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What Now? With Trevor NoahMeet Eugene Khoza – One of My Favorite People | What Now? with Trevor Noah Podcast
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Starting With a Prayer: Township Traditions
Trevor and Eugene joke about podcast subtitles and awkward conversation starts, then Trevor proposes opening with a prayer. They discuss how their grandmothers' prayers cut awkwardness and signaled whose house it was, and Trevor's grandmother stating her address to God.
- •Joking about subtitling Eugene's vernacular
- •Prayer as a way to cut awkwardness in meetings
- •Praying at someone else's house is not done
- •Trevor's grandmother gave her name and address in prayer
- •Eugene links the habit of identifying yourself to missionaries
Missionaries, Church and Community
The pair discuss how missionaries brought religion alongside exploitation, and how churches in townships were aspirational spaces that also offered opportunity. Trevor says he is conflicted, since churches fuel pain but also provide free community, while Eugene argues the internet connects people too.
- •Missionaries blamed misfortune on lacking their God
- •Church in the township was where family structure and nice clothes showed up
- •Some people benefited from missionary education, including Nelson Mandela
- •Trevor cites a dying Ohio church revived by Haitian immigrants
- •Debate over whether the internet counts as connecting
Structure, Stories and the Bible's Suffering
Eugene says some people need structure and that believers abdicate responsibility to a higher power. They argue over whether anyone has a good time in the Bible, and Trevor defends stories, using The Wizard of Oz, as the way ideas stick. He concludes a well-run church is group counseling.
- •Eugene says people steeped in religion hand off responsibility to be good
- •Eugene calls the Bible a big book of suffering; Trevor counters with King David
- •Trevor says no story is worth hearing without struggle
- •Stories like The Wizard of Oz teach courage and decency
- •A well-run church is a community center and group counseling
Pickleball, Sunburn and Comedy as a Non-Job
Trevor's sunburn leads to a tangent on pickleball versus paddleball. Eugene then asks how Trevor feels around friends with conventional careers, and Trevor says comedy has no payday and that professionals are mostly winging it.
- •Trevor got sunburned playing pickleball at a UV index of 10
- •Comparing paddleball with pickleball
- •Comedy has no boss, hiring or guaranteed payday
- •Trevor learned from professionals that most people are winging it
- •The Bible shows the full complexity of human beings
Eugene's Defunct Jobs and the Mall Owner
Eugene recounts his early jobs at a car park, CD store and CNA magazine counter. He describes meeting the mall's owner, Mr. Watson, and how that encounter shaped his principle of only doing what he loves and being where he is wanted.
- •First job at 16 collecting parking tickets
- •Trevor jokes Eugene is the Grim Reaper of jobs
- •Meeting the beloved, powerful mall owner Mr. Watson
- •Principle of only being where he is wanted and wants to be
- •Fascination with the mall as a place of abundance
Eugene's Mother and the Lesson of Abundance
Eugene explains how his nurse mother took each child to town at month-end, teaching abundance and that money exists to be used. Trevor adds that employment and freedom each carry pros and cons.
- •Mom's monthly town trips on a roster
- •She let him pick what he wanted before buying groceries
- •"When it's finished, it's finished" shaped his relationship with money and loss
- •Money is meant to meet needs that come up
- •Trevor says freedom is hard work while structure can be liberating
Processing Loss and Grief
Trevor says he is loss averse but has lost few loved ones, while Eugene says he processes loss faster and treats objects and people the same way. Eugene speaks about his son who died at three months and his daughter's role afterward.
- •Eugene walks past things he loves and can accept losing them
- •He describes grief as an extended phase of regret
- •He lost his son at three months and had spent all the time he could with him
- •His daughter became like a parent, with no time for his sadness
- •Trevor describes his grandmother's death at 96 and his first loss
Parenting, Forgetting Yourself and the Meaning of Life
Trevor recalls Esther Perel's idea that having a child forces you to forget yourself. Eugene says life has no built-in meaning and that we keep meeting our teachers, which leads to his story of Trevor wanting to buy a plane.
