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Simon SinekCreativity Is Connection with poet IN-Q | A Bit of Optimism Podcast
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Why turning a story into a poem changes how it feels
Simon reflects on getting unexpectedly emotional after writing, not just telling, a story. IN-Q explains that poetry can encapsulate an experience, creating distance that makes it easier to share, internalize, and process differently.
- •Simon notices he welled up reading something he’d written, even though he’s told the story before without the same reaction
- •IN-Q says creating a poem is different from speaking a story because the poem separates the story from the rest of your life
- •IN-Q describes the poem as something that becomes “outside of you,” changing how you share and absorb it
- •Simon frames story-telling as often being for others, while this kind of writing can be for oneself
Is calling it “poetry” a liability? Identity, labels, and audience baggage
Simon questions whether the word “poem” turns people off because of stereotypes and cultural baggage. IN-Q agrees it can be a liability, yet insists the label “poet” is authentic to who he is, even if it narrows how people respond.
- •Simon says the word “poem” carries baggage and can trigger dismissive reactions
- •IN-Q contrasts saying he’s a “writer” versus saying he’s a “poet,” noting people are rarely intrigued by the latter
- •IN-Q says “poet” is still the truth, alongside other roles like author, facilitator, and songwriter
- •IN-Q emphasizes poetry as the closest to creation and “source” for him
IN-Q performs a poem about refusing forced opinions and choosing nuance
IN-Q shares a recent poem centered on the legitimacy of saying “I don’t know,” especially in online culture that pressures people into hot takes. He critiques performative posting, polarized slogans, and the lure of collective outrage, arguing for compassion and room for multiple truths.
- •IN-Q asserts “I don’t know” is a valid answer and that “I’m not taking a position” can be powerful
- •He distinguishes silence from indifference or violence, saying sometimes silence is simply silence
- •He criticizes online noise and shallow certainty, urging compassion and seeking common ground
- •He emphasizes that multiple truths can coexist without being personal attacks
- •He closes by returning to “I don’t know” as a stance against polarized slogans and rage bonding
Poetry in corporate settings: winning over skeptics and shifting culture
Simon and IN-Q discuss why it’s meaningful—and challenging—to bring spoken word into corporate environments. IN-Q describes the gratification of changing people’s preconceived notions by showing up truthfully and getting non-poets to write and share something real with coworkers.
- •Simon argues corporate audiences are not “the converted,” making the impact potentially greater
- •IN-Q says he now sees corporate work as an important way to connect with people
- •They describe initial resistance from audiences and the surprise when people are moved
- •IN-Q highlights workshops where participants laugh, cry, and surprise themselves with what they create
How IN-Q creates a container for vulnerability without forcing it
Asked how he unlocks creativity in people with “left brain” jobs, IN-Q explains that vulnerability must be modeled first. He describes persistence, accepting that not everyone will engage, and using context-building to improve human connection and workplace communication.
- •IN-Q says if you want vulnerability from others, you must be vulnerable first
- •He notes some people may not have capacity, the setting may be wrong, or someone may simply be unwilling—and he doesn’t need to convert everyone
- •He compares the shift to a Rubik’s Cube click: it happens after repeated showing up
- •He says miscommunication at work often comes from lack of context about who people really are
- •He argues constant vulnerability would stall work, but zero vulnerability also fails—so people hire him to create a momentary container for it
The poem-writing exercise: choosing a life-changing moment and writing what’s true
They set up a live exercise where everyone writes a poem. IN-Q gives a prompt—choose a moment that changed you—and insists the goal isn’t greatness but truth, selecting something deeper than typical dinner-party conversation.
- •IN-Q prompts participants to pick a moment where they “walked in one person and walked out another”
- •He urges choosing something moving and meaningful, deeper than casual conversation
- •IN-Q emphasizes: don’t try to make it great—make it true
- •Simon commits to taking a short break to write, with the team doing the exercise too
IN-Q’s poem about meeting his father at 15: anger, healing, and gratitude
IN-Q performs a deeply personal poem about meeting his father for the first time, tracing how abandonment shaped anger, masculinity, and self-worth. He describes a path through therapy, honesty, and reframing pain into gratitude, ending with forgiveness and appreciation for life itself.
