Sara Pascoe made to take ADHD test LIVE. Husband disagrees with result!!

Sara Pascoe 0:00 When I found out about what ADHD was, I was really glad there was an explanation.

Steen Raskopoulos 0:04 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 0:05 Because I couldn't believe someone could live that way.

Alex Partridge 0:08 Sara Pascoe. [cheering]

Steen Raskopoulos 0:10 Steen Raskopoulos. [cheering]

Alex Partridge 0:13 Two renowned comedians.

Steen Raskopoulos 0:14 Pulling back the curtains on ADHD in their life. But also, that's, I think one of the biggest things I struggle with is choice. Start running at 8:00, and at 7:50, like, "Cool, I'll go get a coffee." And as soon as it hits, like, 8:01, you've missed it. "Okay, I'll, I'll just chill till 8:30." Then 8:34 comes. "Oh, I'll start at definitely 9:00." And then before you know it, you're watching The Price Is Right at 6:00.

Sara Pascoe 0:34 And then one day you hate yourself.

Steen Raskopoulos 0:36 Yeah. [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 0:36 One day-

Alex Partridge 0:37 Can we ask you some questions?

Sara Pascoe 0:39 Yes.

Steen Raskopoulos 0:39 Yeah.

Alex Partridge 0:39 First question: I find it difficult finishing a task or a project.

Sara Pascoe 0:42 One.

Alex Partridge 0:43 Next question: Find it difficult to sit still and often fidget or squirm.

Sara Pascoe 0:46 Yeah. I wiggle.

Alex Partridge 0:47 I would describe myself as being on the go and feel compelled to do things, as if I'm driven by a motor.

Sara Pascoe 0:54 Yeah, that's-

Alex Partridge 0:54 Last one.

Sara Pascoe 0:55 [laughs]

Alex Partridge 0:56 I often miss what is being said to me in conversations. Sara, thanks for taking our ADHD test. I have the results. You have scored... [upbeat music] This episode is dedicated to anyone who hates big spoons. They really are the devil's shovel. I know you've probably heard this a million times on other podcasts, but following or subscribing really helps the show, and the more followers we get, the more likely it is that I'm able to book new, exciting, and insightful guests for the show. So if you subscribe, I will continue to keep to my word and promise to never let this podcast be sponsored by Huel. Sara, Steen.

Sara Pascoe 1:35 Hello.

Alex Partridge 1:36 Thank you for joining us. [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 1:36 Thanks for having us.

Alex Partridge 1:39 So let's clarify the dynamics first. Who's got ADHD, or do you both have it?

Steen Raskopoulos 1:44 Uh, I would say diagnosed, one out of two, but, uh, I believe we both have it.

Sara Pascoe 1:50 Yeah. I am an ADHD, uh, refuser, [laughs] uh, not an A- ADHD denier. I definitely believe some people have ADHD. Uh, my best friend has been diagnosed with ADHD. Husband, as you can see. Uh, and, and I, um... It definitely, definitely is... I'm, I'm not someone who's minimizing it and the effect that it has on people's lives, but, mm, [laughs] but personally, I think I'm in the squidge, the squidge of people who maybe have some symptoms, but it's, uh, you know... What was I saying to you yesterday? I think sometimes the world is wrong, not people. [laughs] Yeah, right. I think.

Steen Raskopoulos 2:37 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 2:38 Steen's face.

Steen Raskopoulos 2:39 No, I think-

Sara Pascoe 2:39 I, I think if you live with someone with ADHD and you end up having to do too many of the executive functions-

Steen Raskopoulos 2:44 Mm

Sara Pascoe 2:44 ... it starts, you start to become overwhelmed.

Steen Raskopoulos 2:46 Mm, that's exactly what someone with ADHD would say. [laughs]

Alex Partridge 2:50 What traits do you notice most in Steen? 'Cause you've got a diagnosis.

Steen Raskopoulos 2:53 Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 2:53 Yeah.

Alex Partridge 2:53 What traits do you notice most in Steen?

Sara Pascoe 2:55 Well, there are things about Steen that I was really glad there was an explanation.

Steen Raskopoulos 2:59 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 3:00 Because I couldn't believe someone could live that way in terms of not being able to see things or do things, and then watching someone have an intention. Like watching a spaniel, right? G- Off, off I go to do this thing, and then a squirrel. [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 3:19 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 3:19 And a different thought has occurred. The original thought completely lost forever.

Steen Raskopoulos 3:22 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 3:23 Things half done. Um, I was really, I was really glad when I found out about what ADHD was, and then when Steen was learning about it himself-

Steen Raskopoulos 3:32 Mm

Sara Pascoe 3:32 ... pre-diagnosis.

Steen Raskopoulos 3:33 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 3:33 There was a relief of going, "Ah, s- it..." That, that light bulb moment of so many things make sense.

Steen Raskopoulos 3:41 Yeah. But it's also just going, I'm not, like, in terms of calling it out-

Sara Pascoe 3:44 Mm

Steen Raskopoulos 3:44 ... whether it be, like, I need to go do something and come back, n- not done the thing, done something completely different that also doesn't need to be done.

Sara Pascoe 3:51 Yes.

Steen Raskopoulos 3:52 And then coming back downstairs.

Sara Pascoe 3:53 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 3:54 And then going-

Sara Pascoe 3:54 And the thing that does need to be done, never getting done.

Steen Raskopoulos 3:56 Oh, it's still, it still isn't done. Like-

Sara Pascoe 3:58 Steen has never, ever emptied a washing machine.

Steen Raskopoulos 3:59 That is a lie.

Sara Pascoe 3:59 He's put so many washes on.

Steen Raskopoulos 4:01 That is a lie.

Sara Pascoe 4:01 So many washes on.

Steen Raskopoulos 4:02 That is a lie.

Sara Pascoe 4:02 But never unprompted.

Steen Raskopoulos 4:05 Unprompted.

Sara Pascoe 4:05 "Did you put a wa- Did you put a wash on six weeks ago? [laughs] 'Cause there's a lot-"

Steen Raskopoulos 4:09 Yeah

Sara Pascoe 4:09 ... "of rotting clothes in here."

Steen Raskopoulos 4:10 Yeah, that's true.

Sara Pascoe 4:11 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 4:11 Um, but it's also a thing of, uh, kind of not... Internally, you're so negative before, I guess, the diagnosis.

Sara Pascoe 4:20 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 4:20 'Cause, like, I don't think I'm incompetent, I think I'm an idiot. Like, I'm not doing it intentionally kind of thing.

Sara Pascoe 4:23 Laziness.

Steen Raskopoulos 4:24 I'm n-

Sara Pascoe 4:24 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 4:24 ... and it was that too, like, going, "I'm, fuck, I'm, I'm not lazy," but-

Sara Pascoe 4:27 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 4:27 ... that kind of might be construed as that as well.

Sara Pascoe 4:29 And as a husband and wife dynamic, and it is awful feeling that you're nagging your partner about basic household chores.

Steen Raskopoulos 4:36 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 4:36 But when someone has ADHD, they do, in our experience-

Steen Raskopoulos 4:40 Mm

Sara Pascoe 4:40 ... need some prompting, which means you've got a resentful partner who is either thinking, "It's quicker if I do it myself," or, "I have the mental load of remembering the other half of the task." So when we understood it was ADHD-

Steen Raskopoulos 4:52 Yeah. But it's also you f- you sometimes go, like, "I feel bad for nagging." Like, it's not nagging, you're just reminding. Like, it's actually a thing to-

Sara Pascoe 4:58 Yeah, he would s-

Steen Raskopoulos 4:58 Thank you for, uh-

Sara Pascoe 4:58 He would say he was grateful, but I hated my, the sound of my own voice so much, like, passive aggressively like, "Oh! [laughs] Oh, did you..." [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 5:07 "Oh, is the washing machine unloaded again, Steen?"

Sara Pascoe 5:09 Yes.

Steen Raskopoulos 5:09 "Thank you so much. That's-"

Sara Pascoe 5:10 You know, towels is the o- the other thing. Towels.

Steen Raskopoulos 5:12 Towels. Bad on towels.

Sara Pascoe 5:12 He uses a towel-

Steen Raskopoulos 5:13 Bad on towels

Sara Pascoe 5:13 ... drops it, it's then invisible to him for the rest of its life.

Steen Raskopoulos 5:17 It's not that. Like, you just, you know when you start-

Sara Pascoe 5:18 It just never occurs to him

Steen Raskopoulos 5:18 ... sorting things in piles. It's like, all right, I hang the towel over here or leave it on the floor-

Sara Pascoe 5:22 Yeah, that's what you do

Steen Raskopoulos 5:22 ... so when I want to get changed-

Sara Pascoe 5:24 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 5:24 ... I'll pick it up on the way back down to d- and I just-

Sara Pascoe 5:25 And sometimes it would make its way halfway to the bathroom. Like, he'd started the journey.

Steen Raskopoulos 5:29 Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 5:30 And it would ha- he'd hang it up in the hallway, like, "That's close enough."

Steen Raskopoulos 5:33 Or, like, 'cause we've got our bedrooms upstairs, like, I throw the towel downstairs, like, cool. So when I walk downstairs-

Sara Pascoe 5:37 This is feeling like couples therapy.

Steen Raskopoulos 5:38 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 5:39 This is feeling like couples therapy. [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 5:42 Also, we've already forgotten the, probably the first question, which-

Sara Pascoe 5:44 No, we haven't.

Steen Raskopoulos 5:45 Okay.

Sara Pascoe 5:45 Which was you've been diagnosed.

Steen Raskopoulos 5:46 Yes.

Sara Pascoe 5:47 I interrupt people a lot when they're talking, which I know is a-

Steen Raskopoulos 5:49 Well, does that sound like it? [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 5:51 Which I know is a big ADHD symptom.

Steen Raskopoulos 5:52 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 5:52 But it's also just sometimes it, you've not got a very nice personality. [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 5:57 [laughs]

Alex Partridge 5:58 Well, you put the w- the dishwasher on, and then you got distracted by a side quest.

Steen Raskopoulos 6:01 Thank you so much. I wanna go gather the smaller experience points. I wanna go talk to the, the lesser-

Alex Partridge 6:05 The floor drove is a perfectly valid place for that towel.

Steen Raskopoulos 6:08 Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Sara Pascoe 6:09 And the internet makes it hard, because there's things where you go, "Oh, I need to book that thing. I need to answer that email. I need..." So, so, and, and then there's a whole other world of half- Half-fulfilled tasks

Steen Raskopoulos 6:21 But also that's, I think, one of the biggest things I struggle with is choice. Like, when, uh ... Especially if I have to buy either, like, groceries or, or, um, things for the house, if there's, like, an option, especially if you just shop on, like, Amazon or a thing-

Sara Pascoe 6:34 Blackout blinds.

Steen Raskopoulos 6:35 Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 6:35 You know, having children is ... I mean, there's lots of reasons it's annoying, but it gives you lots and lots of executive. Like, it's-

Steen Raskopoulos 6:42 Mm. Mm. Mm

Sara Pascoe 6:42 ... it's executive functions to me, isn't it? Right. And it gives you hundreds of them all of the time, and you have to do it. You have to be the grownup, and it's not good for ADHD.

Steen Raskopoulos 6:52 No.

Sara Pascoe 6:53 It's ... I mean, it's, it's overwhelming, even for people like me who don't have ADHD. [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 6:59 [laughs]

Alex Partridge 7:00 With the awareness of ADHD you have now-

Sara Pascoe 7:02 Mm

Alex Partridge 7:02 ... can you look back in your early days of dating and see moments of impulsivity from Steen?

Sara Pascoe 7:07 That's an interesting question. A- actually, not so much impulsivity, because lots of people in our profession, I, I, I think it, it's, it's such a common trait-

Steen Raskopoulos 7:22 Mm

Sara Pascoe 7:23 ... in people in our profession because we're ... You know, it's, it's a very immature lifestyle, working at night, drinking after work. So getting to know someone, you d- I didn't pick up on that, but it's the low self-esteem caused by constantly wanting to do things and not getting them done.

Steen Raskopoulos 7:42 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 7:43 And that, that's the thing, is thinking, like, "Why is this really, like, beautiful, talented person got such low self-esteem?" [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 7:49 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 7:49 And that's what the diagnosis really helped with, and that's why I look back on your life and go, "Oh, gosh. If you had found out at school..." Like, lots of people our age, you find out later.

Steen Raskopoulos 7:56 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 7:57 Did you find out later as well?

Alex Partridge 7:58 Yeah, I was 34-

Sara Pascoe 7:59 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 7:59 Right

Alex Partridge 7:59 ... when I found out, which was about a year and a half ago.

Steen Raskopoulos 8:01 Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 8:01 Yeah. And so if you, you, you do, you can't help but think what difference would it have made if someone had known this at 12, 13, 14, if you'd had support i- in those really formative years that you build-

Steen Raskopoulos 8:12 Oh, for sure

Sara Pascoe 8:12 ... the rest of your adult life on.