- •Esther Perel's idea that children force you to forgo your selfishness
- •Dogs and kids push people out of themselves
- •Eugene says life has no built-in meaning and we give it meaning
- •Trevor's childlike wonder, including the plan to buy a Cessna
- •Trevor's abrupt move to America in grey tracksuit pants
Comedy as a Hobby and 'Something Has to Be Done'
They reflect on starting comedy a week apart when it was not yet a thing in South Africa, and on Eugene's many hobbies. Trevor shares his mother's lesson that there is always something to be done, and credits Eugene with keeping comedy a hobby rather than a job.
- •Comedy was a ragtag hobbyist group in South Africa
- •Eugene has had many hobbies, from motorbikes to golf
- •Trevor's mom taught him there's always something to be done
- •Eugene reminded Trevor to keep comedy a want-to, not a have-to
Energy, Experience and Soul Families
Eugene says we are here to remember and feel something, and Trevor shares a mushroom-trip idea about energy and light, suggesting that we may be experiments or lasers sent to gather information. Eugene adds that everyone in his life is a character he chose, including five-person soul groups.
- •Eugene says our souls know why we're here and the body is a vessel
- •Trevor's Sweden thought about energy and seeing only reflected light
- •Idea that God may be trying to experience through us
- •Eugene on soul families and chosen characters
- •Heartbreak and pain as accelerants
Pain Versus Suffering
Trevor warns against making pain the meaning of life, noting that the pain is the journey to something good, like a hike to a peak. They discuss Viktor Frankl's idea that pain is real but suffering is a choice, and Eugene says suffering is regret of not enduring pain, as animals migrating show.
- •Trevor cautions against treating pain as the whole experience
- •Hiking and animal migration as examples of pain toward a goal
- •Victor Frankl: pain is real, suffering is a choice
- •Traffic with or without a podcast illustrates perspective
- •Eugene: suffering is staying; pain is what you endure to leave it
Reconnecting, Surface Areas of Luck and Being Specific
Trevor asks how to get back when feeling disconnected, and Eugene turns to photos, walking and memories. Trevor then outlines a French philosopher's types of luck, and the pair discuss dreaming specifically, with Trevor arguing we don't know what we want.
- •Eugene uses photos, grass, sunshine and walks to reconnect
- •Types of luck: dumb luck, motion, awareness and uniqueness
- •Awareness shapes whether you feel lucky
- •Trevor says we know what we don't want, not what we want
- •Wanted things may not deliver the feeling we expect
Leaving The Daily Show and Learning to Say Goodbye
Trevor says Eugene's line to starve yourself before someone starves you shaped his decision to leave The Daily Show. They discuss choosing endings, non-attachment and saying goodbye while things are still alive, including Trevor's grief over his grandmother and the show's last day.
- •Eugene's advice to learn to starve yourself before others do
- •Staying beyond the pain turns it into suffering
- •Few people get to choose when things end
- •Practicing goodbye, and grieving while something is still alive
- •Grief as unprocessed joy and the wish to attend funerals while alive
Appreciating Trevor and Why the Series Exists
Eugene tells Trevor how kind, generous and childlike he has been, from Horror Café days to the helm of The Daily Show. Trevor says this reveals why he wants to do a series on his favorite people, and the episode ends with a joke about saying goodbye.
- •Eugene describes Trevor's kindness toward PAs and friends
- •He says Trevor was born with this inner power and his grandmother saw it
- •Trevor says he is a manifestation of the people in his life
- •The 'favorite people' series is about the we behind him
- •Closing goodbye joke about Dab-ism
Publisher timestamps
- 0:00Intro
- 2:05Prayer traditions in South African townships
- 10:05Early comedy careers and shared beginningsRead this chapter
- 22:05Eugene's early jobs and life lessonsRead this chapter
- 34:05Discussion on religion, church, and community
- 37:05Perspectives on loss and processing griefRead this chapter
- 45:450 Reflections on parenting and personal growthRead this chapter
- 51:00Discussion on pain versus sufferingRead this chapter
- 1:14:00Trevor discusses leaving The Daily Show
- 1:47:00Personal appreciation and friendshipRead this chapter
