"If You Want To CHANGE YOUR LIFE In 5 Seconds DO THIS!" | Mel Robbins & Lewis Howes

Mel Robbins 0:00 If you accept the fact that you may never feel ready and you may never feel motivated, and that's okay, but you can still push yourself forward. What happens over time is as you start to see yourself becoming the person that takes action and the kind of person that speaks even though your voice is shaking, guess what happens? You build the skill of confidence and courage.

Lewis Howes 0:22 Welcome everyone to the School of Greatness Podcast. We have a special guest, Mel Robbins. Good to see you. Thank you so much for being here.

Mel Robbins 0:28 Oh, okay. Oh, my God.

Lewis Howes 0:29 Ve- very excited. [laughs]

Mel Robbins 0:30 Oh, my God.

Lewis Howes 0:31 Very excited.

Mel Robbins 0:31 This is the first time I've had a Bill Belichick headset on.

Lewis Howes 0:34 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 0:34 I feel like I'm gonna be calling plays, people. Here we go.

Lewis Howes 0:37 You are. You are. You know, you gotta stand out in the podcast world, and not everyone does this.

Mel Robbins 0:41 No.

Lewis Howes 0:42 So it's unique, you know?

Mel Robbins 0:42 No, I thought this was because of your arena football background.

Lewis Howes 0:45 Right? I know. Everyone says that. But for me, I like it because I used to have a mic that would sit on the table.

Mel Robbins 0:51 Uh-huh.

Lewis Howes 0:51 You have to, like, lean forward the whole time.

Mel Robbins 0:52 Yes.

Lewis Howes 0:53 You can't relax at all, and you can't, like, move your head at all.

Mel Robbins 0:56 Yep.

Lewis Howes 0:56 So this, like, the mic is clear, it's crisp, and you can do anything.

Mel Robbins 0:59 Yes.

Lewis Howes 0:59 So I don't care-

Mel Robbins 1:00 Fantastic

Lewis Howes 1:00 ... if it's a little big or bulky, I think it's good, so.

Mel Robbins 1:02 Fantastic. No, I love it. When, when I first started watching your show-

Lewis Howes 1:04 Uh-huh

Mel Robbins 1:04 ... because I do watch your show-

Lewis Howes 1:05 Thank you

Mel Robbins 1:06 ... I was like, "Oh, someday-

Lewis Howes 1:08 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 1:08 ... I'm gonna meet Lewis."

Lewis Howes 1:09 And wear the headsets.

Mel Robbins 1:10 "And I'm gonna get to wear the headset, and I'm gonna feel like a coach."

Lewis Howes 1:13 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 1:13 This is incredible. I, but I do feel like I gotta be like this. You know how they all go like this-

Lewis Howes 1:17 Right

Mel Robbins 1:17 ... so you can't read their lips?

Lewis Howes 1:18 Exactly.

Mel Robbins 1:19 Yes, exactly.

Lewis Howes 1:19 Exactly, [laughs] with the little charts, yes. Uh, you've got a new book out called The 5 Second Rule.

Mel Robbins 1:23 How do you drink coffee with this on your mouth? Do you have to, like, go to the side?

Lewis Howes 1:27 I put it up. I put it up like this. I put it up like this, and I just...

Mel Robbins 1:29 Oh, it moves.

Lewis Howes 1:30 Uh-huh.

Mel Robbins 1:30 Okay. Like a pilot.

Lewis Howes 1:32 Put it up.

Mel Robbins 1:33 Okay.

Lewis Howes 1:33 Exactly.

Mel Robbins 1:33 I'm ready now. [laughs]

Lewis Howes 1:34 Uh, Mel's got a book called The 5 Second Rule, and it's out right now. It's about how to transform your life, work, and confidence with everyday courage. And used to be a... Are you still are a CNN analyst, or you used to be?

Mel Robbins 1:47 I am. Yeah.

Lewis Howes 1:48 You still are?

Mel Robbins 1:48 But I don't cover politics, so-

Lewis Howes 1:50 Got it

Mel Robbins 1:50 ... it has not been a busy year for me.

Lewis Howes 1:53 Got it. Okay.

Mel Robbins 1:53 I do more ethics and relationships and business, and so when there's breaking news that, that impacts human behavior or business, that's when they'll call me.

Lewis Howes 2:02 Got it, okay.

Mel Robbins 2:03 Yeah.

Lewis Howes 2:03 Now, were you always an on-air personality, talent, analyst, or what were you doing before that?

Mel Robbins 2:07 No, I have had a crazy career.

Lewis Howes 2:09 Tell me about it.

Mel Robbins 2:10 Crazy. Okay.

Lewis Howes 2:11 Okay.

Mel Robbins 2:11 So I grew up in Western Michigan.

Lewis Howes 2:13 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 2:13 I went east to college and law school, and the first job I got out of school was as a public defender in Manhattan.

Lewis Howes 2:18 Okay.

Mel Robbins 2:19 I did violent felony criminal defense work-

Lewis Howes 2:21 Mm

Mel Robbins 2:21 ... for the city of New York for four years, and I would probably still be doing it except for the fact that my husband, um, got into business school in Boston.

Lewis Howes 2:30 Right.

Mel Robbins 2:30 And so we moved up to Boston, and I was not actually, uh, licensed to practice in Massachusetts, so I went to work for a large law firm, and, um, almost immediately wanted to kill myself.

Lewis Howes 2:41 Wow. [laughs]

Mel Robbins 2:41 Um, not, like, truly, and, you know-

Lewis Howes 2:44 Right

Mel Robbins 2:44 ... we'll talk about the implications of the five second rule and how beneficial it is, not only for productivity and-

Lewis Howes 2:50 Mm-hmm

Mel Robbins 2:51 ... for confidence, but also for mental health stuff. But, um, hated it, and luckily this was '99 in Boston when the startup scene was exploding-

Lewis Howes 3:00 Right

Mel Robbins 3:00 ... and you could sneeze and get a job. And I networked like crazy and ended up getting a job in a really cool technology company, and, uh, spent four years doing tech, and-

Lewis Howes 3:12 Public defender to tech company.

Mel Robbins 3:13 [laughs] Yes. And well, you know, one of the things about getting a law degree, and I'm not actually telling you to-

Lewis Howes 3:19 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 3:19 ... because I think there's, there's pro- it's ve- unless you really wanna practice law-

Lewis Howes 3:23 Mm-hmm

Mel Robbins 3:23 ... it's a mother load of debt.

Lewis Howes 3:25 Mm.

Mel Robbins 3:26 And there is a absolute glutton of attorneys out there, and the job market is really difficult.

Lewis Howes 3:31 Yeah.

Mel Robbins 3:32 And the other thing they don't tell you about law school right now is that you may be an incredible attorney, but unless you know how to do business development, your career-

Lewis Howes 3:40 Mm

Mel Robbins 3:40 ... is not gonna do what you want it to do.

Lewis Howes 3:42 So you need to bring in business, right?

Mel Robbins 3:43 Yes.

Lewis Howes 3:43 You need to network, you need to build re-

Mel Robbins 3:44 Yes

Lewis Howes 3:44 ... you can't just sit there and expect it to come to you, right?

Mel Robbins 3:46 That was the old model.

Lewis Howes 3:48 Right.

Mel Robbins 3:48 That was the old model.

Lewis Howes 3:48 Now you gotta go out and get clients.

Mel Robbins 3:50 Correct. Correct.

Lewis Howes 3:51 Cultivate them, get them on retainers.

Mel Robbins 3:52 Even if you work for a large firm.

Lewis Howes 3:53 Yeah.

Mel Robbins 3:53 Because you're not, if you're on the partner track, you're actually not of value unless you're generating-

Lewis Howes 3:58 Mm

Mel Robbins 3:58 ... income.

Lewis Howes 3:59 Right.

Mel Robbins 3:59 And, and so they don't tell you that in law school.

Lewis Howes 4:01 Right.

Mel Robbins 4:01 But so anyway, the law degree though, and because it's a degree about learning how to think and learning about how to take mountains of complex information and distill it down into one key takeaway, uh, and to the most important elements of something, that's what law school trains you to do.

Lewis Howes 4:18 Mm.