Steen Raskopoulos 8:14 It, it was always, like, deadlines for me in, in school. If I had, like, a deadline or, like, structure or ... Uh, that's where I kind of thrived a bit. But especially for, it was, like, a, an assessment or an essay that needed to be handed in. If I could, I've got two weeks to go. Oh, I've got a week to go. Oh, I've got... And I always used to do my essays on the, like, literally the night before, and it still happens now with my writing and my live shows kind of thing. It's like, "Oh, the festival's coming. Oh, I'll get there." And then the night before, I'm like, "Oh, what's the best way to finish this ending? Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah." And it's still a thing that I struggle with. And now I, like, uh, when I finished editing my new show now, I had to go into a hotel room in Sydney and, like, literally just be away from distraction 'cause it's so easy to wake up like, "Cool, I'm gonna start writing at 8:00." And at 7:50, you're like, "Cool, I'll go get a coffee." And as soon as it hits, like, 8:01, you've missed it. Okay. I'll, I'll just chill till 8:30. Then 8:34 comes. Oh, I'll start at definitely 9:00. And then before you know it, you're watching The Price Is Right at 6:00.

Sara Pascoe 9:08 And now one day you hate yourself. [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 9:10 Yeah. [laughs]

Alex Partridge 9:10 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 9:10 One day you're, when you're, when you're watching The Price Is Right going, "I'm a piece of shit." [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 9:15 And there's reruns as well.

Sara Pascoe 9:18 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 9:18 Yeah.

Alex Partridge 9:18 But doing stuff at last minute is very common within the ADHD community.

Sara Pascoe 9:22 Mm.

Steen Raskopoulos 9:22 Yeah.

Alex Partridge 9:22 You sort of, you need that last minute stress to get you over that procrastination hump.

Steen Raskopoulos 9:26 Yeah.

Alex Partridge 9:26 Do you see that in Sara at all?

Steen Raskopoulos 9:28 Um, I don't. No.

Sara Pascoe 9:29 [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 9:30 I don't.

Sara Pascoe 9:30 Also, the other thing is that, um, anything that, anything that's worked once, you know, in, in human psychology, it gets reinforced. So lots of people have left things to the last minute-

Steen Raskopoulos 9:41 Mm

Sara Pascoe 9:41 ... thought, you know, all the balls were gonna tumble down, and actually, you know, you get away with it. The essay gets in.

Steen Raskopoulos 9:46 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 9:46 You get a B+. You do live your life thinking, "What would have happened if I'd spent the two weeks on it?"

Steen Raskopoulos 9:51 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 9:51 But I t- I think that's what's difficult, is the people who have managed to cope in that, I mean, that, that stressful cycle.

Steen Raskopoulos 9:59 But it's also like when I started therapy again-

Sara Pascoe 10:01 Mm

Steen Raskopoulos 10:01 ... with someone, uh, who, like, specializes in ADHD, and her reasoning behind it was I get a much bigger dopamine hit-

Sara Pascoe 10:09 Mm

Steen Raskopoulos 10:09 ... of leaving e- everything to last second and then getting it done as if, like, you know, the big sprint to the finish line.

Sara Pascoe 10:14 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 10:14 Getting that kind of, um, success.

Sara Pascoe 10:15 Whereas I get dopamine from starting. D- uh, lists, organization, working a bit every day.

Steen Raskopoulos 10:21 You love a pad-

Sara Pascoe 10:22 And, and-

Steen Raskopoulos 10:22 ... and a diary. You've got, like, four diaries.

Sara Pascoe 10:23 That's it, but that's the thing. All through school and everything-

Steen Raskopoulos 10:27 Mm

Sara Pascoe 10:27 ... I did lots of writing, writing by hand, writing diaries.

Steen Raskopoulos 10:31 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 10:31 It became my job. So I don't ... And I, I genuinely enjoy doing a little bit of my work [laughs] every day-

Steen Raskopoulos 10:38 Mm

Sara Pascoe 10:38 ... not leaving it all to the last minute.

Steen Raskopoulos 10:40 No, you're so organized and planned, and-

Sara Pascoe 10:42 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 10:42 ... even if you go back to every, like, TV show or, like, uh, like, live tou- touring show kind of thing, there's always, like, a folder or a book that is, like, handwritten-

Sara Pascoe 10:53 I have hard copies of everything

Steen Raskopoulos 10:54 ... got stuff and prints out of that in a thing.

Sara Pascoe 10:56 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 10:56 And then you-

Sara Pascoe 10:57 'Cause I have to externalize it. But-

Steen Raskopoulos 10:58 Mm

Sara Pascoe 10:58 ... what I'm trying to say is I do have a process, but I've also got a process where I know the longer I spend on it, the better it will be.

Steen Raskopoulos 11:04 Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 11:05 And I c- and I, I can't bear the feeling if I've only got a short amount of time to do something, and obviously, that does sometimes happen. But I can't bear it.

Steen Raskopoulos 11:12 But also you, you spin so many plates, and, like, you do it so well.

Sara Pascoe 11:15 Yes.

Steen Raskopoulos 11:15 But also that's a reinforcement-

Sara Pascoe 11:17 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 11:17 ... so that you c- you think you can take it all on.

Sara Pascoe 11:18 But when I talk, I think my... Because I, I, because of my job, which is lots and lots of talking without really having planned, I think my brain looks scatterier than it actually is. So I have had, and this probably, this is probably where I'm slightly defensive about, um, diagnosing, is that I've had members of the public diagnose me with all kinds of different things, 'cause they do that if you're in the public eye. People get in contact and go, "By the way, did you know?" [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 11:44 Oh, I had one after I did Stay.

Sara Pascoe 11:46 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 11:46 And, like, I, 'cause I do, like, a lot of characters in my show kind of stuff. And someone, "Hey, just wanted to let you know, like, you've got sch- schizophrenia."

Sara Pascoe 11:52 [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 11:52 I'm like, "I'm just, I'm just playing different characters in a, in a show" kind of thing.

Sara Pascoe 11:56 Yeah. And this woman was like, "No, but question why you want to."

Steen Raskopoulos 11:58 No, like a, "But question why you want to." And it's like, "Okay. Thank you so much for, for that-"

Sara Pascoe 12:01 Mm.

Steen Raskopoulos 12:01 "... delightful information."

Sara Pascoe 12:02 I had a, a woman after a book signing who said, "Your brain goes very fast, and then it slows down."

Steen Raskopoulos 12:07 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 12:07 And she w- and she was trying to say that I was bipolar. And also-

Steen Raskopoulos 12:10 Oh, no

Sara Pascoe 12:10 ... also, sometimes the people diagnosing you don't really know very much. It's very dangerous, and I know we do it even in the p- we do it very lazily now.

Steen Raskopoulos 12:18 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 12:18 I mean, it, we all know a little bit about psychology And we can say, "Oh, that person's a megalomaniac, or that person's-

Steen Raskopoulos 12:24 But also, like, if you enjoyed the shows, like, "Hey, great show." [laughs] Like, "We'll come again."

Sara Pascoe 12:27 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 12:27 You don't have to be like, "Have you diagnosed this?"

Sara Pascoe 12:28 I, I just think people should be very, very careful.

Steen Raskopoulos 12:30 Mm-hmm.

Sara Pascoe 12:30 Not because there's anything negative, but because if someone is then paranoid about how they express themselves or-

Steen Raskopoulos 12:37 Mm-hmm

Sara Pascoe 12:37 ... what they're giving away about themselves-

Steen Raskopoulos 12:39 Mm

Sara Pascoe 12:39 ... I just think that, so, um ... So to answer your question [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 12:46 Which was addressed to me. [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 12:47 Yeah, which was addressed to you. No, so, yes, Sara doesn't leave things to the last minute. [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 12:53 [laughs]

Alex Partridge 12:53 Steen, you know Sara better than any of these people in the audience-

Steen Raskopoulos 12:56 Yeah

Alex Partridge 12:56 ... better than that lady at the book signing.

Steen Raskopoulos 12:58 Yeah.

Alex Partridge 12:58 What do you think? Do you think she's got ADHD?

Steen Raskopoulos 13:01 I th- I think, I think she's got, uh ... Well, it's, it's hard, 'cause I think she's so well organized and prepared, but obviously that's along the lines as well. I think, I don't, I don't know. I think, I think yes, and that's only because in terms of, uh, since my diagnosis, maybe just a bit beforehand, there's more information that, um, the, the computers are listening and obviously I'm getting more popups and-

Sara Pascoe 13:25 Mm

Steen Raskopoulos 13:25 ... and stuff like that-

Sara Pascoe 13:26 We're learning about it

Steen Raskopoulos 13:27 ... where I go, "Oh, that's Sarah. That's Sarah. That's Sarah. That's Sarah." But obviously there's-

Sara Pascoe 13:30 But it's also everyone we know.

Steen Raskopoulos 13:31 Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 13:31 But, so this is a problem for us, and maybe for some of your listeners, it's like I've ... We've all got ADHD. [laughs] Or no one's got ADHD. [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 13:38 Mm-hmm.

Sara Pascoe 13:39 Because we don't know anyone who wouldn't be covered by a lot ... And, and, and Cariad, my best friend, our friend, she, she says, "Well, that's because people with, you know, ADHD tend to socialize together, marry each other, have ADHD children." [laughs] Um, because it's genetic, so you go, "No, but my mom's like this, and my dad's like this."

Steen Raskopoulos 13:59 Ah.

Sara Pascoe 13:59 [laughs] And my entire extended family are coping-

Steen Raskopoulos 14:02 Mm

Sara Pascoe 14:02 ... with very similar symptoms. So because it seems so normal, the idea that it isn't how everyone in the world is working-

Steen Raskopoulos 14:11 Yeah

Sara Pascoe 14:11 ... is strange, isn't it? So but it is ... So, so where ... I know this is your question.

Steen Raskopoulos 14:15 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 14:16 But where we have thought, considered myself being ADHD, is, um, a lot of the things to do with having children. So, um, lots of people experience an alleviation with ADHD in pregnancy 'cause of high estrogen, so they find that it's a lot, uh, their thoughts a lot clearer and that they're a lot more focused. And then some of the things that I found difficult, I found breastfeeding really hard, really bloody boring, and apparently that can be an ADHD symptom because breastfeeding is, takes ages, and you're just sitting there waiting [laughs] for a baby to stop eating.

Steen Raskopoulos 14:47 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 14:47 And so you can't do all the things that you would normally do in terms of busyness, distracting yourself, three things do- g- going on at once. And, um, I started to struggle with things like eating. I, I, I don't want to have to do something else when I'm eating. I want to just eat. And so there, there have been things that I've then researched and I've, and it, you know, it'll come up like, oh, this is common with pe- with ADHD. They ... You know. So a lot ... There are lots of things.

Steen Raskopoulos 15:14 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 15:14 There are lots of things. And I do talk over people all the time.

Steen Raskopoulos 15:16 Oh, r-

Sara Pascoe 15:16 And when I'm [laughs] when I'm not t-

Steen Raskopoulos 15:18 Can ... No, the, the-

Sara Pascoe 15:18 When I'm not talking ... Shh. When I'm not talking-

Steen Raskopoulos 15:21 Okay. Okay.

Sara Pascoe 15:21 It's a funny joke. Um, when I'm not talking, I am telling myself in my head, "That's good. Listen. Wait to talk."

Steen Raskopoulos 15:28 Are you doing it now?

Sara Pascoe 15:30 No.

Steen Raskopoulos 15:30 Okay. [laughs]

Alex Partridge 15:32 Are there any other traits, Steen, that you notice in Sara that might suggest she has ADHD from your point of view?

Steen Raskopoulos 15:37 Oh, I think, like, the biggest ones would be t- talking or, like, but it's just, like, you're ex- you're excited, but I guess that is part of it. [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 15:45 Mm.

Steen Raskopoulos 15:45 Um, I don't think so, but they're not, like, negative things I would say. And it's also, like, I've known you that way from the beginning as well, so it's not as if suddenly-

Sara Pascoe 15:55 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 15:55 ... you've, you're acting differently now. I'm like, "Oh, I've noticed in this kind of thing."

Sara Pascoe 15:58 Yeah. But this is where I think everyone, ADHD or not, where everyone needs to f- I guess forgive themselves and a- ac- accept that it's not them that are wrong. We are being asked to do too much while being bombarded with things that are very unnatural for-

Steen Raskopoulos 16:16 Mm

Sara Pascoe 16:16 ... our brains and our emotions. We don't have any sort of peace and quiet. People have to literally, like, go to classes to, like, lie down on the floor and meditate.

Steen Raskopoulos 16:26 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 16:27 Um, we are ingesting all of the time and then swirling it around, so of course we feel overwhelmed.

Steen Raskopoulos 16:36 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 16:38 And I, I think that's where, yeah, ADHD or not, we're all, we're all juggling too much, and we think it's an ... This, this is where this, all the ro- the root of all this ADHD goes back to. The first definition I heard of it was someone, and they were talking about their dad, and they said, um, it's, um, failure to achieve potential, and that's my problem with it. So I think this is so s- everything is so success driven and potential driven, which has got nothing to do with contentedness, happiness-

Steen Raskopoulos 17:09 Mm

Sara Pascoe 17:10 ... um, feeling fulfilled. That it's very externalized, and I hate that that's why people are getting diagnosed with ADHD is to explain, "That's why you haven't got this, that, and the other." And it's like sometimes maybe we don't all want those things, need those things. It, that- that's what's overwhelming, I think. Sometimes if you're really confused and it's too much, maybe you don't need to know about it.

