what, the, the truth is, um, that I ... This is the thing that I've realized about myself over the years, and I, I don't always get it right. But I like all of them as long as I get to do just that. I hate the one ... I hate when I'm squeezing anything in. And that's like the worst part. So if I'm writing, like I really need to block off where it's like, no, I'm writing today. Or at the very least like-... till 3:00 today. Like, the first half of my day is writing, the second half of my day is this. It's when I try to do all of the things that I hate all of them. So, when I'm really trying to work on standup and then it's like, I have to go edit this video, I hate it. But when I say, "You know what? I just filmed five videos and for the next, you know, four days I'm editing," I don't hate editing anymore. Or when I say that, uh, like, I'm taking this week I'm going to write six scripts, I don't hate writing anymore. So, I don't mind anything when I can be- I- when I can really, like, get into it. And then at- at that point I, like, I- I don't mind all of it. But probably the- the one that's the hardest out of anything, and this just isn't me, this is the probably, I think, well, just an objective truth, uh, writing standup is the hardest thing out of all the things.
- CWChris Williamson
Why?
Episode duration: 1:12:05
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