Mel Robbins 4:18 And so what's fascinating is that when you look at my career, whether it was being in high tech or it was then going on to do a bunch of executive coaching, launching and selling companies, and, and then having a syndicated radio show, being on CNN-

Lewis Howes 4:32 Yeah

Mel Robbins 4:33 ... and what I do now, um, as an author, as a speaker, as, you know, somebody like you that's, that is out helping people figure out how to launch businesses and change your life-

Lewis Howes 4:44 Yeah

Mel Robbins 4:44 ... it's about taking all of the incredible information that's out in the world and distilling it down into the key takeaways that make super s- that make sense, and that are also actionable. And so interestingly, when I look back on my career, even though I've made all these career changes, there are still fundamental skills that I developed early on-

Lewis Howes 5:08 Mm

Mel Robbins 5:08 ... that are the reason why I've become very successful in these other arenas. And, you know-

Lewis Howes 5:13 Mm-hmm

Mel Robbins 5:13 ... that's one other thing to, to, to remember, is that the cool thing about the world today, and y- you talk about this too, is that all the information that you need is right at your fingertips. Hell, all you need to do is watch this show-

Lewis Howes 5:26 Right. [laughs]

Mel Robbins 5:26 ... and you will get the secrets to creating the life that you want, and being able to make that pivot so that you can let your passion direct you into a business that really helps you create the life that you want. So the information is there, the guide- guidance is there. But the thing that's so difficult for most of us is how, when you're alone and you turn off this show, do you push through the excuses, the habits, the fears, and the, the actual physical constraints that you have in your life right now so that you can make the pivot? And so I often say that I am not a what speaker or a why speaker, I'm a how. And that there's already incredible information about what you can do and why you should do it. And I find that the th- place that I get stuck is, "Okay, well, that's great," and I do a lot of thinking, "But how do I get out of here-

Lewis Howes 6:20 Mm

Mel Robbins 6:21 ... and make it happen?"

Lewis Howes 6:22 Our thoughts are our, our biggest killers of our dreams.

Mel Robbins 6:25 Totally.

Lewis Howes 6:26 They're either our biggest killers or our biggest cheerleaders.

Mel Robbins 6:28 Mm-hmm.

Lewis Howes 6:29 And if we don't know how to really, I guess, I don't know, not manipulate them, but to really hone in on them, then we can have a messed-up life. And I've gone through many years of self-destruction growing up just because I didn't know how to manage the thoughts. I didn't know how to... I was never educated on it really, on how to, how to not control it, but, I don't know, what is it?

Mel Robbins 6:51 What is it?

Lewis Howes 6:51 What is it? Yeah. Not control it, but what is the word I'm looking for?

Mel Robbins 6:54 Well, see, I talk about it this way. So I, I like to simplify things-

Lewis Howes 6:57 Mm-hmm

Mel Robbins 6:57 ... because it makes it easier for me.

Lewis Howes 6:58 Yeah, yeah.

Mel Robbins 6:59 I'm almost 50, for crying out loud, and there's only so much that you can remember-

Lewis Howes 7:02 [laughs] Sure

Mel Robbins 7:02 ... when you get to be... You know, when he's 33, that's a whole different ballgame. But, um, I think about your brain as-

Lewis Howes 7:07 Mm

Mel Robbins 7:07 ... being in two modes. Two modes to your brain that you need to know about. There's autopilot, and we've all experienced that. You know, you drive to work and get there, and you're like, [gasps] "Who drove the car? Oh my God."

Lewis Howes 7:16 Oh, yeah.

Mel Robbins 7:16 Like, "I don't even remember driving the car here."

Lewis Howes 7:18 Yeah.

Mel Robbins 7:18 Well, you did, Lewis.

Lewis Howes 7:20 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 7:20 You drove the car. But the thing is, is that you were in the mode of your brain that's called autopilot. Well, what is autopilot? Autopilot is the interior part of your brain. You'll hear neuroscientists and psychologists talk about the basal ganglia. Very important thing to understand is that there's a part of your brain that its entire job is basically to execute your habits. Habits, big fancy word, means something very simple: behaviors that you repeat without even thinking about it. When you pull your pants on in the morning, I guarantee you, you either put your left or your right leg in first. And you have to stop and think about which one it is, don't you?

Lewis Howes 7:56 Mm. Mm.

Mel Robbins 7:57 But not when you're putting your pants on.

Lewis Howes 7:58 Right. [laughs] Exactly.

Mel Robbins 7:59 Because that behavior is what researchers call a habit loop.

Lewis Howes 8:03 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 8:04 It gets enclosed as... It gets encoded as a closed-loop system-

Lewis Howes 8:08 Mm

Mel Robbins 8:08 ... right here. Now, the problem for most of us is that half of the day we're on autopilot. And that's not me making a guess. That's what researchers that study habits and study psychology say. That half of your day you're basically kinda checked out and you're on autopilot. And when you're checked out and you're on autopilot, any behavior pattern that you repeat can take over. And guess what are behavior patterns that we repeat? Thinking patterns. So self-doubt, worry, procrastination, overthinking, analysis paralysis, fear. Those are all thinking patterns that are habits. One of the most important things that I want people to understand is that you're actually not a worrier. You have a habit of worrying.

Lewis Howes 8:56 Mm.

Mel Robbins 8:56 Big difference.

Lewis Howes 8:57 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 8:57 You're not a procrastinator. You have a habit of procrastinating. Big difference. And when you understand that any behavior pattern, whether it is a thinking pattern like you doubt yourself all the time, um, or you get trapped upstairs noodling everything and you can never get started, or whether it's a behavior pattern like you drink too much or you snap at your kids or you micromanage your team. Every one of those behavior patterns and thinking patterns can actually be interrupted and replaced using science. Now, let's talk about the second part of the brain.

Lewis Howes 9:32 Hm.

Mel Robbins 9:32 Drive. That's this puppy right here. This is what you want. This is your prefrontal cortex. Drive is the mode where you're in charge of your thoughts, okay? It's where you are fully awake, you are present, and you are driving your thoughts and actions. When you're doing that, your prefrontal cortex is active. The prefrontal cortex is the part of the brain that you need in order to learn new behavior, in order to do something difficult, in order to do something uncertain, in order to do strategic thinking. So I'm gonna give you an example. So I'm a righty. If I were to try to write with my left hand-

Lewis Howes 10:09 Mm-hmm

Mel Robbins 10:09 ... you know, like, and Lewis is gonna torture me-

Lewis Howes 10:11 Sure

Mel Robbins 10:11 ... and tie my hand behind my back-

Lewis Howes 10:12 Sure

Mel Robbins 10:12 ... and make me, like, do this, I could do it. It would look like I was writing with my foot.

Lewis Howes 10:17 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 10:17 And if Lewis came up to me and said, "Hey, Mel, you want some Bulletproof Coffee?" I'd be like, "Lewis, I'm tr- I'm trying to concentrate. I can't do this." My prefrontal cortex would be el fuego.

Lewis Howes 10:27 Mm.

Mel Robbins 10:28 Because it is firing on all cylinders to communicate to my hand new behavior. So the thing that's cool about that is that you can use a simple trick. The moment you feel yourself hesitate, the moment you've got one of those moments where you know that you need to... This is that moment that Lewis talks to you about where you gotta step outside of your comfort zone and you've gotta lean into your passion and you've gotta really take some risks and you gotta feel the fear and you gotta do it anyway. That's the moment where you just woke up, and now you got a decision to make. Are you gonna drift back into the habits or are you going to awaken your prefrontal cortex and drive forward and focus and do something new? And so the work that I've been doing and speaking about is all-

Lewis Howes 11:12 Mm

Mel Robbins 11:12 ... about the 5 Second Rule, which is a, a, a trick that I invented by mistake that helps you manually switch, no joke, your brain. It turns off and interrupts the part of the brain that is where all your habits and your behavior patterns are encoded, and it awakens your prefrontal cortex, which, in five seconds flat, allows your brain to help you change.

Lewis Howes 11:35 Mm.

Mel Robbins 11:36 And so, anyway.

Lewis Howes 11:37 I love it.

Mel Robbins 11:38 I was rambling on and on. 'Cause you, you went on this thing about how your patterns can be destructive-

Lewis Howes 11:42 Yes

Mel Robbins 11:42 ... and nobody teaches us, and that's absolutely right.

Lewis Howes 11:44 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 11:44 And what I want everybody to get out of this conversation between us is that you cannot control how you feel. You cannot control what triggers you and the fact that you may rise up with anger, you may rise up with self-doubt, you may have anxiety fill your body, but you can always control what you think and how you behave. And we spend way too much time trying to focus on manipulating how we feel about things, and not enough time practicing the skills of ... controlling your behavior and your thoughts

Lewis Howes 12:18 Hmm. 'Cause if you can control your behavior and your thoughts, then the way you feel will be different.

Mel Robbins 12:22 100%. And a lot of us are sitting around waiting to feel ready, waiting to feel courageous, waiting to feel confident, waiting for the right time, and that's not ever coming, ever. Ever. You're not gonna change your life up here. You only change it through action.

Lewis Howes 12:38 Hmm.

Mel Robbins 12:39 And, and so to me-

Lewis Howes 12:41 Hmm

Mel Robbins 12:41 ... I, you know, I, I, I, I did this, this, you know, interview with y- with your friend Tom, and we talked about how motivation is garbage and this, somebody memed it and it went crazy and so-

Lewis Howes 12:50 Mm-hmm

Mel Robbins 12:50 ... the point that I was trying to make is this: is that, yeah, motivation is great if you feel li- if you feel motivated. But it's garbage and it's, it's, it's, it's a losing bet to wait to feel ready.