Steen Raskopoulos 17:35 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 17:35 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 17:36 I'd say also just buying heaps of Peppa Pig stuff for our kid, that just we don't need. It's just, like, an impulse. "Oh, do the, the grocery shopping." "Did you do it?" "No, but I got Peppa Pig pool." [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 17:46 So this is the thing about dopamine, even if you don't have ADHD. If you can buy a secondhand thing for £4 [laughs] and it can just come to your house-

Steen Raskopoulos 17:55 Mm

Sara Pascoe 17:55 ... why wouldn't you?

Steen Raskopoulos 17:57 Well, well

Steen Raskopoulos 17:59 ...

Alex Partridge 17:59 When you got your diagnosis, Steen-

Steen Raskopoulos 18:01 Yeah

Alex Partridge 18:01 ... did you feel any benefits to knowing?

Steen Raskopoulos 18:04 It was a weird way. Like, I think yes, 'cause I think I s- to be honest, the first thing I did was just stop feeling so negative towards myself and, like, a little, like, less self-hatred, I guess, and I think that helped. I think, uh, also just kind of explained a few things and then the more you kind of, uh, I read stuff and researched stuff, and as I was saying before, like leaving essays to last minute or leaving shows, like, everything, I just, like, was a pattern and was like, "Oh, no, it wasn't-" Doing it on purpose, like there was something happening, um, chemically with, or with, w- with, um, with, with myself kinda thing. So I think out of everything, that's been the nicest thing, just to be a bit less, uh, angry and, um, uh, yeah, cr- cross at myself kinda thing. I've just kind of alleviated a bit of pressure. Still, there's still obviously all different emotions towards that, but I have felt, I think, a bit more kinder to myself-

Sara Pascoe 18:57 Mm

Steen Raskopoulos 18:57 ... which has been important, especially, like, in a relationship and being a dad as well. I just ... And that was a big thing going back to therapy and getting the diagnosis 'cause I just wanna be the best dad I can be and, uh, and best partner I can be, and that comes with a bit of self-love, I think.

Sara Pascoe 19:13 Also, Steen had been sort of misdiagnosed with depression, which is very common with people with ADHD.

Steen Raskopoulos 19:18 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 19:19 And so to, to have a, a, a, a diagnosis that was closer to what you were struggling with rather than one that didn't quite feel right-

Steen Raskopoulos 19:26 Mm

Sara Pascoe 19:26 ... and also a diagnosis where, you know, it's, they're, they're very keen to m- uh, give you medicine-

Steen Raskopoulos 19:33 Mm

Sara Pascoe 19:33 ... that might not be ... If it's not the right thing for you, then that's really, you know, dangerous.

Steen Raskopoulos 19:38 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 19:38 Yeah.

Alex Partridge 19:40 Did you go through a grieving process after you got your diagnosis, sort of looking back into the old past and thinking things could've been different?

Steen Raskopoulos 19:47 Yeah, and I think that's why I started doing therapy again. Um, when I say therapy again, I just, I just went to someone who has a bit more kind of, uh, expertise, I'd say, in it, and I think that's w- what this, this journey's been about in terms of, like, yeah, re- rediscovering how I was and how I am, uh, now, but also just looking back at the younger self and being much more kinder to that-

Sara Pascoe 20:13 Mm

Steen Raskopoulos 20:13 ... to that boy kinda thing. 'Cause even when I was ... Like, my earliest memory, like, first time I ever heard, um, ADHD was someone telling my mum and my dad, "Oh, he's got ADHD."

Sara Pascoe 20:23 About you?

Steen Raskopoulos 20:23 Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then, and the thing was, um, I was just super energetic, sport. Like, I just had too much energy-

Sara Pascoe 20:30 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 20:30 ... kinda thing. And I still remember there was a drink called Lift, which I think the Coca-Cola Company made. I don't think they make it anymore, but it was like a lemony Coke, essentially, and I used to drink that after a sporting game, and I used to be off my tits. And my, my, like, my mum and dad do like spot something like, "Oh, it's the Lift. You cannot give that boy-"

Alex Partridge 20:51 [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 20:51 "... Lift," that specific drink. Anyway, and I, I was never allowed... I could still drink Coke and stuff like that, but for some reason, like, it was this, ooh, magical Lift that just made me-

Sara Pascoe 20:59 Mm

Steen Raskopoulos 20:59 ... go absolutely mental with energy kinda stuff.

Sara Pascoe 21:01 Um, Steen's parents [laughs] both have ADHD. [laughs] And one of the things that was tricky, and I think for lots of adults who are getting diagnosed, um, what, what's really hard is if you have, you know, parents or other adults in your life sort of pushing back, going, "No, no, no, that's ... "

Steen Raskopoulos 21:21 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 21:21 "We're all like that." [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 21:23 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 21:24 And 'cause they, number one, I think they feel like they failed because they didn't, they didn't catch it. They feel there's some criticism of them, that they were supposed to have known, or they just misremember. So-

Steen Raskopoulos 21:33 But also, I think, like, the, I think there's, like, a stigma towards it-

Sara Pascoe 21:35 Yes

Steen Raskopoulos 21:35 ... that they think is, like, something's wrong-

Sara Pascoe 21:37 Yes

Steen Raskopoulos 21:37 ... kind of thing as well.

Sara Pascoe 21:37 Absolutely. Rather than an adult trying to understand why they work a certain way.

Steen Raskopoulos 21:40 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 21:42 Uh, we were walking, Steen's parents were over from Australia, and we're walking along, and Steen was saying, "Well ... " And they were like, "No, but you were great at school. You were having a great time." So, and, and you were saying, "Well, I was often in detention because I," you know.

Steen Raskopoulos 21:53 Oh, I was never in detention.

Sara Pascoe 21:54 Okay. What we, let's just-

Steen Raskopoulos 21:55 One time, I sat in the headmaster's garden when I shouldn't have.

Sara Pascoe 21:57 [laughs] Okay.

Steen Raskopoulos 21:58 The only detention-

Sara Pascoe 21:59 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 21:59 ... I ever got at school.

Sara Pascoe 22:00 But you were trying to explain to them, this happened at school, or that, you know, th- that's why sport was good for me 'cause when I was exhausted, I could stay still. Or-

Steen Raskopoulos 22:07 Mm

Sara Pascoe 22:07 ... you were saying, "I can't open emails. I, you know, I, I see them, they're there."

Steen Raskopoulos 22:11 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 22:11 And your parents were both like, "No one opens emails. [laughs] You don't have to open emails."

Steen Raskopoulos 22:15 But that's the thing as well. Like-

Sara Pascoe 22:16 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 22:16 ... I don't know if you had to do, like, uh, for the tests that I had to do, like, say I filled out a form, like my mum filled out a form in terms of that kind of stuff, and when the, [laughs] when the doctor was having the chat, he's like, "Your mum doesn't think you have, like, all of these-

Sara Pascoe 22:31 [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 22:32 ... kind of things."

Sara Pascoe 22:32 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 22:32 He's like, he goes, "Speaking to your wife and speaking to this is-

Sara Pascoe 22:35 Mm

Steen Raskopoulos 22:35 ... so very different kind of thing." So I had to justify to him about-

Sara Pascoe 22:40 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 22:40 ... like, the answers my mum gave and things like that, which was hard 'cause she was, I think, writing from a perspective of, like, you know, as Sarah said, like, "He did so well at school, and he did all-

Sara Pascoe 22:49 Yes

Steen Raskopoulos 22:49 ... these things, and achievements in sport and all this kind of stuff." It's like, yeah, but I also struggled with this and struggled with that-

Sara Pascoe 22:54 Mm

Steen Raskopoulos 22:54 ... and, and, and that kind of stuff, too.

Sara Pascoe 22:55 Yeah. Um, w- I tried to explain to Steen's mum that he, he couldn't pick up a towel [laughs] um, because he was, his head was off onto the next thing, and she told me that my towels were too dark-

Steen Raskopoulos 23:07 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 23:07 ... and I should get red ones, [laughs] so that he can see them.

Steen Raskopoulos 23:10 Sage advice. [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 23:11 [laughs]

Alex Partridge 23:13 It's so funny 'cause my mum and my longtime partner did the two forms, and-

Sara Pascoe 23:16 Yeah

Alex Partridge 23:16 ... the psychologist said the exact same thing.

Sara Pascoe 23:18 Really?

Steen Raskopoulos 23:19 Yeah, right.

Alex Partridge 23:19 My mum's answers were very much like, "Nothing wrong here. Completely normal."

Sara Pascoe 23:22 Yeah. Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 23:22 Mm.

Alex Partridge 23:23 My partner's, you know, the opposite.

Sara Pascoe 23:25 Mm.

Alex Partridge 23:25 Um, and she said she sees that a lot with parents. It's not necessarily, like, a bias or, like, it sometimes is, but not always a guilt. Sometimes it's, uh, they just don't see that you're different because they-

Sara Pascoe 23:35 Yeah

Alex Partridge 23:35 ... see-

Steen Raskopoulos 23:36 Mm

Alex Partridge 23:36 ... similar in themselves.

Sara Pascoe 23:38 Mm.

Steen Raskopoulos 23:38 Yeah. That's true.

Sara Pascoe 23:39 I think it must be really hard for them. It, you know, w- we all understand, isn't it, 'cause something ha- massive is happening culturally. We're learning about, you know, how people work. A- and, um, they're, they're playing catch-up to something, and they go, "Well, h- why is everyone having it now?" And-

Steen Raskopoulos 23:57 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 23:57 ... what, and, yeah, stuck in their ways, and I do think they hear it as a negative.

Steen Raskopoulos 24:01 Oh, 100%.

Alex Partridge 24:02 Sarah, do you tend to attract neurodivergent people into your life?

Sara Pascoe 24:08 Well, what has happened is that my two best friends from university, so, you know, it's a 20-odd, probably longer than that now, um, relat- years relationship, have both been diagnosed ADHD, and then Steen, my husband, diagnosed ADHD. And in comedy, there is, has been a prolifera- pr- proliferation of diagnoses because when a couple of people got diagnosed, lots of other people- ... realized, well, you know, knowing, understanding more about something, that they also-

Steen Raskopoulos 24:45 Mm

Sara Pascoe 24:45 ... had it. So a lot of people in our, our social circle and work circle have ADHD. There are some autistic people as well, and then there are some people we know who have both because you can have [laughs] this is fun, ADHD and autism, and then sort of the conditions mask each other a little bit.

Steen Raskopoulos 25:02 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 25:02 So again, you get mi- misdiagnosed with, um, depression, bipolar disorder, complex, uh, PTSD [laughs] lots and lots of things until you f- you get your right diagnosis, which is essentially in some ways you function very, very organizedly, and, and other ways you don't. You know, you're gregarious, all those kind of things.

Steen Raskopoulos 25:22 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 25:22 They sort of o- overlapping things. So there's lots and lots of discussion about it. And then you have this other side, which is that having young children, all parents now, because you know about it, are watching your children going, "Is that a tantrum?" [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 25:35 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 25:35 "Or do we need to get this assessed?"

Steen Raskopoulos 25:37 Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 25:37 Yeah. And, and, and at what point do you help support... Something about Steen and I, and this is actually something that I, I'm really bad with, I get very excited, so I put out one food for our toddler to eat, and then I think, "Oh, we've got a pineapple. Oh, we have pasta in the fridge. Do you want toast?"

Steen Raskopoulos 25:55 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 25:55 And, uh, I'll put lots of things in front of him 'cause I'm excited.

Steen Raskopoulos 25:59 Especially if they're just eating. They're eating so well, and then this new thing gets introduced-

Sara Pascoe 26:02 Yeah, and I've already d-

Steen Raskopoulos 26:02 ... and it's a distract, yeah

Sara Pascoe 26:02 ... I've already made him spaghetti bolognese. Like, he- we should just leave it, and I get really excited about what's for dessert, and I... Well, you do this-

Steen Raskopoulos 26:08 That's the whole thing, that's so complimentary

Sara Pascoe 26:09 ... you do this as well.

Steen Raskopoulos 26:10 You think, okay, like little spag bol with red wine-

Sara Pascoe 26:11 I know

Steen Raskopoulos 26:11 ... compliments, it's like, pineapple. [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 26:12 And I'll be like, "Mango." Yeah. And I, and, um, and so I know that I distract our son a lot, and I realize that as a parent, that there, there are times when you can really help your child be focused and concentrate.

Steen Raskopoulos 26:25 Mm. Why do you think you do that?

Sara Pascoe 26:28 [laughs] Well, this is the thing, but, but, but as parents, we at least know about these things now.

Steen Raskopoulos 26:34 Mm. Mm.

Sara Pascoe 26:36 So hopefully that will be the benefit, but then you wouldn't want it to go the other way, where the children grow up and go, "They were just, you know, checking all the time." [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 26:45 Or just, and at-

Sara Pascoe 26:45 Yes

Steen Raskopoulos 26:45 ... during any meal-

Sara Pascoe 26:46 Are you, are you list-

Steen Raskopoulos 26:46 ... they just request a mango.

Sara Pascoe 26:47 Are you actually listening, or are you just waiting to speak? [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 26:51 [laughs]

Alex Partridge 26:52 We've had a couple of guests on who they've recently been made aware of ADHD.

Steen Raskopoulos 26:57 Mm.

Alex Partridge 26:57 And their children are grown up-

Sara Pascoe 27:00 Mm

Alex Partridge 27:00 ... play in their 20s, and they have tremendous guilt 'cause they look back, and they instill a lot of shame in their kids because just the way they were-

Sara Pascoe 27:06 Oh, yeah

Alex Partridge 27:07 ... around them, not knowing-

Sara Pascoe 27:08 Mm

Alex Partridge 27:08 ... the, the way they were talking to them. The, the way they were correcting behavior was probably not the right way to do it-

Steen Raskopoulos 27:12 Mm

Alex Partridge 27:13 ... for their neurotype.