- •IN-Q recounts fear and tension before making contact and meeting his father
- •He describes internalized rage, misdirected anger, and emotional numbness
- •He reflects on learning masculinity from media and suppressing sensitivity
- •He narrates the meeting, apology, and the unresolved aftermath that still affected his mental health
- •He describes therapy, writing, self-acceptance, gratitude, and choosing forgiveness as a way to live more fully
What “being present” looks like when performing something deeply real
Simon observes that IN-Q’s emotion remains vivid despite sharing the poem many times. IN-Q defines presence as honoring the moment you’re in, insisting that sharing something real can be sincere even when it’s performed.
- •Simon notes IN-Q appears to experience the poem as if sharing it for the first time
- •IN-Q defines being present as honoring the only moment you have—whether good or bad
- •IN-Q distinguishes “performed” from “performative,” emphasizing authenticity
- •IN-Q invites listeners to explore their own life-changing moment through a poem in any style or length
Team poems and immediate closeness: why sharing makes the exercise powerful
After the break, Simon reports on the team’s poems and the emotional impact of hearing them. He emphasizes the rapid increase in closeness and urges doing the exercise with someone else because sharing creates a uniquely human kind of connection.
- •Simon describes team members writing about heartbreak, motherhood, and self-forgiveness
- •One teammate chooses not to read the poem but shares its theme and becomes emotional anyway
- •Simon highlights how quickly the exercise created a deeper sense of closeness in the room
- •He encourages listeners to try the exercise and ideally share it with another person, not only do it alone
Simon’s poem: fear, powerlessness, and finding purpose through service
Simon reads a poem about a time he felt powerless and reacted with anger, describing being in Afghanistan without the protections others had. He recounts a flight out of a war zone shared with a flag-draped coffin, and how that experience taught him a deeper meaning of purpose and service.
- •Simon describes losing control and becoming angry in a way he’s not proud of
- •He contrasts being alone as a civilian with others’ uniforms, ranks, and community
- •He recounts leaving the war zone on a flight that carried a single fallen service member in a coffin
- •He says the experience revealed purpose as serving those who serve others and that the encounter filled him in an unexpected way
Why poetry unlocks new insight: emotion on a page and stories for oneself
They reflect on how writing the poem affected Simon differently than telling the story on stage. IN-Q explains that poetry creates space from the narrative, while Simon realizes he discovered insights he’d never voiced before and that making something creative for oneself can be uniquely “magical.”
- •Simon says he’s told the story publicly but welled up this time because it was “emotion on a page”
- •He notes the writing revealed insights he’d never said from the stage, including that the fallen service member was “there for me”
- •IN-Q reiterates that turning story into poem encapsulates it and separates it from you, changing how you internalize it
- •Simon and IN-Q describe a creative act done for oneself first, with sharing as an added gift that deepens connection
- •IN-Q describes a “virtuous loop” where sharing brings closeness to others and reflection that brings closeness to oneself
Happiness as a range—and the artist’s job: truth, hope, and resolution
IN-Q shares a key idea from his late therapist: happiness isn’t a point but a range, requiring ongoing self-check-ins. The conversation expands into whether art must come from pain, with IN-Q rejecting constant suffering as a prerequisite and describing his goal to explore truth while landing in hope and empowerment; Simon connects this to “fighting to resolution.”
- •IN-Q quotes his therapist: “Happiness is not a point, it’s a range,” and says you must keep checking in
- •Simon expands the metaphor, contrasting a bullseye with a field and rejecting the need for constant euphoria
- •They discuss the belief that art must be born of pain; IN-Q calls it “50/50” and rejects the idea artists must always suffer
- •IN-Q tells a breakup-story moment where rereading old breakup poems made him realize he was repeating patterns, prompting him to “write my way out”
- •IN-Q says he wants to explore painful truth but leave people with hope, possibility, and empowerment; Simon praises his work for pushing toward resolution