Lewis Howes 13:03 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 13:04 'Cause it's... Your body's not designed that way and neither is your brain. And so I want everybody to understand that first of all, you can't control the things that trigger you and the fact that you're gonna feel afraid and you're gonna feel doubt and you're gonna feel uncertain. But you can-

Lewis Howes 13:18 Hmm

Mel Robbins 13:18 ... always interrupt that feeling and take control in the moment-

Lewis Howes 13:21 Yeah

Mel Robbins 13:21 ... and actually shift what you're s- thinking and shift how you behave.

Lewis Howes 13:24 Yeah. And you know, the bigger the dream, the more fear you're gonna have. You know-

Mel Robbins 13:28 Totally

Lewis Howes 13:28 ... even if you feel like you've conquered the fear of something, in order to grow you've gotta take on some new challenge, and there's gonna be uncertainty, there's gonna be some stress or there's gonna be some worry or there's gonna be some ego checking and there's gonna be some identity crisis.

Mel Robbins 13:41 Yeah.

Lewis Howes 13:42 So there's always gonna be this fear that could arise.

Mel Robbins 13:46 Always.

Lewis Howes 13:47 Always. I mean, did you... Do you feel like once you've mastered this that you have no more fear?

Mel Robbins 13:50 Me?

Lewis Howes 13:51 Yeah.

Mel Robbins 13:51 No, the fear still comes, but I have 100% control of what I think and do.

Lewis Howes 13:56 Right.

Mel Robbins 13:56 So i- one of the things that, that is important for, for me to, um, to, to put on the table is that a lot of times, um, you know, people look at your, where you are now. And so they'll see me on television or-

Lewis Howes 14:09 Mm-hmm

Mel Robbins 14:09 ... they'll see that TED Talk or maybe you'll be in an audience of 20,000 people in, in the American Airlines Center and I'm-

Lewis Howes 14:15 Wow

Mel Robbins 14:15 ... on stage and you're like, "Wow, that chick must have just been born confident."

Lewis Howes 14:19 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 14:19 "I hate her."

Lewis Howes 14:20 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 14:21 The fact is, uh, that's not at all how I, how I was. I, I, when, when I was 19 I started having crazy panic attacks.

Lewis Howes 14:29 Hmm.

Mel Robbins 14:30 And they got so bad that I took medication, and medication was a godsend for me. I took Zoloft for two decades. When I had our first daughter, who is now 17 years old, the postpartum depression was so bad that, um, they put me on Ativan, which turns you into a zombie, and I could not be left alone with her.

Lewis Howes 14:48 Hmm. [clears throat]

Mel Robbins 14:49 So when it comes to-

Lewis Howes 14:50 Wow

Mel Robbins 14:51 ... self-doubt and to how we can torture ourselves with our thoughts, boy have I lived that nightmare. And as I started to use The 5 Second Rule, which we're gonna get into, um, and everything about my life changed. 'Cause when people first learn the rule, what you're gonna learn, what you're gonna start doing is you're gonna start using the rule to push yourself to do things that are annoying. You're gonna push yourself to get up on time. You're gonna push yourself to work on your business plan. You're gonna push yourself to make calls that are scary.

Lewis Howes 15:17 Hmm.

Mel Robbins 15:17 You're gonna push yourself to get to the gym. You're gonna push yourself to speak up more at work. You're gonna push yourself to put the booze down. Behavioral, behavioral, behavioral, and then you're gonna start to actually use it to change the thinking patterns that are self-sabotaging.

Lewis Howes 15:32 Hmm.

Mel Robbins 15:32 So I, four years ago, wondered as I started to see myself go from thank- facing bankruptcy to building-

Lewis Howes 15:40 Yeah

Mel Robbins 15:40 ... an eight-figure business. [laughs]

Lewis Howes 15:41 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 15:42 Um, I, um, I... What, what, what happened for me is I started to say, "Okay, this is a really cool little trick to bring out the most powerful side of you, but can I use this to actually cure myself of anxiety?"

Lewis Howes 15:58 Hmm.

Mel Robbins 15:58 And the answer is yes you can. And four years ago I went off Zoloft and I started using The 5 Second Rule, which I'm gonna explain in one second, to, um, interrupt the patterns of worry and self-doubt. Which by the way, anxiety is nothing more than the habit of worrying spiraling out of control.

Lewis Howes 16:15 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 16:16 And body feelings triggering now the habit of obsessive worrying that turns into anxiety and then kind of escalates to panic. Um, I started using The 5 Second Rule to interrupt my thoughts every time I would feel that kind of worry kick in. And because the prefrontal cortex is awakened when you use it, your mind is now ready to take on a totally different thought. It's a very different strategy than just trying to switch the channel on what you're thinking.

Lewis Howes 16:40 Yeah.

Mel Robbins 16:40 'Cause you're actually inserting the step that nobody talks about, which is switching the gears in your mind so that your mind can actually take and believe the thinking. Yeah.

Lewis Howes 16:49 Interesting.

Mel Robbins 16:50 Yeah.

Lewis Howes 16:50 Okay.

Mel Robbins 16:51 So The 5 Second Rule.

Lewis Howes 16:52 Wait, first off-

Mel Robbins 16:53 Yeah, tell me

Lewis Howes 16:53 ... when did you discover The 5 Second Rule?

Mel Robbins 16:54 Okay. So 2009-

Lewis Howes 16:56 This is when you first tried it or discovered it or...?

Mel Robbins 16:59 Oh, it's a t- total horror show mistake.

Lewis Howes 17:01 Okay. [laughs]

Mel Robbins 17:01 Yes.

Lewis Howes 17:01 Okay. [laughs]

Mel Robbins 17:02 So 2009, um, I was unemployed and feeling like-

Lewis Howes 17:07 You were unemployed? How?

Mel Robbins 17:09 Well, okay.

Lewis Howes 17:10 You have too much charisma, too much passion.

Mel Robbins 17:13 Uh, yeah, 'cause everything's working right now.

Lewis Howes 17:15 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 17:16 That's why. [laughs] I'm not like this when, uh, things are not working.

Lewis Howes 17:19 Sure, sure.

Mel Robbins 17:19 Ask my husband of 22 years.

Lewis Howes 17:22 Yeah.

Mel Robbins 17:23 Um, uh, well, the, what had happened is, um, I, I had had all these career changes and I got into the media business, again, by mistake. I had a coaching business and, um, Inc. Magazine was writing an article about coaches and they featured me in it, and CNBC called.

Lewis Howes 17:38 Got it. [laughs]

Mel Robbins 17:39 And that led to me doing some stuff with CNBC and, um, I spent a year still coaching people and then doing some stuff for CNBC, and then Fox called. And they were interested in having me host a television show. Now, you gotta understand, I'm from North Muskegon, Michigan.

Lewis Howes 17:56 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 17:57 I mean, the media business-

Lewis Howes 17:58 [laughs] It's, it's different

Mel Robbins 17:59 ... Fox, LA.

Lewis Howes 18:00 Yeah. [laughs]

Mel Robbins 18:00 The closest thing I had ever seen to a ce- a celebrity, Lewis, was the Muskegon Lumberjacks.

Lewis Howes 18:05 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 18:05 The farm team, right?

Lewis Howes 18:07 Right.

Mel Robbins 18:07 From our... For, for the Pittsburgh Penguins.

Lewis Howes 18:09 Yeah, the-

Mel Robbins 18:09 My dad-

Lewis Howes 18:10 ... the AA team or whatever it was, the AAA team

Mel Robbins 18:10 Yeah, my dad was the hometown doc for the hockey team there.

Lewis Howes 18:13 Right, right, right.