Steen Raskopoulos 27:14 Mm.

Alex Partridge 27:14 Is that something you have in mind when you're parenting?

Steen Raskopoulos 27:17 I think definitely, and I think I... Like, I'm half-Greek and came from a very kind of very, not strict family, but in terms of, like, Dad was, like, the, like, you know-

Sara Pascoe 27:26 The authority figure. Mm

Steen Raskopoulos 27:27 ... the authority kind of figure kind of thing. So it was very much, you know... We, we had to leave a restaurant once because we were blowing bubbles in a straw, and it was like we didn't get to eat lunch. I was just, like, that thing. So even now-

Sara Pascoe 27:38 Oh, wow

Steen Raskopoulos 27:38 ... if a straw gets put in my cup, like, I always just take it out and put it on the side, just like that's, you know, that's what I do. Um, and I think, but that's the only parenting style that I know. So even, like, mess and stuff like that with the kids, I'm always like-

Sara Pascoe 27:52 Oh

Steen Raskopoulos 27:52 ... "Oh, should we..." And it's been so nice for Sara, and that's what, like, she's an amazing mom in that sense 'cause there's so much freedom and so much play that the kids have.

Sara Pascoe 27:59 'Cause I was brought up by, um, teenage parents, and we were feral. So-

Steen Raskopoulos 28:03 [laughs]

Alex Partridge 28:03 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 28:03 So we're very different. [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 28:07 No, but generally, like, I think our kids have so much freedom and so much more, like, m- messy play and things like that-

Sara Pascoe 28:13 Yeah, absolutely

Steen Raskopoulos 28:14 ... which, and I, I, I still, when I say to you, like, I'm trying really hard to-

Sara Pascoe 28:18 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 28:18 ... pull back from it a bit just to watch them.

Sara Pascoe 28:20 I t- there, there are actually places where you can go that are called messy play, where they have just, like, big pots of-

Steen Raskopoulos 28:25 Oh, mate, and I still go, "Oh, don't"

Sara Pascoe 28:26 ... he still really struggles with it.

Steen Raskopoulos 28:27 Like, just touch so they can turn and throw paint against, like, walls. They've got plastic sheets up and stuff.

Sara Pascoe 28:30 Yeah, it's all soggy pasta they can put in their mouths.

Steen Raskopoulos 28:32 And I'm like, "Oh, no, they shouldn't do that at messy play."

Sara Pascoe 28:35 [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 28:35 Like, "No, don't do- No."

Sara Pascoe 28:36 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 28:37 "Don't throw paint on the floor." But then we're like-

Sara Pascoe 28:38 But having, but hopefully having children will be great for you because it will be going through that journey again-

Steen Raskopoulos 28:42 Well, definitely

Sara Pascoe 28:43 ... undoing, you know, undoing your own childhood a bit.

Steen Raskopoulos 28:46 Not too much. [laughs] It's, uh,

Steen Raskopoulos 28:48 it's not a good way.

Alex Partridge 28:49 We thought we'd do a little fun section, and that's-

Sara Pascoe 28:50 Mm

Alex Partridge 28:50 ... we had a couple of questions that come from a website called Clinical Partners.

Sara Pascoe 28:55 Ooh.

Alex Partridge 28:55 And it's a very informal-

Steen Raskopoulos 28:57 Okay

Alex Partridge 28:57 ... unofficial test-

Sara Pascoe 28:59 Yeah

Alex Partridge 28:59 ... an early stage test to see if you should maybe speak to a professional-

Sara Pascoe 29:02 Ah

Alex Partridge 29:02 ... about whether or not you have ADHD.

Sara Pascoe 29:03 Mm.

Steen Raskopoulos 29:03 Okay.

Alex Partridge 29:04 Can we ask you some questions?

Sara Pascoe 29:05 Yes.

Steen Raskopoulos 29:05 Yeah.

Alex Partridge 29:05 And then we can see if you agree with them, Steen.

Steen Raskopoulos 29:07 Okay. First one, yes.

Sara Pascoe 29:10 [laughs]

Alex Partridge 29:11 [laughs] Um, just gotta say, this test will give an indication as to whether you are experiencing the most common symptoms of ADHD, but it cannot replace a full assessment, nor should it be used to self-diagnose or decide upon a treatment plan. Okay. Um, first question, and if you could answer on a scale of one to five-

Sara Pascoe 29:27 Mm-hmm

Alex Partridge 29:27 ... one being you absolutely don't agree, five being absolutely all the time.

Sara Pascoe 29:31 Okay.

Steen Raskopoulos 29:32 Okay.

Alex Partridge 29:33 First question, I find it difficult finishing a task or a project.

Steen Raskopoulos 29:36 Four and a half. Four?

Sara Pascoe 29:39 No. So i- one is I definitely don't agree.

Alex Partridge 29:43 Yeah. One is-

Sara Pascoe 29:44 I'm, I'm one

Alex Partridge 29:44 ... I'm never.

Steen Raskopoulos 29:45 Yeah, you're one.

Alex Partridge 29:45 Five is you do it all the time.

Sara Pascoe 29:47 One.

Steen Raskopoulos 29:48 Four.

Sara Pascoe 29:49 I never not finish a task.

Steen Raskopoulos 29:50 No, you're very good at that, to be fair. They call her the closer.

Sara Pascoe 29:53 [laughs]

Alex Partridge 29:54 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 29:55 Mi- Mrs. Finished, I am.

Alex Partridge 29:57 Next question, I find it difficult to organize myself or a task.

Sara Pascoe 30:02 No, one. But, but just as an addendum, which I know you don't get in quizzes-

Alex Partridge 30:07 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 30:07 ... the reason that I finish everything is that I do it absolutely instantly, 'cause if I don't think, think about it for a second, it won't get done. So it's not, it's not a pleasant feeling of, like, oh, I'm gonna do these things, and then they get done.

Alex Partridge 30:18 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 30:18 It's a panic of-

Alex Partridge 30:20 A coping mechanism maybe.

Sara Pascoe 30:21 Yeah, it's, it's, yeah, that's, that's what they might say.

Steen Raskopoulos 30:24 Yeah, I'd, I'd say, like, four again, I think.

Sara Pascoe 30:26 Four? No, one.

Steen Raskopoulos 30:27 The second one. This is for me, not for you.

Sara Pascoe 30:29 No, it's not. It's for me, and then you have to say if it's true.

Steen Raskopoulos 30:31 Oh.

Alex Partridge 30:32 Yeah, sorry. This is just for Sara.

Steen Raskopoulos 30:33 Sara. Sorry.

Alex Partridge 30:34 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 30:34 I misunderstood.

Sara Pascoe 30:34 You've already got a diagnosis.

Steen Raskopoulos 30:35 Yeah. [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 30:35 You're not gonna get re-diagnosed by an internet quiz.

Steen Raskopoulos 30:37 I was like, these questions sound very similar-

Sara Pascoe 30:39 [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 30:39 ... to ones I've done before.

Sara Pascoe 30:40 Steen, and I thought, "Why is he saying s-"

Alex Partridge 30:43 Sorry, um, I would agree. One, one. She's correct.

Sara Pascoe 30:46 Yeah.

Alex Partridge 30:46 Dr. Raskopoulos, yes. [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 30:47 [laughs]

Alex Partridge 30:48 Next question, if a task or project requires a lot of thought, I will often delay in getting it started.

Sara Pascoe 30:54 No, one again.

Steen Raskopoulos 30:55 Yeah.

Alex Partridge 30:55 See which way this is going, I think.

Sara Pascoe 30:57 Yeah.

Alex Partridge 30:57 I find it difficult to sit still and often fidget or squirm.

Sara Pascoe 31:01 You looked at my wiggly foot then, didn't you?

Alex Partridge 31:02 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 31:03 You looked at my tapping foot.

Steen Raskopoulos 31:03 My eyes just glanced down.

Sara Pascoe 31:04 My dad used to say I had my engine running, so I do constantly... Yeah, I wiggle, and I have to, and I wig-

Steen Raskopoulos 31:11 You rock to sleep as well

Sara Pascoe 31:11 ... even in my sleep, I rock to sleep. But my dad say, "Yeah, I've got my engines running"

Steen Raskopoulos 31:15 I thought she used to wear, like, headphones asleep, 'cause she'd always be, like, bopping in bed.

Sara Pascoe 31:18 [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 31:18 I'm like, "What's going?" And she's like, "No"

Sara Pascoe 31:19 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 31:20 That's how she rocks herself to sleep.

Sara Pascoe 31:21 Yeah. And again, lots of that in my family.

Alex Partridge 31:22 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 31:23 [laughs] Lots of, like, those people just rocking back and forth.

Alex Partridge 31:28 I would describe myself as being on the go and feel compelled to do things, as if I'm driven by a motor.

Sara Pascoe 31:35 Yeah, put that-

Steen Raskopoulos 31:35 You just called yourself the engine mate, so you can answer that one

Sara Pascoe 31:36 ... I think that's true.

Steen Raskopoulos 31:37 Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 31:38 That's, that's a five.

Alex Partridge 31:39 Five. I find it hard to remain focused in group settings.

Sara Pascoe 31:44 No, it's one again. Hmm.

Steen Raskopoulos 31:47 When I say focused, I think in terms of, like, interjecting and interrupting kind of thing, if people are talking.

Sara Pascoe 31:53 That's because I'm focused on what's going on.

Alex Partridge 31:55 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 31:57 Um, me and my two friends from university can listen and talk at the same time.

Steen Raskopoulos 32:02 It is something to behold.

Sara Pascoe 32:03 [laughs] So all three of us can talk and listen at the same time.

Steen Raskopoulos 32:07 Mate, it's wild.

Sara Pascoe 32:08 Our boyfriends have never liked it. [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 32:09 [laughs] It's... Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 32:11 Mm-hmm.

Alex Partridge 32:12 I make decisions quickly and fail to think through the consequences.

Sara Pascoe 32:17 Yeah, that's a four.

Steen Raskopoulos 32:19 Yeah, you do that.

Alex Partridge 32:20 My mind feels cluttered, and it is hard for me to concentrate on one thing at a time.

Sara Pascoe 32:25 Yeah, that's a five.

Alex Partridge 32:26 I'm often irritable with a short fuse.

Sara Pascoe 32:28 Yeah, a five.

Steen Raskopoulos 32:29 Oh, who's making a comeback? [laughs]

Alex Partridge 32:31 It's the last-minute comeback. [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 32:32 Here comes the fives. [laughs]

Alex Partridge 32:34 Yeah. She dots going, "Oh, I'm gonna cry"

Steen Raskopoulos 32:36 Oh, with a couple more points. Here we go. [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 32:39 [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 32:41 Get out of the way.

Alex Partridge 32:43 I have mood swings-

Sara Pascoe 32:44 Five

Alex Partridge 32:44 ... sometimes.

Steen Raskopoulos 32:45 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 32:46 [laughs]

Alex Partridge 32:47 Last one.

Steen Raskopoulos 32:48 [laughs]

Alex Partridge 32:48 I often miss what is being said to me in conversations.

Sara Pascoe 32:51 Five, yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 32:52 Yeah.

Alex Partridge 32:53 So we've got-

Steen Raskopoulos 32:53 Finished strong.

Alex Partridge 32:55 We started off on all the ones, and then we ended-

Sara Pascoe 32:57 Yeah

Alex Partridge 32:57 ... gravitated towards-

Sara Pascoe 32:58 So, so task... This is the thing, yeah. Task wise, stuff gets done, but then I've never ever had anyone help me. Not in a, "I went to university of hard knocks" kind of way.

Alex Partridge 33:11 Right.

Sara Pascoe 33:11 But I've always had to, I've always been the only adult in my life.

Steen Raskopoulos 33:14 Yeah. But I think you're so resilient-

Sara Pascoe 33:15 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 33:15 ... in that sense, too. Like, you just-

Sara Pascoe 33:17 Mm-hmm.

Steen Raskopoulos 33:17 No matter how tired, how many different projects, and all that kind of stuff-

Sara Pascoe 33:21 Mm

Steen Raskopoulos 33:21 ... that you have, you, you always, like-

Sara Pascoe 33:24 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 33:24 ... you always finish. I've never seen her not finish a task. Comp- compliment.

Sara Pascoe 33:30 [laughs]

Alex Partridge 33:31 With the mood swings, is there... I mean, obviously-

Sara Pascoe 33:33 Oh, yeah

Alex Partridge 33:33 ... everyone is sensitive to rejection.

Sara Pascoe 33:34 Yes.

Alex Partridge 33:35 But are you, are you particularly volatile to rejection?

Sara Pascoe 33:37 Yeah, it really, really-

Steen Raskopoulos 33:38 Stings, yeah

Sara Pascoe 33:38 ... scalds.

Steen Raskopoulos 33:40 Mm-hmm.

Sara Pascoe 33:40 I had a gig on Saturday, and I, I went home, and, um, I think, I think one of the... I, I think one of the other comedians didn't like me. She just sort of told me off for gossiping, and when, you know, three days later, I'm reflecting on it. She didn't really tell me off, but I felt told off, and, you know, went home, got drunk on the train, started smoking, so [laughs]

Alex Partridge 33:59 Well, you did.