Mel Robbins 18:14 So I thought-

Lewis Howes 18:15 The mayor was a celebrity

Mel Robbins 18:16 Wow. My life's about to change. I'm about to be a celebrity. Wow. We're gonna solve all... This is amazing, you know? So, um, I was originally going to be hosting a, a show for Fox where we were making over small businesses. Nice. Yeah, pretty cool, right? We show up, we, like, do extreme home makeover- Mm-hmm ... for the office. Everybody's happy. We all know that doesn't solve business problems- [laughs] ... but it makes for a nice television show. By the time I get to LA, um, they've changed the format. It's now called Someone's Gotta Go, and I'm gonna be firing people on national television from real jobs. Wow. Uh-huh. That sounds fun. Horrible. Oh my God. Plus, we haven't told the offices that this is what we're doing. Oh my gosh. So you show up in act one, and you've got everybody all like this because they're gonna think they're gonna get p- new IKEA furniture and a paint job, and this is gonna be the best thing in the world for their small business. Now meanwhile, I'm a fourth-generation small business owner. Right. So that's like my people. Grew up at a kitchen table with farmers and, you know- Mm-hmm ... my mom at a retail store, and my other grandparents were bakers. And so when it comes to, like, the heart and soul and what's so important when you launch your own business and how personal it is, I mean, this was, like, gut-wrenching. So I show up. The first act, you kick out the, the owner of the company, who then freaks out, then all the employees freak out. Act number two, we announce that somebody's getting fired, and then- Wow ... that's, that's the, the bad news. The good news is that I'm not picking. We're gonna have you vote somebody out. Oh my gosh. So it's Survivor in an office place. Oh my goodness. So- That sucks [laughs] ... when, when I learn all this, I, I have a panic attack even though I'm on Zoloft, and I call the guy that got me the gig and say, "You gotta get me out of this." Like, "This is the worst thing that's ever happened to me." Mm-hmm. And he said, um, "Well, I'm sorry, but they've already cast the entire show, and you're out there for five weeks, and you don't have a choice, or they're gonna sue you." Oh my gosh. And I said, "Then fine. Get me some Xanax 'cause I don't think I can get through this thing." Like- [laughs] ... "This is awful." Luckily, um, we taped two episodes, and, um, legal tabled it. Hmm. But here was the problem. I was attached to the show, and I only got paid if the show was shooting. Mm-hmm. So you're broke. And being an entrepreneur- [laughs] ... I also kind of put- Put all your energy into this. Yeah ... yes, put all my energy into this. [laughs] Shut down the coaching thing. Um- Yeah ... uh, really thought that the... It also k- kind of negotiated a deal that was a sort of a back-end deal thinking I'm a f- you know, entrepreneur, always- Sure, sure ... thinking about gotta have a piece of the action. Take a little less up front and more- Yes ... yeah, of course. What a- yeah, that was a dumb move. [laughs] Um, and I was in a contract for a year while they figured out what to do. Hmm. So you couldn't do another show. Yeah. So, you know, I just felt like I had made a, a huge mistake, and I felt really embarrassed. And I didn't know at the age of 41 what I should be doing with my life. And while it's neat that I had jumped careers so many times, I started to feel- Mm ... like somebody that actually wasn't successful at all 'cause I didn't have a career track. I had a bunch of jumps from one thing to another. Now looking back, it makes perfect sense, but standing in the middle of the mess, it just felt like everything was caving in. Yeah. Probably just like when you were sleeping on your couch- Absolutely ... feeling injured and like everything I thought that was about to happen isn't happening now. Meanwhile, my husband had opened up a restaurant business. It had been his dream. He worked in high tech and came home one day after getting laid off and said, "I, I'm never gonna get on a plane and do a PowerPoint presentation for a company I don't care about or own." And I said, "Great. What's your plan?" And he said, "I'm gonna open a pizza restaurant." Hmm. And I looked at him, and I said, "Was there a trust fund that was part of this marriage that I was unaware of? 'Cause I'm not quite sure how we're gonna pay-" 'Cause where'd you get the money? [laughs] Exactly. [laughs] Did someone die and you got an insurance policy check? Yes. [laughs] And he said no. [laughs] And, um, uh, I then said the most famous lines of our 22 marri- 22-year marriage, Lewis. I looked at him and I said, "Listen, buddy. Inspiration is for strangers. You get your ass back to that job, and you pay the mortgage, and you forget this dream. You're not going [laughs] to do this." Wow. So we- well, 'cause change is scary. Yeah. So we fought and he won, and the first one was a real home run. And s- He opened a pizza store? Oh, he did. Yeah. 40, 40 seats right outside Boston, Massachusetts, he and his best friend. And it- they won- Did well ... Best of Boston. It was incredible. What do you do when everything- But they made money, though. They did on the first one. [laughs] Okay. So what do you do when, when everything's working? Let's do another one. Whoo, let's go all chips in. Let's put in the home equity line. Wow. Let's put in the, the kids' college savings. Let's get friends and family. And because you're so excited, you, you think it's gonna work. Yeah. So you go big, big, big. Well, the second one did not work at all. And it did not work at all so badly- Hmm ... that when it was finally closed, it was close to an $800,000 loss. Hmm. And it meant our entire home equity line, kids' college savings, everything went right down with it. Hmm. That was right when I lost the Fox show. So I'm unemployed. The liens start hitting the house. Um, the phone starts ringing all the time, and it's collections calls. Hmm. So you unplug the phone. That would stress me out. Well, you just unplug the phone. Oh my gosh. I mean, that's how you deal with that. But I, I, I, I remember, like, there we- I remember two things from that period of my life that were really painful, and one was having to call the town and tell them that we could not afford the 175 bucks for our sixth grader to play soccer, so we needed to pull her out. Wow. And I remember there being times, 'cause I was so afraid to look at the checking account, that I would stand at the grocery store and items would scan, and I could just feel that wave of anxiety rising thinking, "I don't, I, I don't think the check card's gonna go through." And so I would stand there. I always had an excuse, and it was to look at the person and go, "Oh, that's strange. It just worked at the gas station." Oh my gosh. Because I... What would've been more empowering is to probably say, "Oh, well, I guess I don't have the money for this. Let's take this, this, and this," and just kind of, like, the easiest thing to do is to tell the truth, but I was so filled with shame. Yeah. So I started to develop this habit of hitting the snooze button because what would happen is the alarm would go off in the morning, and the first thing I would think about is all the problems that we had and how awfully things had gone off the tracks. And you didn't wanna deal with them. No. And I, and I also didn't know, I didn't know, I didn't think I could-

Mel Robbins 24:26 And this goes back to the feelings. Like, you, you think that you need to feel confident or courageous in order to get started. You don't. You actually just have to start, and that's the riddle of life. That lying in bed hoping that you wake up some morning motivated to change, that's not the answer. You actually have to learn how to push yourself. You have to learn how to, how to leverage the power of your decisions, and you've gotta learn how to take action when you don't f- feel like it.

Lewis Howes 24:55 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 24:56 Because every morning when I woke up, I did not feel confident. I felt like a loser.

Lewis Howes 25:00 Yeah.

Mel Robbins 25:01 I felt like the world's worst parent. I felt like I had failed at every single turn. I did not know if Chris and I could pull out of the spiral. I did not know if we were going to go bankrupt and lose the house and move from our community. I did not know if our marriage would survive. I knew I wanted it to. And see, this is the knowledge-action gap. You can know what you want, you can know what you should be doing, but how do you make yourself do it when the feelings and the motivation isn't there, when all you got is fear? And so every night I would, I would lie in bed and I would say to myself, "All right, that's it, Mel. Tomorrow it's the new you. Tomorrow you're gonna wake up and be motivated. You're gonna, you're gonna get up, you're gonna exercise like everybody says you should. You're gonna meditate. You're gonna get those kids on the bus. You're gonna screw Fox. You're gonna look for a job. You're gonna cold call Cox Media and you're gonna, you're gonna do auditions. Come on, girl, let's go, let's go, let's go. You're gonna take a cold shower. Woo!" You know, "Here we go."

Lewis Howes 26:00 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 26:00 And I meant it when I was saying it. Maybe it was the alcohol that was talking.

Lewis Howes 26:04 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 26:04 But, but then I would wake up and I didn't feel any of those things.

Lewis Howes 26:08 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 26:09 So I would hit the snooze, and I would hit the snooze. Now, why was I hitting the snooze when I knew it wasn't the right decision? I'm gonna tell you why, and this is something that I was blown away by when I discovered it. You don't make decisions with your goals. You don't make decisions with your prefrontal cortex. You don't make decisions with logic. Do you know how we make decisions? I didn't invent this. A neuroscientist by the name of Damasio, who does his research in Brazil, who gave an incredible TED Talk and wrote about this forever and ever and ever. We make decisions with feelings. 95% of our decisions are made by how you feel in the moment, and that is the problem. You need to take control of the moment and leverage the power of your decisions and make them up here. Because when I was lying in bed, I wasn't saying to myself, "I should get up because that's gonna help me start my day right." I was saying, "Do I feel-

Lewis Howes 27:04 Mm-hmm

Mel Robbins 27:05 ... like getting up?"

Lewis Howes 27:06 No, you don't.

Mel Robbins 27:06 No. Do you feel like making that cold call? No, you don't. Do you feel like doing that third set of reps? No, you don't. Do you feel like having that hard conversation? No, you don't. Do you feel like ending this relationship, whether it's in business or in your life, that is sucking you dry? No, you don't. We make decisions based on our feelings, and that is robbing you of joy and opportunity, and it is blinding you from the fact that all... W- how you change your life is one five-second decision at a time, one push at a time.

Lewis Howes 27:41 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 27:42 And if you, if you accept the fact that you may never feel ready and you may never feel motivated and you may never feel confident and you may never feel courageous, and that's okay, but you can still push yourself forward. What happens over time is as you start to-

Lewis Howes 27:56 Mm

Mel Robbins 27:56 ... see yourself becoming the person that takes action, that you start to see yourself becoming the kind of person that speaks even though your voice is shaking. You're the kind of person that, that, that has a bias toward moving instead of a bias toward thinking. Guess what happens? You build the skill of confidence and courage. And so what happened for me is I was stuck, Lewis. I mean, I was so stuck. I was on... I, I mean, we were heading straight for divorce. We were heading for bankruptcy. I knew I wanted to change things.

Lewis Howes 28:25 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 28:25 And so one night I see this commercial. This is the stupidest story on the planet, but this is what happened.

Lewis Howes 28:30 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 28:31 I see this commercial, and, you know, again, I, I also was drinking too much. I mean, I probably had a couple Manhattans in me.

Lewis Howes 28:40 Sure.

Mel Robbins 28:40 That's my drink. I'm from the Midwest-

Lewis Howes 28:41 All right

Mel Robbins 28:41 ... just like you.

Lewis Howes 28:42 Yeah.

Mel Robbins 28:42 All right, a little Manhattan there.

Lewis Howes 28:44 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 28:44 A little bourbon. Um, and, uh, there was a rocket ship launching.

Lewis Howes 28:48 On a commercial?

Mel Robbins 28:49 Yeah.

Lewis Howes 28:49 Yeah.

Mel Robbins 28:50 And I had this instinct, this innovation, this disruptive idea, right? "Oh my God, Mel, that's the answer. Tomorrow morning you're gonna launch your ass out of bed like a rocket ship. You're gonna move so fast you can't even think about your problems." Dumb, right?

Lewis Howes 29:09 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 29:10 Totally dumb.

Lewis Howes 29:11 No worse.

Mel Robbins 29:11 Seems like this is the dumbest idea I've ever heard.

Lewis Howes 29:13 But no worse.

Mel Robbins 29:13 I cannot believe I have this chick on my podcast.

Lewis Howes 29:14 No, I understand, I understand it. You gotta get moving first.

Mel Robbins 29:17 Yes.

Lewis Howes 29:17 That's the thing. You just gotta wake up at 6:00 AM or whenever it is and go into the gym. And when you're in the gym, you're gonna start moving the first weight.

Mel Robbins 29:24 Yes.

Lewis Howes 29:24 And then you'll start moving the second weight.

Mel Robbins 29:25 Yes. Actually, people e- people use the five-second rule at the gym because-

Lewis Howes 29:28 Yeah

Mel Robbins 29:28 ... do you know how much time people waste at the gym standing around thinking about the next thing?

Lewis Howes 29:31 Probably 70% of the time, right?

Mel Robbins 29:33 Five, four, three, two, one.

Lewis Howes 29:34 Yeah.

Mel Robbins 29:34 So, so the next morning the alarm goes off and nothing had changed in my life. I woke up to the lien on the house, the fighting with Chris, the-

Lewis Howes 29:41 Mm-hmm

Mel Robbins 29:41 ... unemployment, the lack of confidence, the lack of courage, the... Like, the whole thing. But I did something I had never done before. I went five, four, three, two, one, just like NASA. I actually counted, and then I stood up and I was like-

Lewis Howes 29:55 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 29:58 ... "What the hell just happened?"

Lewis Howes 29:59 Uh-huh.

Mel Robbins 29:59 "W- w- what? That is the dumbest thing I've ever heard." The next morning I used it again, it worked. The next morning I used it again, it worked.

Lewis Howes 30:07 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 30:08 And then I started to notice something, and this is, this is one of those things. So we have a, we have an 11-year-old son who has dyslexia.

Lewis Howes 30:14 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 30:14 And when they finally diagnosed him, it was as if, of course. It was as if, like, how could we have possibly missed this? Are we the worst parents in the world?

Lewis Howes 30:23 Yeah.

Mel Robbins 30:23 I mean, the kid can barely write. He can't cut his food. He doesn't read. Like, no wonder he doesn't do team sports.

Lewis Howes 30:28 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 30:28 It was right under our nose, and what I'm about to tell you is right under everybody's nose. There's a five-second window between the instincts, the shoulds, the urges, the inner wisdom, the things that can change your life if you listen to it. Got a five-second window from the moment you feel that instinct to move, and if you don't, your brain is actually designed to kill it. Five seconds is all you have. The second you hesitate, it's act- and you feel yourself hesitating, that is a moment of huge power because what's happened is you've just started to pull back from something that you need to lean into. And if you count backwards five, four, three, two, one, and this is the neuroscience behind why this stupid little trick works, counting is a f- is an action. Mm. Counting backwards requires focus. It's also not a habit for you yet. So when you feel yourself hesitate, you're t- you're, you're triggering your mind that something's up. Like Lewis didn't hesitate when he pulled on his pants. He didn't hesitate when he's drinking his coffee. He didn't hesitate when he walked out the door to the gym, but now he's hesitating to make that call. Your mind now goes into a cognitive bias called the spotlight effect. It magnifies whatever it was that you hesitated doing. Mm-hmm. The moment. And the moment. Yeah. Like, all of a sudden, you're like, "Eh, I don't feel like it. Like, I don't, I don't know. Maybe I'll do it later." Right. And your mind is doing it 'cause your mind's trying to protect you. Hesitation signals a red flag to your mind that something's up. Just that small hesitation. It's a habit that we all have. Should you hesitate if you're getting a tattoo? Yes. [laughs] Should you hesitate if you're gambling? Yes. Should you hesitate if you are signing a legal document? Yes. You need your prefrontal cortex for those things. You need to interrupt it, make a power, make a decision. Should you hesitate on making a phone call? No. Should you hesitate on speaking up in a meeting? No. Should you hesitate when you feel yourself starting to procrastinate, and you know you got work that you should get done? No, you shouldn't hesitate at all. Should you hesitate in saying the thing that you really feel in your heart? No. Mm. You shouldn't. Should you hesitate and edit yourself when you're talk- No, you shouldn't. But we've all trained ourselves to. So it's actually this habit of hesitating. You start catching yourself. It's a huge moment of power 'cause you have a decision to make, and you gotta make it in the next five seconds. Are you gonna go on autopilot and get trapped in your mind, or are you gonna five, four, three, two, one and awaken your prefrontal cortex and drive forward? Mm.

Mel Robbins 32:47 So, um, I started to use this rule as I noticed that every day, all day long, I had these moments of inner wisdom where I would know that I needed to pick up the phone and stop isolating myself. Mm-hmm. I would know that I needed to call a bunch of media companies and start auditioning for radio show hosting gigs. I knew that I should get on, get out of bed on time. I knew I should stop myself before I snapped at Chris, right? Mm. Self-monitor. Yeah. I knew I should not feel... Let the frustration be the things that was driving me. And so I started to use the rule all day long. Whenever I felt this, I should do this, five, four, three, two, one, and I would make myself do it. And slowly, five seconds at a time, my entire life start- started to change. And my husband used it in his business, and he and his business partner dove in. They went on to open seven more restaurants. Um, I went- Mm ... on to launch and sell two businesses- Wow ... and get recruited by CNN and join their team. I had a syndicated radio show that, that, um, ended up winning the Gracie Award, which is kinda the female media, you know, awards- Nice ... for the number one talk show in the country. Um, and you know, I never intended to tell anybody about the 5 Second Rule, first of all, 'cause it's stupid. Right. [laughs] I mean, come on. Count backwards? That's the dumbest thing ever. Not stupid to me, though. What? Anything that works, works for me. That's true. You know what I mean? I'll take any stupid thing. [laughs] That's true. [laughs] I... And so I... But I also was like, how do you start talking about something like that, right? Yeah. So, um, I was asked to give a TED Talk like six years ago, and TED six years ago, not the brand that it was today. Yeah. They weren't even putting the talks online yet. Really? Yeah. Wow. The TEDx Talks were not online yet, and so that was the first speech I'd ever given in my life. If you wanna see what somebody looks like having a panic attack- [laughs] ... for 21 minutes straight, watch that speech. I was backstage, and it was like one PhD after another going out there. I'm like- They're both scientists, yeah ... "What the hell have I gotten myself into?" Yeah. "This is the dumbest thing." Um, and so at the very end, I wasn't even planning on talking about it. I say, "Oh, by the way, there's this thing I do." That's it. I don't even explain it. And you know why I didn't explain it, Lewis? I didn't know why it worked. Mm, so you didn't have the science or the research. You were just like- Zero. Zero. And then something crazy happened. They put that talk online a year later, and people started to write. We've heard from more than 100,000 people in 90 countries that have written to us, that, uh, are using the rule in ways big and small to change their lives, to change their marriages, to change their thinking patterns, to grow their businesses. Um, we know of- Mm ... 11 people that have stopped themselves from killing themselves. Wow. Um, in the moment, there's a gentleman that we talk about in the book, and you can see his social media posts. In London, he was a, he was a veteran, and he was suffering p- from post-traumatic stress disorder, and he boarded a ferry with the intention of jumping overboard. Mm. And he got to the railing, and he was standing there, and his inner wisdom kicked in. And this is another thing I want everybody watching to understand. I don't care what you're facing or how low you get. Your inner wisdom is always there. It is. And the thing is, is that we often don't listen to it. And so he's standing there, intending to kill himself, and that inner wisdom kicks in, and he remembers the 5 Second Rule, and he goes five, four, three, two, one, and he turns and physically moves away from the railing and finds the first person working on the ferry and tells him that he's suicidal. Mm. Saved his life. Wow. He saved his life because he listened to the inner wisdom. And this is the other thing I love about this rule. It's not something to think about. It's a tool to use. So the part of the problem with a lot of the advice that I've found, for me personally, is that a lot of advice is all about kind of doing mental battle. Mm-hmm. And if I go upstairs, I'm behind enemy lines, and I tend to get hijacked. Right. [laughs] So I love this tool because five, four, three, two, one interrupts those patterns- It actually prompts the part of the brain that I need in order to change, and it makes changing easier because I've now got my mind working for me instead of against me, and it gets me out of my head. And so, um, I'm, I'm

Mel Robbins 37:03 super excited to share this rule with people-

Lewis Howes 37:06 Mm

Mel Robbins 37:06 ... because I now know not only that it's working, n- just not, not for me, it's working for people around the world. And, you know, in the book, it took me three years to write it. It's all the science behind the rule.