Sara Pascoe 34:00 Yeah. [laughs] Because, I mean, 'cause it, it, it's so horrible, and actually, that's something about-

Steen Raskopoulos 34:05 You smoked on a train? Bad boy

Sara Pascoe 34:06 ... there's something about ADHD, which is really great to know that that rejection thing... And also I've, you know, I've cut people out of my life because I've done something wrong, [laughs] and they, they know it. [laughs] Yeah, I, I do have that one badly. It's awful, isn't it?

Alex Partridge 34:25 It's often described as the worst debilitating trait of or part of ADHD specifically.

Sara Pascoe 34:31 Yeah.

Alex Partridge 34:31 And that is visceral, really debilitating-

Sara Pascoe 34:32 Yeah

Alex Partridge 34:33 ... physical reaction to criticism.

Sara Pascoe 34:34 But it's the same part of the brain. I mean, you, you are, you do, you do feel it as pain.

Steen Raskopoulos 34:39 Mm-hmm.

Sara Pascoe 34:40 And it's the opposite of, you know, it's the opposite of the lovely dopamine, serotonin, lovely neurotransmitters feelings. It's that panicky-

Steen Raskopoulos 34:49 Mm

Sara Pascoe 34:49 ... you are about, you are socially ostracized. In our evolution, feeling like that, if you're not part of the group, is very, very powerful. You want to feel liked and safe, and that does mean that you are safe-

Steen Raskopoulos 35:02 Mm

Sara Pascoe 35:03 ... within a tribe. So I think that, that heightened sense of it. And again, I don't know anyone who would say, "No, I don't mind. I don't mind being told off." We... Everyone hates it, don't they?

Steen Raskopoulos 35:13 Oh, man, confrontation and conflict as well. I hate it.

Sara Pascoe 35:16 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 35:17 I've hated so much. Even when people are talking to me, like, in retail shops, it's like, "Please don't. Like, please don't"

Alex Partridge 35:22 [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 35:22 I just, I won't even try it on. I'll just buy it, and I'll leave. Thank you so much. Bye-bye. [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 35:25 Yeah. Steen can't have a conversation with me on public transport.

Steen Raskopoulos 35:28 That's not true. I don't like having, like, a, a, an argument with you in, in public.

Sara Pascoe 35:32 But he would define almost any conversation as an argument [laughs] if other people can hear you.

Steen Raskopoulos 35:38 It's true.

Alex Partridge 35:38 Do you think if someone gets a criticism or rejection, do you think then going on to smoke on a train is a typical-

Sara Pascoe 35:44 [laughs]

Alex Partridge 35:44 ... reaction?

Steen Raskopoulos 35:45 It's harder.

Sara Pascoe 35:45 No, no, I'm a baby. I'm a baby about it, yeah. Um, no, I don't think it's a ty- a typical reaction. But in terms of comics, uh, comedians as a species who are desperate to be liked and then have a very fragile ego, it's a very c- it's very common. We have a job which exacerbates-

Steen Raskopoulos 36:05 Mm

Sara Pascoe 36:05 ... certain personality traits rather than making you grow up and be more balanced. Or even just rather than the world going, "Hey, you know what? It's not that important", we don't do that.

Steen Raskopoulos 36:16 Oh, man.

Sara Pascoe 36:17 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 36:17 But even, like, you know, I choose acting as a job, and that's, it's just damn hard-

Sara Pascoe 36:21 Oh, yeah. Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 36:22 ... work, you know, in terms of the r- amount of rejection you get, and... But then, like, the pendulums, you know, when you do book stuff, is, like, the biggest dopamine hit-

Sara Pascoe 36:29 Mm

Steen Raskopoulos 36:29 ... you can get kind of thing.

Sara Pascoe 36:30 Mm.

Steen Raskopoulos 36:30 But it does hit you hard in terms of, like, "I'm not good enough on this." And it could just literally be like, "He's too tall" or like-

Sara Pascoe 36:37 Mm

Steen Raskopoulos 36:37 ... "His shoes are too..." But, you know, so we never really-

Sara Pascoe 36:39 Yeah, it's brutal.

Steen Raskopoulos 36:40 Yeah.

Alex Partridge 36:42 And within your relationship, this sensitivity to rejection, criticism, does that cause issues?

Sara Pascoe 36:48 Hmm. I would say it definitely does

Steen Raskopoulos 36:52 I think so. And it's just more like, 'cause, uh, uh, from my perspective, if, if I don't get sleep, I get close to stuff, or, you know, or if we both have bad gigs-

Sara Pascoe 36:59 Oh

Steen Raskopoulos 36:59 ... kind of stuff, we... You take that feeling-

Sara Pascoe 37:00 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 37:00 ... you take that emotion and bring it to the home, and I think that's what's hard, to shut that side of stuff off, especially once... And we don't usually, like, talk of work at home, but once you get home or that kind of feeling stays with you, you're, you're still going on your life, especially like with the, with the boys now too, and you don't, like, you don't want that feeling, but it's stuck.

Sara Pascoe 37:19 But more than that, I think sometimes what we have with you, Steen-

Steen Raskopoulos 37:24 Mm

Sara Pascoe 37:24 ... is that you hear criticism where y- I don't think I've criticized. So I think we're talking about... So here's an example. So there's something with toddlers where they do naughty things, but you're not supposed to call them naughty. Uh, you know, they act out for attention, and they have no idea about positive or negative attention, and, um, so s- our son will throw carrots on the floor, and Steen will pick up the carrots and, like, look into his eyes and say, "We don't throw carrots. We need to stop throwing carrots. It's not good. Mommy was gonna cook with those carrots." And then Theodore, of course, now starts throwing carrots more, da, da, da. And then afterwards, I'll say, "Well, that's what we're not supposed to be doing." I, I was ignoring him throwing the carrots to hope that he would stop, and he will hear a huge criticism there. Right?

Steen Raskopoulos 38:05 Often you are shouting at the time. [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 38:06 [laughs] Whereas I, I, I feel like I'm just reminding him that it's really difficult to remember, but we have to keep pointing out to each other when we've fallen into the trap of, you know.

Steen Raskopoulos 38:16 But I think with that, like hearing criticism or not hearing, or it being addressed as criticism, is the same point that I deal with in terms of, like, options and choice kind of thing before, whereas like you've... You're scared of making a mistake, if that makes sense. So like, in terms of that, it feels like even if it's just like, "Hey, this is what," you know, blah, blah, blah, it feels like, "Oh, I've, I've made a mistake," or, "I've done something wrong," and then that's-

Sara Pascoe 38:36 And you go into shut, you go into shutdown mode

Steen Raskopoulos 38:38 ... and then you shut down-

Sara Pascoe 38:38 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 38:38 ... and like you feel that emotion so much harder of like, "I can't believe I've done that," whether it's... And also, like, parenting-

Sara Pascoe 38:43 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 38:43 ... there's so many different ways and so many different, um, things to kind of-

Sara Pascoe 38:46 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 38:46 ... address where you... I don't know. And you can't null everything, so-

Sara Pascoe 38:49 And the pressure, the pressure to be right is more important-

Steen Raskopoulos 38:51 Yeah

Sara Pascoe 38:51 ... because you're trying not... You're trying to help your kids. But Steen will just, s- the conversation will stop, and he, he won't even realize that he hasn't replied to me. He's just completely silent, sort of drifts away. There's this sort of cloud in the house, and he will think we've finished a conversation.

Steen Raskopoulos 39:10 Mm-hmm.

Sara Pascoe 39:10 And, and, and so we have to do lots of... I'm actually, I think I might have heard it on your podcast, but some, um, a relationship therapist saying you can sort of, you can sort of flag, "I'm not criticizing you."

Steen Raskopoulos 39:19 It's almost like you pick up like a red towel and, like, shake it around.

Sara Pascoe 39:22 [laughs] But you can say to someone, "This isn't, this isn't criticism."

Steen Raskopoulos 39:25 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 39:26 "This is what we're trying to do," or, "This is what we didn't get, we didn't do there."

Steen Raskopoulos 39:30 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 39:30 "I'm not criticizing you."

Steen Raskopoulos 39:31 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 39:31 "I'm trying to talk about the stuff." Yeah.

Alex Partridge 39:34 The same relationship therapist described a very similar situation-

Sara Pascoe 39:37 Yeah

Alex Partridge 39:37 ... to what you've just said, about the neurodivergent partner can just shut down, and it's not always o- or immediately obvious why to the other partner.

Sara Pascoe 39:45 Yes. Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 39:46 Mm.

Alex Partridge 39:46 They've said something that you didn't mean as a criticism-

Sara Pascoe 39:47 Mm

Alex Partridge 39:47 ... or a rejection, but you've perceived it as one.

Steen Raskopoulos 39:50 Mm.

Alex Partridge 39:50 And therefore, you've had that reaction. May- maybe kept it internalized.

Steen Raskopoulos 39:54 Oh, for sure. And I think it's-

Alex Partridge 39:55 You think it's gone non-verbal-

Sara Pascoe 39:56 Yeah

Alex Partridge 39:56 ... shut down-

Steen Raskopoulos 39:57 Yeah

Alex Partridge 39:57 ... completely different as to what you were 30 seconds ago, and the conversation could carry on-

Sara Pascoe 40:00 Mm

Alex Partridge 40:00 ... from yourself.

Sara Pascoe 40:01 Yeah.

Alex Partridge 40:02 But because you don't realize maybe that you've triggered something within him-

Sara Pascoe 40:05 Yeah

Alex Partridge 40:05 ... then it's, you're almost having two separate conversations at that point.

Sara Pascoe 40:08 Yeah. Or trying to justify it, or trying to dig yourself out of a hole, not realizing that once the physiological thing has happened, this is the state you're in-

Alex Partridge 40:14 Mm

Sara Pascoe 40:14 ... and you do sort of have to wait for them to come back out. You can't talk your way out of it.

Steen Raskopoulos 40:19 No.

Sara Pascoe 40:19 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 40:19 And also, like, the non-verbal thing is, like, in terms of not talk your way out of it, it's more the self-criticism of like, "Why did I do that? Like, I've spoken about it before."

Sara Pascoe 40:27 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 40:27 Like, "I've done this. I've done that." And it's just more self a- analyzing, not shutting off. It's more-

Sara Pascoe 40:31 But you can't do it out loud, can you?

Steen Raskopoulos 40:32 No, no, kind of like internally-

Sara Pascoe 40:33 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 40:33 ... having those conversations, whether I feel like there's too much happening and having to go somewhere a bit quieter to kind of address it.

Alex Partridge 40:41 Mm.

Steen Raskopoulos 40:41 I think I've always done that as a kid as well. Like, always just really been quiet within my thoughts to try and figure out why I did something wrong or right kind of thing.

Sara Pascoe 40:51 Mm.

Steen Raskopoulos 40:52 We're learning.

Sara Pascoe 40:53 [laughs]

Alex Partridge 40:54 Just realized, we didn't do the answers to the, to the, uh, multiple choice. [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 40:58 We just, we just diagnosed it ourselves and carried on. [laughs]

Alex Partridge 41:01 What did we score, Luke?

Sara Pascoe 41:02 It was 25 out of 50, so basically, like, not consistent with ADHD.

Steen Raskopoulos 41:07 That's what you said you didn't have-

Sara Pascoe 41:07 But I said, uh, uh, that's why I think I'm in the squ- I'm in the squidge. Uh, and I, and I think there is, there was a lot of people in the squidge, and I think that's why I think it's amazing about a diagnosis for people who want it, need to be easier on themselves, need coping mechanisms, maybe need medication.

Steen Raskopoulos 41:22 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 41:22 But there are other people who should be able to sympathize with people with ADHD, but, and, and, and have, and have an overlap-

Steen Raskopoulos 41:29 Mm

Sara Pascoe 41:29 ... but don't need personally. And maybe it's because, you know, I get my work done. I'm not struggling with certain things. You can have that conversation with yourself and go, "All right. [laughs] I can really, I can, um, absolutely empathize with some of the things that people with ADHD are going through, and other people in my life with ADHD."

Steen Raskopoulos 41:48 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 41:48 "Help me support them better," while also thinking there's things that I could do to myself environmentally. Like, my problems are [laughs] stress, mood swings, and irritability, and then, but if you looked at my life and my workload, you'd go, "Well, there's your problem." [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 42:01 But also, like, you do need sleep.

Sara Pascoe 42:02 You're doing that, and your kids don't sleep.

Steen Raskopoulos 42:03 With the kids.

Sara Pascoe 42:03 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 42:03 Our kids don't sleep.

Sara Pascoe 42:04 So they're environmental.

Steen Raskopoulos 42:06 Mm, mm.

Sara Pascoe 42:06 A lot of the changes that should be made to my life are do less.

Steen Raskopoulos 42:10 Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 42:11 Yeah, get a couple more husbands [laughs] to help out around the house.

Steen Raskopoulos 42:15 Snap more sticks.

Alex Partridge 42:15 Get a couple more trains. [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 42:16 Yeah. [laughs]

Alex Partridge 42:18 I wanna do the Washing machine of woes.

Steen Raskopoulos 42:19 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 42:20 [laughs]

Alex Partridge 42:20 Every week, I ask my Instagram community for their biggest ADHD woes, and it goes in a washing machine, because for me, the washing machine represents my biggest woe, which is memory loss.

Steen Raskopoulos 42:29 Wow.

Alex Partridge 42:29 I always forget my washing in the machine-

Sara Pascoe 42:31 Oh

Alex Partridge 42:31 ... similar to your dishwasher story.

Sara Pascoe 42:32 I know, but the washing-

Steen Raskopoulos 42:33 Preach on, brother Paul

Sara Pascoe 42:34 ... washing machine is the thing that made me just not understand how I was living with an adult male who there's four stages of washing, and he will only do one of them.

Steen Raskopoulos 42:43 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 42:44 So if I say-

Alex Partridge 42:45 Mm

Sara Pascoe 42:45 ... "I, I'm refusing to wash your gym, gym stuff. Stop putting it in the washing basket like someone else is gonna come along and do it." So he puts a wash on, which then is in the washing machine until I say to him You need to get the washing out, and then it will dr- it will be on the dryer-

Steen Raskopoulos 42:58 But do you know what's funny?

Sara Pascoe 42:58 ... for weeks, and he will just use it like a wardrobe

Steen Raskopoulos 43:00 My, my family owns a commercial laundry business.

Sara Pascoe 43:03 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 43:04 And since the age-

Sara Pascoe 43:04 He's had his washing done for him forever

Steen Raskopoulos 43:06 ... since about, since the age of 11, I used to have to go work at the factory-

Alex Partridge 43:09 Mm

Steen Raskopoulos 43:09 ... as a kid in school holidays from like 4:30 in the morning till 10:00. So in terms of going on deliveries, like-

Sara Pascoe 43:14 Mm

Steen Raskopoulos 43:14 ... picking up washings from hospitals, nursing homes and all that-

Sara Pascoe 43:16 'Cause someone else reminded you to do it, and also-

Steen Raskopoulos 43:18 ... throwing back. And also working on the dryers, like unloading, loading dryers. I, I think I've done enough for my lifetime, you know?

Sara Pascoe 43:21 But, but, but your mom, but, but, but your mom did your washing for your entire life.

Alex Partridge 43:25 What an accommodation.

Sara Pascoe 43:26 And still when you go home.

Steen Raskopoulos 43:28 Speak, huh?

Sara Pascoe 43:28 Your mom does your washing.

Steen Raskopoulos 43:31 It's her love language.

Sara Pascoe 43:32 [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 43:32 That's her [laughs] that's her love language.

Alex Partridge 43:35 Right.

Sara Pascoe 43:36 Okay.

Alex Partridge 43:36 This week in the Washing machine of woes.

Sara Pascoe 43:37 Yeah.

Alex Partridge 43:38 My husband won't get a diagnosis because he doesn't want to know and doesn't really care about labels, but I'm convinced it will help him understand me and make us stronger as a couple.

Sara Pascoe 43:48 Oh.

Alex Partridge 43:48 How can I convince him to get assessed or at least see someone?

Sara Pascoe 43:52 Well, this is interesting because if she says, "Help to understand me," that's very different to understanding himself.

Alex Partridge 43:58 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 43:59 If she's saying, "Will you understand more about ADHD so that you can help me," that's a very different thing to resist than someone saying, "Also, you've got it, and I know you have, and you have to..."

Alex Partridge 44:11 Testify. Yeah

Sara Pascoe 44:12 ... the accusatory nature of that. They're separate asks, and it feels like one might lead into the other, but it also might not. It might not, and she might have to be okay with that. And if he's doing all the work to understand and support her, then hopefully that would be enough.

Alex Partridge 44:27 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 44:28 But ... Because that's the main thing, isn't it? I- I- Asking a partner to understand you, they shouldn't resist that.

Alex Partridge 44:35 No.

Sara Pascoe 44:37 But I can understand why, obviously, I could understand why someone might say, "Yeah, if I am, I don't need a label for it." And I think that's my, that's my definition of the squ- the squidge of going, "Yeah, but I feel fine. I accept myself as this."

Steen Raskopoulos 44:50 I feel like you're gonna start like some merch, like the squidge merch.

Alex Partridge 44:52 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 44:54 Do you?

Steen Raskopoulos 44:55 Yeah, 100%.

Sara Pascoe 44:56 [laughs] I'm not adding any more admin into my life.

Steen Raskopoulos 44:59 You love admin. She loves admin.

Sara Pascoe 45:00 Okay. Do you know how much ... Me ... Right. Design merch. Get a designer. Get some costings. Where are we getting this made? Go on Dragon's Den.

Steen Raskopoulos 45:07 You're the clothes maker. [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 45:09 Get someone there. [laughs]

Alex Partridge 45:10 I wanna do your ADHD item, Steen.

Steen Raskopoulos 45:12 Yes.

Alex Partridge 45:13 Um, I ask all my guests for an item that most represents ADHD-

Steen Raskopoulos 45:17 [laughs]

Alex Partridge 45:17 ... in their life, and yours is, is to be revealed underneath this cloth.

Steen Raskopoulos 45:20 Yeah.

Alex Partridge 45:20 I'll lift up the cloth. Right. First time we've done that.

Steen Raskopoulos 45:23 Yep.

Alex Partridge 45:24 And I'll let you explain what this is.

Steen Raskopoulos 45:26 Yeah. So you asked me, you sent me an email like, "Hey, we do this, uh, little section. If you could um..." So I said, "Hey, mate, um, my ADHD item would be the prescription dated the 08/11/2023 for ADHD medication that I haven't gone in to get yet. Thanks, Steen."

Alex Partridge 45:44 I mean, it's the perfect summary, isn't it?

Steen Raskopoulos 45:45 Yep.

Alex Partridge 45:46 And you still haven't got it?

Steen Raskopoulos 45:47 I haven't got it, baby.

Alex Partridge 45:48 Do you think you'd benefit from medication? Do you think you need it, or you're not ... You obviously-

Steen Raskopoulos 45:52 So my, my biggest thing, and I, I've been ... Like I've ... So my biggest thing is I was at a, a, a low point in 2017, and I was prescribed antidepressants. And I think back then, there was so many things happening that kind of justified why, why I was feeling that way. But I, I got a misdiagnosed. People were like, "Oh, you got depression, got anxiety," all this stuff. So they, they gave me antidepressants to take-

Sara Pascoe 46:12 And you were coerced into taking them

Steen Raskopoulos 46:13 ... and I was coerced. I was very pressurized into like, "Get this, get this," blah, blah, blah. And then I took these antidepressants for six months, and that was always the plan of like, I don't wanna ... Like I just wanna correct, just to feel a, a bit better kinda thing, and then, and then stop it kinda thing. Um, and then af- I just felt something was changing, like chemically in me, like just in terms of I started to change in personality and then as myself and like, obviously side effects were taking place as well, and then the way they, uh, withdrew me from them, what I found out now was way more aggressive and than should have been done. So in terms of like taking a full tablet, then they said, you know, take a three-quarter for couple weeks and a half

Sara Pascoe 46:54 Yeah, they should have weaned you off the dosage

Steen Raskopoulos 46:56 ... and I was ... And they just weaned me off pretty much cold turkey kinda thing, which made it, uh, for a few months, it really, uh, upset a lot of my emotions and, and, um, just didn't center myself, I would say-

Sara Pascoe 47:09 Mm

Steen Raskopoulos 47:09 ... or correct it, or I, I don't think I've ever truly gone back to the state I was before I started taking them, if that makes sense. But I know now ADHD medication and antidepressants are two very different kind of things.

Sara Pascoe 47:22 But, but you've ... But because you'd had a bad experience with a medication from a doctor who said, "This will make you feel better," and it didn't-

Steen Raskopoulos 47:30 Mm

Sara Pascoe 47:30 ... the idea of drugs for ... is really terrifying.

Steen Raskopoulos 47:34 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 47:34 And so Steen has ... I mean, how many times have you Googled-

Steen Raskopoulos 47:37 Oh, the, the, the side effects

Sara Pascoe 47:38 ... and read, and read of people saying-

Steen Raskopoulos 47:39 The same thing in terms of like doing the shopping, whatever. It's like you read the side effects and wonder if I don't, if this does work or-

Sara Pascoe 47:43 And it's cyclical. It's cyclical because on one ha- hand, you go, this could help with some of the things you-

Steen Raskopoulos 47:47 Mm

Sara Pascoe 47:47 ... are struggling with day to day.

Steen Raskopoulos 47:49 Mm-mm.

Sara Pascoe 47:49 And then, you know, in a bigger way, with your job and the fact that you are a self-employed person who has to organize himself, and essentially-

Steen Raskopoulos 47:57 Well, that too

Sara Pascoe 47:57 ... your career is you.

Steen Raskopoulos 47:58 Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 47:58 So the fact that medication might help that is so enticing-

Steen Raskopoulos 48:01 Mm

Sara Pascoe 48:01 ... but it's a gamble because you've had a bad experience with medication before, which means-

Steen Raskopoulos 48:06 Yeah

Sara Pascoe 48:06 ... that you always then come back to, I don't know if I should take it or not.

Steen Raskopoulos 48:09 It's that too as well. Like it really affected my work and my creativity and, and that kind of stuff, so I was just very reluctant to do something again. As you said, uh, people ... Mm, my, my sister has ADHD, and she, she's on medication, and she said, "Steen, like this really helps," blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I have other people who have the same, um, prescription, said, "Hey, this has helped me," blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, kind of thing. Um, but I'm still just very-

Sara Pascoe 48:31 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 48:31 ... I'm still very reluctant and very ... And maybe I will try it one day, but I've tried to do other things in terms of be consistent with my exercise and, and routines kind of stuff and see how that-

Sara Pascoe 48:39 And understanding that you have low dopamine, that the things that can boost it.

Steen Raskopoulos 48:43 Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 48:43 One of the most amazing things, and I think this is for all people, if you understand dopamine, you get a little bit-

Steen Raskopoulos 48:48 It's just the smoke on the train.

Sara Pascoe 48:49 Yeah. [laughs] You get a little bit of dopamine by completing tasks. So doing s- s- And, and obviously, it's very, very difficult sometimes.

Steen Raskopoulos 48:56 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 48:56 But to motivate yourself to do tiny little tasks, and then the achievement of those tiny ones can sort of get you enough momentum to get onto the bigger things.

Steen Raskopoulos 49:02 Remember, like, on the podcast thing, when they said like make the bed first thing in the morning-

Alex Partridge 49:04 Mm

Steen Raskopoulos 49:04 ... things like that.

Sara Pascoe 49:05 That really helped, Steen.

Steen Raskopoulos 49:06 Oh, yeah.

Sara Pascoe 49:06 And the kitchen's clean every morning now.

Steen Raskopoulos 49:08 But that's what I do, like to go to bed now. It's like I try and clean the kitchen, or at least-

Sara Pascoe 49:12 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 49:12 ... like do the washing up. Just something that it does feel, ah, I can go to bed now. Like I've completed ... Like Chris says-

Sara Pascoe 49:18 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 49:18 ... things, like I've completed something I can now- Safely relax and not think, "Oh, when I wake up, I've got to do all these other things-

Sara Pascoe 49:23 Mm

Steen Raskopoulos 49:23 ... as well as do X, Y, and Zed," kind of thing. So it has been nice in that sense. And even getting, like, exercise-

Sara Pascoe 49:28 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 49:28 ... and routine same slot kind of thing, I think helps.

Sara Pascoe 49:30 But so come back to the, the admin of the prescription, it's so huge, and it's just sitting there.

Steen Raskopoulos 49:39 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 49:39 And you still don't know because you don't know what the right answer is.

Steen Raskopoulos 49:42 Yeah. I'm scared of making a mistake.

Sara Pascoe 49:44 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 49:44 The same with-

Sara Pascoe 49:45 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 49:45 ... um, things I've said before, like I'm wary of making a mistake rather than like this could be a thing, and, um, it could work, and it could not, and it could fail, and that's how we live our lives creatively.

Sara Pascoe 49:54 [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 49:54 Like, we try stuff. We fail-

Sara Pascoe 49:56 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 49:56 ... we go again, but-

Sara Pascoe 49:56 But this feels too big.

Steen Raskopoulos 49:57 Yeah, I think this feels too big as a problem-

Alex Partridge 49:59 Mm

Steen Raskopoulos 49:59 ... at the moment. At least very-

Sara Pascoe 50:00 Do you do take medication?

Alex Partridge 50:02 No, I don't.

Sara Pascoe 50:02 No.

Alex Partridge 50:02 I think it's very common for people to be unsure.

Steen Raskopoulos 50:05 Mm.

Alex Partridge 50:05 I've had spoken to hundreds of people, and for half of them, it's been a life changer, game-changer.

Steen Raskopoulos 50:10 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 50:10 Mm.

Alex Partridge 50:10 For others, it's been really, really negative experience.

Steen Raskopoulos 50:12 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 50:12 Yeah.

Alex Partridge 50:13 I'm quite similar to you, by the sounds of it. I'm sort of lucky enough to work in a way that I don't need medication to help me manage my time because I can work when I want-

Sara Pascoe 50:24 Mm-hmm

Alex Partridge 50:24 ... where I want. If I had to work in an office-

Steen Raskopoulos 50:27 Mm

Alex Partridge 50:27 ... and be sat at a desk 9:00 till 5:00 and stare at a screen, I think it might be a different story.

Steen Raskopoulos 50:32 Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 50:32 Mm.