Lewis Howes 37:18 Yeah.

Mel Robbins 37:18 It's got more than 150 social media posts in it, so you see stories from around the world of people using it to end procrastination, to build confidence, to deepen their relationships, to launch businesses, to explode the sales. Why does it help with sales? I'll tell you why. Because you can't sell by thinking.

Lewis Howes 37:36 Yeah.

Mel Robbins 37:37 Selling is about action. We have, we have, um, um-

Lewis Howes 37:40 [coughs]

Mel Robbins 37:41 ... groups from companies around the world, sales teams, that put five, four, three, two, one up on the wall.

Lewis Howes 37:45 Really?

Mel Robbins 37:45 I'm sure they hate me.

Lewis Howes 37:46 That's cool. [laughs]

Mel Robbins 37:47 Yes, because what... Cold calling. It's a momentum thing.

Lewis Howes 37:50 It is.

Mel Robbins 37:50 If you stop and think, the phone is not getting... The dialing is not happening when you're thinking.

Lewis Howes 37:54 Yeah. If you're thinking about all those no's you've been getting-

Mel Robbins 37:56 Yes

Lewis Howes 37:57 ... you're not gonna wanna do it again-

Mel Robbins 37:58 Yes

Lewis Howes 37:58 ... 'cause it doesn't feel good.

Mel Robbins 37:58 Yes. And if you're in the middle of a negotiation, or you're in the middle of a really difficult conversation and y- again, remember what we said earlier? You cannot control your feelings that rise up, but you can always control how you think and what you do. So if you're in the middle of a difficult conversation, and you feel those feelings come up that normally trigger you to start editing yourself, or to censor yourself, or to silence yourself, or to think sabotaging thoughts in, like, a business negotiation, five, four, three, two, one. Awaken the prefrontal cortex.

Lewis Howes 38:29 Mm.

Mel Robbins 38:29 Get back in the game. Um-

Lewis Howes 38:32 How has this rule helped you the most? In what area of your life? With your, your marriage, your business, in being more productive, in not having to, you know, take drugs when you're worried so much-

Mel Robbins 38:42 Right

Lewis Howes 38:42 ... or what's, what's... Or on stage. What's the area where you're like, "Wow, this has really had the biggest impact"? And I'm sure all of it, but-

Mel Robbins 38:49 Well, the most important thing in my life is my marriage. So my relationship with Chris is, like, the thing that brings me the greatest joy. I mean, I'll-

Lewis Howes 38:57 Yeah

Mel Robbins 38:57 ... just start crying [laughs] thinking about it.

Lewis Howes 38:58 Yeah, yeah.

Mel Robbins 38:59 And, um-

Lewis Howes 39:00 How many years you been married?

Mel Robbins 39:01 20, 20 years. We've been together for 22 years.

Lewis Howes 39:03 Wow.

Mel Robbins 39:04 Three kids.

Lewis Howes 39:04 Yes.

Mel Robbins 39:05 17, 16, 11. Um, it has given me mastery over myself. Like, I, I get so choked up just thinking-

Lewis Howes 39:15 Mm

Mel Robbins 39:15 ... about this. Like, I used to feel out of control.

Lewis Howes 39:19 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 39:19 And this rule allows me to be the best version of me and to interrupt, like, all the garbage that can trigger you, um, to behave in a way that's inconsistent with your values and your dreams. And so that has been the single greatest gift.

Lewis Howes 39:39 Mm. That's great.

Mel Robbins 39:40 That, and also, you know, I think the other thing that's super cool is that it is a tool that certainly prompts you to act, but it is also a tool that helps you tune in to your inner wisdom. Like, you're not only gonna start waking up, you'll be so in tune with those signals that come from your instincts, not emotional, not instinct sh- like, instinctual, that, um, that you, you get a direct line to your inner voice. You get a direct line. You know, y- all these people... One of the things that's always, that's always, um, struck me... So if you, if you list all the people that you admire-

Lewis Howes 40:19 Mm-hmm

Mel Robbins 40:19 ... right? Yeah, Richard Branson, Oprah Winfrey, Bill Gates. Like, everybody's got-

Lewis Howes 40:22 Mel Robbins

Mel Robbins 40:22 ... kind of the sa- Yeah, kinda, well, whatever. Um, [laughs] Lewis for sure.

Lewis Howes 40:27 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 40:27 Um, if you list all those people, Jay-Z, Beyon- like, everybody.

Lewis Howes 40:32 Yeah.

Mel Robbins 40:32 Everybody that you admire is doing the exact same thing. They actually listen to their inner wis- wisdom. They have figured out how to tune out the critic up here and trust the instincts. And, you know, I have this saying about confidence that I've only recently kinda stumbled into as I've been digging into more research around the science of confidence-

Lewis Howes 40:54 Mm

Mel Robbins 40:54 ... and the skill of confidence. 'Cause a lot of people think that confidence is a personality trait. It's not. It's actually a skill that you build through action. And a lot of people think confidence is a state of belief. It can be-

Lewis Howes 41:06 Mm-hmm

Mel Robbins 41:06 ... but that's not where it begins. And so I say that confidence is the willingness to try. That's all that it is.

Lewis Howes 41:16 Hmm.

Mel Robbins 41:16 Knowing that you may succeed or survive, but you'll still try. And to me, all those people that we admire most, that's what they're doing. They have the ability to tune into those instincts-

Lewis Howes 41:33 Mm

Mel Robbins 41:33 ... that are true for them. Because the fact is there's only one you. That's it. And you matter because there's only one you, and there's only ever gonna be one you. And your instincts, and your experiences, and your inner wisdom is a gift to the world. And every time that you tune it out because of the habit of hesitating, or the habit of self-doubt, or the habit of worrying, or the habit of overthinking, you are robbing the world of that gift that you have to, to give to everybody.

Lewis Howes 42:05 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 42:05 And you can use this simple, stupid, silly tool to train yourself to not only hear it, but also to develop the skill of courage to act on it.

Lewis Howes 42:15 Mm. Powerful.

Lewis Howes 42:16 And is there any area of your life where you feel like you lack courage still?

Mel Robbins 42:22 Um, you know, I'll admit, it's kind of easy. I think we all kinda go through those, those moments where you feel like you're behind. And I think social media is both an incredible tool, and it can also be, um, one of those triggers that makes you feel like-

Lewis Howes 42:36 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 42:37 ... "Look at how many followers this guy has," and like, "I'm gonna..."

Lewis Howes 42:40 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 42:40 Like, I'm like, "So tiny compared to this guy right here." Like, it's easy to-

Lewis Howes 42:45 Right

Mel Robbins 42:45 ... use technology and social media not for inspiration-

Lewis Howes 42:51 Mm-hmm

Mel Robbins 42:51 ... but actually ... as a way to bash yourself that you're not doing what other people are doing

Lewis Howes 42:57 Yeah, comparison and, or whatever. Yeah. I mean-

Mel Robbins 42:58 Yes. And so I think that I, I use the rule a lot for patience.

Lewis Howes 43:03 That's good.

Mel Robbins 43:03 I notice that my insecurity rises up s- because right now, you know, look, I, I did a ridiculous number of speeches last year. I travel way too much.

Lewis Howes 43:11 Mm.

Mel Robbins 43:11 I don't want my life to look like that. Um, it's a champagne problem, I get it.

Lewis Howes 43:15 Yeah. [laughs]

Mel Robbins 43:16 But, but I also have three kids and a marriage that I love, and I really feel depleted when I'm not with them.

Lewis Howes 43:22 Yeah.

Mel Robbins 43:22 And so I'm practicing patience as I make an intentional pivot in the kind of business that I'm running so that I have more of a life that I want as well.

Lewis Howes 43:32 Yeah, yeah.

Mel Robbins 43:32 So that's one area. Um, you know, I, I, I don't feel insecure as much as... You know, you know the term deliberate practice, right?