Alex Partridge 50:32 [tsking] Um, still undecided, but no, I manage it with exercise-

Steen Raskopoulos 50:36 Mm-hmm

Alex Partridge 50:36 ... diet, um, cold showers now thanks to TJ Power, who-

Sara Pascoe 50:40 Oh, lovely.

Steen Raskopoulos 50:40 Yeah, yeah.

Alex Partridge 50:40 Yeah, yeah. Um, want to talk about your book.

Sara Pascoe 50:44 All right.

Alex Partridge 50:44 Your

Alex Partridge 50:45 book's called Weirdo.

Sara Pascoe 50:46 Yeah.

Alex Partridge 50:47 [tsking] Um, even though it's a novel-

Sara Pascoe 50:49 Mm

Alex Partridge 50:49 ... are there auto-biographical references, and did you feel weird growing up?

Sara Pascoe 50:57 I did feel weird growing up, not quite in the same way as the character of Sophie, who is the weirdo in the book Weirdo, but I wrote it straight after having a baby, and it was only really recently, so a couple of years after getting it written, that, um, I was interviewed. So we did a book interview in Brighton, and she said, "Oh, it's really funny 'cause all of these symptoms, um, or all of these behaviors that Sophie's got, sort of like paranoia, um, you know, she sort of, uh, she has, uh, occasionally, like, sexual... Not fantasies. What's she do? Like, visualizations of things, um, h- her brain creating stories about people seeing her and not liking her." And she said to me, "A lot of that's like postpartum psychosis," and I realized, oh, it was much more [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 51:43 Closer, yeah.

Sara Pascoe 51:43 Yeah, that, that, that, a- actually, I just had a baby. I was very isolated at home all the time. I wasn't sleeping, and that's probably the similarity that I had a little bit with the character in sort of b- being very much in my own brain and having lots of things going on in my head that I couldn't express, or I would worry if I expressed it, that you'd be seen as mad.

Steen Raskopoulos 52:03 Mm.

Alex Partridge 52:04 What's your writing process like?

Sara Pascoe 52:08 Well, I don't have any routine, but I do it when I can. So when I had had the baby, what I would do is I would get Ubers to gigs because I knew that if the journey was 45 minutes or an hour, I would have two hours to write, and I would just write on my laptop in the back. It really has been, like, fitting it in when you can. I, I, I can't believe the days, the empty days I used to have-

Steen Raskopoulos 52:33 Mm

Sara Pascoe 52:33 ... to do work 'cause now I have very, very short windows, and essentially I just do it then, whether I... And there's no, like, do I want to or not? It's like that's the only time you've got, so you get it done.

Steen Raskopoulos 52:42 But also that's why, like, amazing your interviews. Like, you, you spin so many plates, and you get... You just get things done-

Sara Pascoe 52:49 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 52:49 ... all the time.

Sara Pascoe 52:50 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 52:50 And, like, of an amazing kind of effort and, um-

Sara Pascoe 52:56 Yeah, I've got this, like, angry army major in my... What would I say? Um, as my inner voice, essentially going, "If you want to do this, it has to be done. [laughs] If you want to..."

Steen Raskopoulos 53:11 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 53:11 I want... I was, I was... I really wanted the, my career. I wanted this career when I was a teenager, and now I sort of have everything I ever wanted. So there's this army major going, "You wanted this. Now you do it. If you wanna have a book out next year, you have to write it today. Not tomorrow, today." [laughs] Yeah. If you want-

Steen Raskopoulos 53:29 Is that the sermon?

Sara Pascoe 53:30 If you want this to be good... It's my voice, but it, it's, it's shouting.

Steen Raskopoulos 53:33 [laughs]

Alex Partridge 53:33 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 53:33 "If you want this to be good, you need to spend more work on it. If you l- if you just try and work it out on stage, it won't be good enough."

Steen Raskopoulos 53:38 If you only seen him, she's, like, miming, lighting up a cigarette in the middle.

Sara Pascoe 53:40 [laughs] No, no, stop with the smoking thing. Uh, um, it's a sort of pointing going. And, and then sometimes what the inner voice says, because I have, like everyone, "It won't be good enough." Doesn't matter if it's good enough. Just needs to be done.

Steen Raskopoulos 53:52 Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 53:52 How will you get a better version if you, unless you have a shit version to start with?

Steen Raskopoulos 53:54 But show kindness to yourself 'cause I think if you... people know-

Sara Pascoe 53:57 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 53:57 ... how much, like, you worked and span so many different things at the same time-

Sara Pascoe 54:00 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 54:00 ... whilst being an amazing mum-

Sara Pascoe 54:01 Mm

Steen Raskopoulos 54:01 ... and partner kind of thing.

Sara Pascoe 54:02 Well, apart from the irritability and the mood swings. [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 54:04 Oh, I wasn't gonna bring that up. Ah, bih, bih. [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 54:06 Um, but yeah, I feel very, very lucky to have my job.

Steen Raskopoulos 54:12 Mm-hmm.

Sara Pascoe 54:13 Yeah.

Alex Partridge 54:14 How do you think both being comedians plays its part in your relationship?

Steen Raskopoulos 54:18 Well, I, I constantly need validation where you don't. I think you have an amazing self-belief where-

Sara Pascoe 54:24 Oh, I get my validation from being on stage. [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 54:27 [laughs] But it is. Like, I think it's why we do it.

Sara Pascoe 54:28 Well.

Steen Raskopoulos 54:28 Like, we just constantly go out, and then we're looking for that immediate affirmation kind of thing.

Sara Pascoe 54:32 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 54:32 I think especially with, like, my newer stuff, like in terms, like I've got an Edinburgh show this year. I haven't done Edinburgh since 2018 was my last show. It's such a weird thing to kind of feel you've gotta start back at the bottom, and obviously Sara's a very successful comic too.

Sara Pascoe 54:46 Mm.

Steen Raskopoulos 54:46 So it's just a kind of thing, "Hey, so, hmm, you see."

Sara Pascoe 54:48 I, I love, I love the fact that we do a similar kind of job because what you want in a partner is someone who supports you and understands you. To go back to your washing machine of misery. I can't remember [laughs] what I was-

Steen Raskopoulos 55:00 Woes.

Sara Pascoe 55:00 Woes. I'm sorry. [laughs] Um, washing machine of woes. If, if someone is struggling with what's going on in their brain and how they're processing things, and they feel their partner doesn't understand, that's really, really tough.

Steen Raskopoulos 55:13 Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 55:14 We at least, if someone, [clears throat] if someone came in and says, "You know, I got a bad review," or, "My gig didn't go well," no one would be dismissive of it because they would, we would understand. That's everything to you

Steen Raskopoulos 55:28 Mm

Sara Pascoe 55:28 And there's no such thing as, "Ah, it's just, it's just a small gig"

Steen Raskopoulos 55:31 Mm

Sara Pascoe 55:31 ... or just those people

Steen Raskopoulos 55:33 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 55:33 Who cares about Cambridge? Y- y- you ca- you care about everything all the time. The stakes are quite high, aren't they?

Steen Raskopoulos 55:39 Yeah. I never thought of that.

Sara Pascoe 55:40 So at least having someone, and having someone who understands that you aren't going to probably plan holidays, be at your sister's wedding, celebrate your anniversary

Steen Raskopoulos 55:49 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 55:49 You're gonna be working [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 55:51 Mm.

Alex Partridge 55:51 Do you think there is an overlap between comedy and being neurodivergent?

Sara Pascoe 55:56 I think, I think there's less masking probably, the behaviors that maybe if you did work 9:00 to 5:00 you would have to hide more, people don't have to.

Steen Raskopoulos 56:10 Mm. Yeah, I think we're just, like, very accepting of people. That- that- that's the way they are-

Sara Pascoe 56:14 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 56:14 ... kind of thing.

Sara Pascoe 56:15 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 56:15 On and off stage kind of thing.

Sara Pascoe 56:16 Yeah. Comics are allowed to be-

Steen Raskopoulos 56:18 Mm

Sara Pascoe 56:18 ... quite odd.

Steen Raskopoulos 56:20 Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 56:20 Aren't they?

Steen Raskopoulos 56:21 Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 56:21 Sort of answer to no one.

Steen Raskopoulos 56:23 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 56:23 And also, y- you, you can find people to do the organization part of your life. People will have, you know, agents and PAs-

Steen Raskopoulos 56:33 Mm

Sara Pascoe 56:33 ... to an extent, and so you, so basically you outsource the adulting. Someone buys your train tickets, someone checks you're gonna be there.

Steen Raskopoulos 56:39 Oh, yeah.

Sara Pascoe 56:40 Someone double checks when you should be leaving.

Steen Raskopoulos 56:42 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 56:42 I mean, people can have all of that structure around them.

Steen Raskopoulos 56:46 Oh, yeah, and even, like, management, so yeah, send you down the break, like the breakdown, and

Steen Raskopoulos 56:50 they have accountants and lawyers in their-

Sara Pascoe 56:51 Yeah, and they-

Steen Raskopoulos 56:52 ... agencies are kind of just-

Sara Pascoe 56:53 And they, they do your diary.

Steen Raskopoulos 56:54 Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 56:54 I mean, you don't have it.

Steen Raskopoulos 56:56 Map book planes and all that kind of stuff-

Sara Pascoe 56:57 Yes

Steen Raskopoulos 56:58 ... for festival. Yeah, it's so great.

Sara Pascoe 56:59 You go [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 57:01 Oh. [laughs] It is, though.

Sara Pascoe 57:02 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 57:02 Like, to know, yeah, get an email like, "Hey, your car picks you up at this time. We go to set-"

Sara Pascoe 57:05 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 57:06 ... "You get home at this time." And just getting, um, I, that's why like, uh, when I, when I get to film shows and stuff, it reminds me of going to school 'cause it's, it's such an organized, so tight-

Sara Pascoe 57:15 Mm

Steen Raskopoulos 57:15 ... in terms of you don't wanna waste anyone's time or money kind of thing, and I just get excited. Even like-

Sara Pascoe 57:19 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 57:19 ... early mornings, I don't mind them 'cause it's, like, very regimented. I know what time I'm getting picked up, I know what time I'm getting home-

Sara Pascoe 57:25 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 57:25 ... and what I have to do for the next day kind of thing.

Sara Pascoe 57:27 Yeah, so I don't like that. I think the reason I'm a comic is 'cause I can't work with other people.

Steen Raskopoulos 57:30 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 57:31 And, um, and I like being, I like being a one-man band-

Steen Raskopoulos 57:35 Mm

Sara Pascoe 57:35 ... doing everything myself.

Alex Partridge 57:36 What, what is it about working with other people that you can't do?

Sara Pascoe 57:40 It's very hard compromising, actually. I think compromising is really hard.

Steen Raskopoulos 57:45 Is that getting the attention? Like, you, you like-

Sara Pascoe 57:47 What's that?

Steen Raskopoulos 57:47 ... that kind of vibe in terms of, like, the attention? You, would you not want to share it?

Sara Pascoe 57:52 Uh, I, I'm trying to, I'm trying to think now. Maybe it's just that I've done it for so long, I've been strengthening, I've been reinforcing-

Steen Raskopoulos 58:00 Mm

Sara Pascoe 58:01 ... and so it sudden now, then it suddenly feels like work to consider someone else. I don't even have support on tour because... And some people, you know, y- y- because, because the idea of traveling with someone and having to talk to them feels exhausting.

Steen Raskopoulos 58:13 Think you should do, like, a tight 10 of the army major in your head [laughs] coming over for you.

Sara Pascoe 58:16 [laughs] Yeah. Yeah.

Alex Partridge 58:18 From your experience on the,

Alex Partridge 58:20 this is a bit of a heavy question.

Sara Pascoe 58:22 Mm.

Alex Partridge 58:22 From your experience on the comedy circuit, do you think being a comedian goes hand-in-hand with trauma and/or depression?

Sara Pascoe 58:27 I think comedians like to think that-

Alex Partridge 58:29 Mm

Sara Pascoe 58:29 ... because we think we're fascinating, but I think, I think we talk probably, we get... We always have a microphone near our face, so we get to talk a lot about those things.

Alex Partridge 58:38 Mm-hmm.

Sara Pascoe 58:38 But I actually think it's probably exactly the same percentage as the rest of the population.

Alex Partridge 58:44 Okay.

Sara Pascoe 58:44 But no one's in Sainsbury's asking everyone about their childhood and their trauma.

Alex Partridge 58:48 Oh, yeah.

Sara Pascoe 58:49 Um, 'cause whenever I hear, I'll hear someone going like, "Oh, c- comedians, it's all, they've always got one parent dead," or da da da this, that, and the other, and there's always a theory, and you go, "That's a very universal thing-

Alex Partridge 58:59 Yeah

Sara Pascoe 58:59 ... in the, in the world." Or, you know, tears of a clown. It's like, no, you're just surprised they're sad. [laughs]

Alex Partridge 59:06 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 59:07 Everyone's sad.

Steen Raskopoulos 59:08 Yeah. But I think that's the biggest question you get as well of like, "I didn't know they were s- like, this person presented themselves like this on stage" kind of thing.

Sara Pascoe 59:14 Mm.

Steen Raskopoulos 59:14 It's like, that'd be exhausting to be like that all the time kind of thing.

Steen Raskopoulos 59:18 Yeah.

Alex Partridge 59:18 We had the, um, the brilliant Paul Whitehouse on a couple of weeks ago.

Sara Pascoe 59:21 Oh, yeah.