Lewis Howes 43:44 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 43:44 And you know the five-hour rule where-

Lewis Howes 43:46 Deliberate practice. Is that from The Talent Code? What book is that from?

Mel Robbins 43:48 Well, the deliberate practice is actually a psychological principle.

Lewis Howes 43:51 I think it was in a book called The Talent Code, but yeah.

Mel Robbins 43:52 Oh, yeah? Okay.

Lewis Howes 43:53 Yeah, yeah.

Mel Robbins 43:53 Well, it's a psychological principle that, you know, and you know the 10,000-hour rule.

Lewis Howes 43:56 For sports. I mean, deliberate practice is in sports. Yeah, of course.

Mel Robbins 43:58 Yes. So, so deliberate practice is this idea that, yeah, you could do 10,000 hours at anything and become an expert at it, but the way to do it faster is to, uh, deliberate, to do deliberate practice-

Lewis Howes 44:09 Yeah

Mel Robbins 44:09 ... which means you're practicing with the intention of improving.

Lewis Howes 44:11 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 44:12 And there's a feedback loop.

Lewis Howes 44:13 Yeah.

Mel Robbins 44:13 So just-

Lewis Howes 44:14 So you do 2,000 hours as opposed to 10,000.

Mel Robbins 44:15 Correct.

Lewis Howes 44:16 Right.

Mel Robbins 44:16 Like for example, if you wanna become an expert at guitar, learn scales.

Lewis Howes 44:20 Right.

Mel Robbins 44:20 Don't just sit there for 10,000 hours and play the same song.

Lewis Howes 44:22 Right.

Mel Robbins 44:22 If you learn scales, you get the finger dexterity and the muscle memory-

Lewis Howes 44:25 Yeah. Scales are hard, by the way

Mel Robbins 44:25 ... and the neural pathway development. Yes.

Lewis Howes 44:27 So hard. [laughs]

Mel Robbins 44:28 I saw your guitar over there.

Lewis Howes 44:28 So hard. [laughs]

Mel Robbins 44:29 I saw your guitar. You know, I always wanted to play guitar, but instead I forced my three children to learn.

Lewis Howes 44:33 That's good.

Mel Robbins 44:34 There you go. [laughs]

Lewis Howes 44:34 You just enjoy it.

Mel Robbins 44:35 I can't watch. [laughs] Exactly.

Lewis Howes 44:35 You just watch them. My brother's, uh, you know, the number one jazz violinist in the world.

Mel Robbins 44:40 What?

Lewis Howes 44:40 Yeah. And so I grew up watching the most incredible, like-

Mel Robbins 44:44 Now, is he built like you, too?

Lewis Howes 44:46 He used to be even, like, more jacked. They used to call him the Incredible Hulk of violin 'cause he was just, like-

Mel Robbins 44:51 Wow

Lewis Howes 44:51 ... super jacked.

Mel Robbins 44:51 Snap the thing in half as he-

Lewis Howes 44:52 Yeah. He-

Mel Robbins 44:53 ... "Ah," playing

Lewis Howes 44:53 ... he would. He would, like, slam it, like Jimi Hendrix style, yeah. Uh, but now he's leaned up a bunch actually, and so he's, yeah, he's incredible. So I used to just be all awestruck by his gifts, and it was unbelievable, his skill. And so I learned guitar. I taught myself when I was 18 just 'cause I was like, "I have to know something," you know, in terms of music.

Mel Robbins 45:12 That's pretty cool.

Lewis Howes 45:13 I can barely... You know, I'm like a hack, but-

Mel Robbins 45:15 Yeah

Lewis Howes 45:15 ... you know, at least I can do something.

Mel Robbins 45:16 Yeah.

Lewis Howes 45:16 So yeah.

Mel Robbins 45:17 So I'm, I'm kind of in this mode of, of improving myself, and I'll give you one more thing that I'm working on.

Lewis Howes 45:22 Yeah, yeah.

Mel Robbins 45:22 So I kinda think about my life in thr- or my work in three buckets. So we got this bucket here.

Lewis Howes 45:26 Yep.

Mel Robbins 45:26 We got this bucket, and we got this bucket. And so when you think about your business or you think about your passion or you think about work, I think about, "Okay, what do I need to do in terms of how much time and what actions do I need to take in order to develop the skills so that I can perform the work?"

Lewis Howes 45:43 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 45:43 So there's the deliberate practice that goes into practicing your skill and your com-

Lewis Howes 45:47 Skill mastery

Mel Robbins 45:48 ... yep, and your competency-

Lewis Howes 45:49 Yep

Mel Robbins 45:50 ... mastery, so that when it comes time to actually deliver the work, whether that's selling or standing on a stage or writing a book or talking to people or selling real estate or whatever it is that, that it may, that may be your passion-

Lewis Howes 46:02 Mm-hmm

Mel Robbins 46:02 ... deliver. This is the one I neglected last year.

Lewis Howes 46:06 Which is?

Mel Robbins 46:06 This bucket is, what are you doing to personally develop yourself so that you are the most capable, fulfilled, and satisfied human being, so that when you show up to do your competency and your skills-

Lewis Howes 46:23 Mm-hmm

Mel Robbins 46:24 ... and the delivery, that you as the human being are able to do that?

Lewis Howes 46:29 Yeah.

Mel Robbins 46:29 And so I've been spending a lot more time consuming content, reading books, watching, you know, your incredible show, and learning from other people. And I think that one of the traps that we entrepreneurs get into is we... I, I, I was feeling last year anyway like I was on a treadmill, and when I wasn't looking, somebody was coming by and turning up the speed.

Lewis Howes 46:53 Wow. [laughs] Sure.

Mel Robbins 46:54 And I was only in this alley.

Lewis Howes 46:55 And increasing the, uh, the, the hill s-

Mel Robbins 46:58 Yes

Lewis Howes 46:59 ... the, the bike [laughs] or whatever the-

Mel Robbins 47:00 Yes. Yes. And so, and if you're my age, you need, like, a diaper when somebody does that.

Lewis Howes 47:04 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 47:04 You're on a treadmill on a leash to keep you attached to it.

Lewis Howes 47:06 The incline, yes.

Mel Robbins 47:07 Exactly. So, um, I, uh, I've been focusing a lot on this.

Lewis Howes 47:11 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 47:11 And it's been interesting 'cause you and I were talking earlier too about you going to India and some of the stuff-

Lewis Howes 47:16 Mm-hmm

Mel Robbins 47:16 ... that you learned in terms of the different-

Lewis Howes 47:18 Yeah

Mel Robbins 47:18 ... states to be in, and I use one where I pay attention to where I'm feeling depleted versus where I'm energized.

Lewis Howes 47:25 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 47:25 And here's the thing. You can be doing things that are really hard that energize you. You can be doing things that are really scary that energize you. The same is true with things that deplete you. There are things in your life that are really easy for you. There are people that you hang out with, by the way, that you've been hanging out with for years.

Lewis Howes 47:45 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 47:45 But they deplete you. And so I've been starting to become more deliberate about how I distance myself from things that deplete me and how I spend more time and energy either doing or pushing myself to do those things that actually energize me, and this gets back to your message around passion, right?

Lewis Howes 48:06 Right.

Mel Robbins 48:07 And that, you know, the, the art and the skill of building a life that is guided by the things that you're passionate about.

Lewis Howes 48:13 Yeah. That's great.

Mel Robbins 48:14 So what is something that you're worried about or, or feeling insecure about or that, like, is the next big thing for you? I know you got a big book launch coming.

Lewis Howes 48:22 Yeah. That's one thing. I mean, I'm talking about a topic on masculinity. Actually, before-

Mel Robbins 48:26 Where are you going?

Lewis Howes 48:27 I wanna, I wanna-

Mel Robbins 48:27 Are you gonna do something with my-

Lewis Howes 48:28 I'll mention that.

Mel Robbins 48:29 Okay.

Lewis Howes 48:29 But here's the thing also I wanted to add. If this is, you know, mastering the skills-

Mel Robbins 48:33 Yep

Lewis Howes 48:34 ... and this is working on it or executing it-

Mel Robbins 48:37 Right

Lewis Howes 48:37 ... if we, you know, just to emphasize this, I was great at these two things as well my entire life, and I would achieve all my goals by executing the, the work-

Mel Robbins 48:47 Mm-hmm

Lewis Howes 48:47 ... on the skills.

Mel Robbins 48:48 Mm-hmm.

Lewis Howes 48:49 But I never had the fulfillment, and I was always lacking the inner peace or the inner- I don't know, it was just never enough. And so I never filled this up. I always went back to the mastering more skills and taking more action and mastering skills, and just feel like it was never enough-

Mel Robbins 49:04 I hear you

Lewis Howes 49:05 ... 'cause I never filled up this cup.

Mel Robbins 49:06 Right.