Alex Partridge 59:21 And he said that, um, a lot of people in the comedy scene are waving the ADHD flag.

Sara Pascoe 59:26 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 59:26 Mm.

Alex Partridge 59:26 Do you think a lot of people are waving the ADHD flag in the comedy scene?

Sara Pascoe 59:29 What, what did he mean? What did, what did he think the ADHD flag was?

Steen Raskopoulos 59:33 As in, like, proud to be or, like, just

Alex Partridge 59:34 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 59:34 ... a marker for-

Alex Partridge 59:35 He said he went to a gig, and the f- the three of the five acts came out, and their opening line was essentially, "I have ADHD."

Sara Pascoe 59:42 Oh, there's lots of com- lo- lots of jokes

Alex Partridge 59:43 Lots of comics are coming out.

Sara Pascoe 59:44 Well, it's actually not comics, it's women. [laughs] In my experience, the, the people I've seen doing that are women because women haven't been diagnosed. There's been a real, um, well, there's been a boom in people talking about girls masking ADHD as teenagers or children.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:00:00 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 1:00:01 And so, uh, yeah, there are a lot. And but also it's a very, very funny... ADHD is very funny.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:00:08 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 1:00:08 It's very easy to joke about is what I would say as a pushback. And, um-

Steen Raskopoulos 1:00:12 But also I think it's so more prev- prevalent now, and there's more people talking about it.

Sara Pascoe 1:00:16 Yes. Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:00:16 So obviously in comedy-

Sara Pascoe 1:00:17 But no, but I, but-

Steen Raskopoulos 1:00:18 ... you wanna dance on hot topics kind of thing.

Sara Pascoe 1:00:19 But I would say the gigs that I've done recently, 50% of the bill's got some ADHD stuff, which usually starts with saying, "I've got ADHD" stuff. [laughs] Uh, I, I mean, it's-

Steen Raskopoulos 1:00:30 You d-

Sara Pascoe 1:00:30 So- sorry, Paul Whitehouse

Steen Raskopoulos 1:00:31 ... you do stuff about me, right? You do the red, the red towel stuff. You s- some stuff like that.

Sara Pascoe 1:00:35 Yeah. I don't say, I don't say, "You've got ADHD" though.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:00:38 Oh, thanks, man.

Sara Pascoe 1:00:39 I just blame it.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:00:39 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 1:00:40 I just say you've got, say, "Don't pick up your towels." [laughs]

Alex Partridge 1:00:44 Is there anything in your early years, Sara, that with, with the, a knowledge about-

Sara Pascoe 1:00:48 Mm

Alex Partridge 1:00:48 ... brains working in different ways makes sense after being confused for all this time?

Sara Pascoe 1:00:55 Mm. I actually, so I, I, I think, I don't think there's anything that makes sense. I actually think what I've got or what has made my life harder was having two children while working full-time as a self-employed person-

Alex Partridge 1:01:12 Yeah

Sara Pascoe 1:01:12 ... married to s- someone with ADHD who's also working f-

Steen Raskopoulos 1:01:15 We don't sleep, so yeah

Sara Pascoe 1:01:16 ... yeah, and we don't sleep. Our-

Steen Raskopoulos 1:01:17 Yeah

Sara Pascoe 1:01:17 ... our kids don't sleep, so we get fractured, you know, an hour at a time, and we have had that for two and a half years. So I think I've, I'm now much more confused than I was before.

Alex Partridge 1:01:28 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 1:01:31 Um, every- everything in my brain has changed. So I think this, it's highlighted lots of things. Whereas if you'd, you'd asked me three or four years ago, I'd have said, "This is all functioning like a well-oiled machine." [laughs]

Alex Partridge 1:01:42 [smacks lips]

Alex Partridge 1:01:45 This has been fascinating. We've got a closing tradition on the podcast where we ask all the guests-

Steen Raskopoulos 1:01:48 I've learned to dance.

Sara Pascoe 1:01:49 [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 1:01:49 So come on, guys, let's...

Alex Partridge 1:01:51 We... You've learned to dance?

Steen Raskopoulos 1:01:53 I thought that was... Oh, it has been.

Sara Pascoe 1:01:54 Yeah. Steen, Steen likes to dance.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:01:55 I thought done a little bit.

Alex Partridge 1:01:56 Steen likes to dance.

Sara Pascoe 1:01:57 You should, you should, you shouldn't make jokes if you're now gonna have to dance-

Steen Raskopoulos 1:01:59 No, no

Sara Pascoe 1:02:00 ... us out of a podcast.

Alex Partridge 1:02:01 [laughs] It'll be a first, but if you wanna do it.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:02:04 Well, what a back flip.

Alex Partridge 1:02:05 Yeah. [laughs] Uh, we ask all the guests what their most impulsive thing you've ever done is, and I guess I'll ask Steen first.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:02:12 I don't know.

Sara Pascoe 1:02:14 I'm gonna... Well, I think we're gonna f- be boringly non-impulsive now. Our impulsivenesses is, would be very small, wouldn't they? They'd... We're not, we wouldn't be impressively impulsive.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:02:25 Oh, can I say-

Sara Pascoe 1:02:26 No. Oh

Steen Raskopoulos 1:02:26 ... one of the coo- most, like, one of the coolest, most impulsive things that Sara ever did.

Sara Pascoe 1:02:31 Buy the dog?

Steen Raskopoulos 1:02:32 Oh, that was crazy. I went back, I, I opened for Conan O'Brien in Sydney for, like, I flew home for like-

Sara Pascoe 1:02:38 It's got to be relevant to the story-

Steen Raskopoulos 1:02:39 This is-

Sara Pascoe 1:02:39 ... not just a name drop

Steen Raskopoulos 1:02:40 ... no, no, no, but for four days, and like I flew home, I flew back, I was exhausted, had jet lag, and Sara's like, "Hey, I'm gonna come meet you, um, at Barren- uh, at the airport." I'm like, "Cool. I'm tired." And then we got to, uh, the airport. She wasn't there. She go, "Actually, I'm gonna jump on the train at Barren's Court." And then she did, and then she just went, "Surprise," and handed me an eight-week-old puppy. We didn't talk about getting a puppy or anything.

Sara Pascoe 1:03:04 He actually told me not to.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:03:06 I told you not to get a puppy-

Sara Pascoe 1:03:07 I, I had to... I said that-

Steen Raskopoulos 1:03:08 ... 'cause we both had crazy work schedules kind of thing.

Sara Pascoe 1:03:09 Mm.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:03:10 Um, and we have a beautiful dog now, but at the time it was like a why... And we'd just moved into-

Sara Pascoe 1:03:14 That was very impulsive

Steen Raskopoulos 1:03:15 ... a house. Um, but then what I was gonna-

Sara Pascoe 1:03:16 I, I did want a dog, though

Steen Raskopoulos 1:03:17 ... the one I was gonna say is we had tickets to see Hannah Gadsby's Nanette at Soho Theatre.

Sara Pascoe 1:03:22 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:03:22 And I was waiting at, at Soho Theatre for Sara to come, and she went, "Hey, we could go to Hannah Gadsby tonight, but I got two tickets to Craig David at Brixton Academy. Um, should we go there instead?"

Sara Pascoe 1:03:35 Oh, that was impulsive.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:03:36 That was so impulsive.

Sara Pascoe 1:03:36 So w- what had happened was we'd gone to s- uh, it, was it, we'd gone to something else at Brixton Academy.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:03:41 Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 1:03:41 This is when we were dating and still went out-

Steen Raskopoulos 1:03:43 Mm

Sara Pascoe 1:03:43 ... sometimes.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:03:44 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 1:03:44 And, um, uh, Steen had asked a security guard what's the best show-

Steen Raskopoulos 1:03:47 I said, "How long have you been working here for?" He's like, "10 years," or something.

Sara Pascoe 1:03:50 Yeah, 30 years.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:03:50 I'm like-

Sara Pascoe 1:03:50 And, and then he said, Steen asked him-

Steen Raskopoulos 1:03:52 I said, "What's the best gig you've ever been to?" Or, "What's the best gig you've ever seen here?" And, "Craig David three weeks ago." I'm like, "See, if he ever comes back, I'd love to go."

Sara Pascoe 1:03:58 He said he, he said he'd never seen an audience react like that, have the most fun. So I searched to see when he was on again, and it was on that night, and that was impulsive.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:04:07 Mate, it was amazing. And Craig David-

Sara Pascoe 1:04:09 But now, but let's hope Hannah Gadsby-

Steen Raskopoulos 1:04:10 ... if you're watching, mate

Sara Pascoe 1:04:10 ... never finds out.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:04:11 But we saw, and I saw Hannah Gadsby.

Sara Pascoe 1:04:12 Yeah. We went at a different time.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:04:13 It just wasn't that night.

Sara Pascoe 1:04:13 Yes. And I just wanted to make sure that it wasn't like-

Steen Raskopoulos 1:04:15 Yeah

Sara Pascoe 1:04:15 ... now we don't... [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 1:04:17 But I get the hype. Craig David, this is how he does.

Sara Pascoe 1:04:19 [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 1:04:20 It was fanta- it was fantastic. No, but it's just in terms of so surprising and like, "Oh, should we do it?" We'll do it.

Sara Pascoe 1:04:24 That is the kind of things I do.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:04:26 Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 1:04:26 The, the things I... But then there's also, I've never... I do impulsive things. Cariad was talking to me about ADHD and how difficult it is. She doesn't like musical concerts. I don't like music concerts. I like one song at a time. Apparently, it's very common with ADHD people. Um, but I've never seen the second half of a play because they're so boring.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:04:43 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 1:04:44 And even really amazing plays, and I know that they were written, I'd rather read them in my own time. I cannot, I cannot sit in the theater. It's unbearable.

Alex Partridge 1:04:53 Very relatable for me personally.

Sara Pascoe 1:04:54 Yes. Yeah.

Alex Partridge 1:04:54 I go to the theater so excited-

Sara Pascoe 1:04:56 But, um, um-

Alex Partridge 1:04:56 ... from the interval

Sara Pascoe 1:04:56 ... exactly.

Alex Partridge 1:04:57 Mm.

Sara Pascoe 1:04:57 And, and by the interval, it's like, I would rather... We have to go and do something else. [laughs] We have... Or just ha- you know, sit and have a drink and be free because it's so hard not to shout out. [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 1:05:05 I think, oh-

Sara Pascoe 1:05:06 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:05:06 Yeah, sorry.

Sara Pascoe 1:05:06 [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 1:05:07 No, I just remembered-

Sara Pascoe 1:05:07 Yeah

Steen Raskopoulos 1:05:07 ... like in terms of when I flew home to surprise my family for Christmas.

Sara Pascoe 1:05:11 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:05:12 It was a thing of, I think I'd just finished a job, but I couldn't go into the, from a contract thing. I couldn't go. And then they're like, "You, you can go if you want." And then I was like, "Oh, I can't go." And Sarah's like, "Why not? Why don't you just fly home and see your family?"

Sara Pascoe 1:05:23 Mm.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:05:24 And it's just this thing of like-

Sara Pascoe 1:05:24 But these are nice things

Steen Raskopoulos 1:05:25 ... can I, can I?

Sara Pascoe 1:05:26 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:05:26 Can I, can I do that?

Sara Pascoe 1:05:27 Yeah.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:05:27 No, but it's still a thing of I don't think I'd actively do that without encouragement kind of thing.

Sara Pascoe 1:05:32 But im- impulse-wise, the problem I've had is I've made, I've spent a lot of, I've lost a lot of money online-

Steen Raskopoulos 1:05:37 Oh, yeah

Sara Pascoe 1:05:37 ... buying things, and then, oh, I've sent deliveries to addresses I don't live at. Just not-

Steen Raskopoulos 1:05:42 Yeah

Sara Pascoe 1:05:42 ... checking properly, not reading things properly.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:05:45 Well, she hate returning stuff, so you just go, "Oh, I'm bored. I don't know what to do."

Sara Pascoe 1:05:47 Yeah. I give it to the charity shop.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:05:48 Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 1:05:49 And the charity shop is not-

Steen Raskopoulos 1:05:50 And it's good stuff

Sara Pascoe 1:05:50 ... it's, it's not far from the post office.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:05:51 [laughs]

Sara Pascoe 1:05:51 I could have just extended that journey, but I can't do it.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:05:54 No.

Alex Partridge 1:05:55 Do you actually process the returns? You just don't return them back?

Sara Pascoe 1:05:57 No, no, no.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:05:57 No, no, no.

Sara Pascoe 1:05:58 'Cause that's what I consider not worth... If I was gonna pay myself a wage to go on a computer, process a return, sell or tape a package together, walk to the post office, I'd go, "Oh." [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 1:06:09 Yeah.

Sara Pascoe 1:06:09 By then I'm go, "I've, I've costed this and I..." So yeah, I can't do it. One day I'll get another dog. [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 1:06:16 [laughs]

Alex Partridge 1:06:16 [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 1:06:17 I'm sure you have.

Sara Pascoe 1:06:17 [laughs]

Steen Raskopoulos 1:06:18 I'm sure you have somewhere in the house.

Alex Partridge 1:06:20 This has been fascinating. Thank you so much.

Sara Pascoe 1:06:22 Thank you for having us.

Steen Raskopoulos 1:06:22 Thank you for having us.

Sara Pascoe 1:06:23 Thank you for having us.

Alex Partridge 1:06:23 Thank you. [upbeat music]