Lewis Howes 49:07 And once I started to, you know, about four years ago, opening up about a lot of the different traumas that I went through as a child, and just, like, growing up, you know, being sexually abused by-

Mel Robbins 49:16 Me too

Lewis Howes 49:16 ... by a man that I didn't know, my brother being in prison, you know, parents getting divorced like almost every kid. It wa- And being bullied, you know, just everything, and being dyslexic and being the bottom of my grade and all these things growing up a- all through school, not being able to read and write. I never filled this up, and so I was just so driven to prove people wrong.

Mel Robbins 49:34 Mm.

Lewis Howes 49:34 Learn the skills, master something, and show people that, that they're wrong about me, and it was just never enough. It was just this endless cycle of, like, never enough. No matter how big or how much money I made, it was never enough until I started to work on this cup-

Mel Robbins 49:48 Mm

Lewis Howes 49:48 ... and this bucket, and then everything shifted. So it's important that we do that as much as these two.

Mel Robbins 49:53 Yes. And you know, I know sometimes the message falls flat, you know, when you're in this, when you're, you're committed to h- to providing that kind of content for people, and you can get focused on creating it and not actually-

Lewis Howes 50:05 Yes

Mel Robbins 50:05 ... being somebody that, that is consuming enough of it.

Lewis Howes 50:08 Right.

Mel Robbins 50:08 And so that's a huge change that I made. Funny enough, on the, on the, um, male side, one of the biggest shifts that happened in my marriage with Chris is we had always been kind of even-Steven partners-

Lewis Howes 50:19 Mm-hmm

Mel Robbins 50:19 ... both with the parenting and, and with the finances-

Lewis Howes 50:22 Mm

Mel Robbins 50:22 ... and, and supporting one another, except for that phase where I was a real bitch and I was, like, saying, "You cannot follow your dreams."

Lewis Howes 50:27 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 50:27 That was all fear talking.

Lewis Howes 50:29 Sure.

Mel Robbins 50:29 Um, one of the coolest things that's happened for us is that as my speaking career took off organically and the world basically said, "Uh, lady, you need to teach the world this message-

Lewis Howes 50:40 Mm

Mel Robbins 50:40 ... and we don't care how much you're gonna kick and scream about it."

Lewis Howes 50:43 Right.

Mel Robbins 50:43 "We're gonna keep putting you on stages, and the phone's gonna keep ringing."

Lewis Howes 50:46 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 50:46 "And the- we need to know ab- people need to know about this." Um, my husband had always, like you, youngest of three boys, dad was crazy successful, wasn't around 'cause he traveled all the time. Chris had always had this thing in his mind that he hoped that they would grow the restaurant business and he would have this big kind of, you know, liquidity event.

Lewis Howes 51:07 Mm.

Mel Robbins 51:07 And then he could take off for years-

Lewis Howes 51:09 Yeah, yeah

Mel Robbins 51:09 ... and teach and be with our kids, and it just so turned out that it didn't work out that way in the restaurant business, but my career went like this. And so subsequently, we wouldn't be able to have the marriage or the family if Chris weren't running point at home.

Lewis Howes 51:23 Right.

Mel Robbins 51:23 And what's so cool-

Lewis Howes 51:24 Someone's gotta be there.

Mel Robbins 51:25 Well, yeah. But what's so cool is for an entire year he beat himself up about it.

Lewis Howes 51:29 Uh-huh.

Mel Robbins 51:30 And then-

Lewis Howes 51:31 Wow

Mel Robbins 51:31 ... he got sober. He went to a yoga intensive training. He's now a certified yoga instructor. He, uh, has a tractor.

Lewis Howes 51:41 Wow.

Mel Robbins 51:41 He just, he's, he runs the booster club for our high school sports. He created a triathlon in our town that's one of the biggest fundraisers-

Lewis Howes 51:48 Wow

Mel Robbins 51:48 ... for the town.

Lewis Howes 51:48 That's cool.

Mel Robbins 51:49 The guy has, like, found himself-

Lewis Howes 51:52 Yeah

Mel Robbins 51:52 ... and his strength, and we've realized something in our marriage where he's just not driven in terms of the financial piece or the, the, the-

Lewis Howes 52:03 Mm

Mel Robbins 52:03 ... you know, in the way that I am. And part of the conflict in our relationship for a long time was me putting those societal demands on him.

Lewis Howes 52:11 Mm.

Mel Robbins 52:11 Him feeling the obligation. And so the thing that's also been really cool is that when you start to discover the courage to speak what's true for you, it's amazing how things shake out and fall into place, and it gives other people the courage to explore and figure out what's true for them. Because the fact is, he is a way better, way better parent than I am.

Lewis Howes 52:34 Mm.

Mel Robbins 52:35 Especially for the ages that our kids are. And, um, it's, uh... And you know, I have this saying where I feel like every phase of your life requires a different you. And the phase that I'm in right now and the kind of parent that I am is, will be totally different when our daughter heads off to college next year.

Lewis Howes 52:55 Mm.

Mel Robbins 52:55 Different phase of my life is gonna require a different phase of me. And so it's been so killer to see us step into this different phase where he is so happy and self-expressed. And you know, I, I was, I, I was reminded of it 'cause you talked about this project, and I wanna hear more about it-

Lewis Howes 53:11 Mm

Mel Robbins 53:11 ... about what you're working on-

Lewis Howes 53:13 Mm

Mel Robbins 53:13 ... because he's now launching this tiny little retreat for guys.

Lewis Howes 53:18 That's cool. Wow.

Mel Robbins 53:18 You know, going... He's a big Knowles guy, so they're going off-

Lewis Howes 53:20 Sure

Mel Robbins 53:20 ... into the mountains and-

Lewis Howes 53:21 That's very cool

Mel Robbins 53:22 ... really exploring. Success is one thing. What does it actually mean to be satisfied with your life on your own terms and who you are? And so he's in this really cool inquiry about what does satisfaction with your life really look like when you take full responsibility for what truly matters to you?

Lewis Howes 53:41 Mm. Powerful.

Mel Robbins 53:43 Yeah.

Lewis Howes 53:43 Yeah, fulfillment. I mean, we can all learn how to be successful. If we can't be fulfilled, then it's a failure, you know?

Mel Robbins 53:49 Yeah.

Lewis Howes 53:50 Success is a failure without fulfillment. So yeah, I, um, you know, the book I'm talking about is, uh, it's called The Mask of Masculinity, and it's tapping into really what it means to be a man and redefining the new man as opposed to, like, what society has put on us.

Mel Robbins 54:06 Like beyond you guys wearing skinny jeans? [laughs]

Lewis Howes 54:08 Exactly. Yes, exactly. Yes.

Mel Robbins 54:10 I'm just kidding.

Lewis Howes 54:10 So I'm, you know, I'm, I'm excited about it. I guess I'm a little nervous.

Mel Robbins 54:13 Has it been confronting?

Lewis Howes 54:14 Yeah, I mean, 'cause in every chapter I break down myself and all the mistakes I've made as a man, and like, you know.

Mel Robbins 54:21 Now, are you in a relationship?

Lewis Howes 54:22 I am, yeah.

Mel Robbins 54:23 You are?

Lewis Howes 54:23 Yeah.

Mel Robbins 54:23 How long have you been?

Lewis Howes 54:24 About three years, yeah.

Mel Robbins 54:25 Okay.

Lewis Howes 54:26 Yeah. With a break in between, but yeah.

Mel Robbins 54:28 With the same person?

Lewis Howes 54:29 Yes. [laughs]

Mel Robbins 54:30 Okay.

Lewis Howes 54:31 So, um, it's, uh, it's been a lot of growth for me. Yeah. A lot of scary, you know, uncomfortable conversations, fears that I've, you know, five, four, three, two, one, right into it and have addressed it. And, uh, you know, I'm still figuring it out. I don't have all the answers still. I think the reason I love doing this show is because I interview and connect with the most inspiring people in the world who I wanna learn from and see, you know, how I can get better in the, the areas that they're strong in. So for me, it's a selfish reason doing this show to, like, take on so much great information and say, "Oh, how can I apply that to my life? And then how can I share that with the world?"

Mel Robbins 55:04 You know, it, it's, it's amazing. And, you know, one of the things that you said to me when we first started is-

Lewis Howes 55:08 Mm

Mel Robbins 55:08 ... uh, "What do you wanna get out of this?" And I talked about how I, I just wanna spread the idea that you can change your life in five seconds.

Lewis Howes 55:14 Yeah.

Mel Robbins 55:14 And I wanna spread the idea that you can't control how you feel, but you can always choose how you think and what you do. And one of the things that's so cool is that, you know, you and I are both outcome thinkers.

Lewis Howes 55:25 Yeah.

Mel Robbins 55:25 So we think about the outcome that we want, and then we figure out, "How am I gonna get there?" And when you go through life like that, it gives you so much mastery-

Lewis Howes 55:35 Yeah

Mel Robbins 55:35 ... over how you're gonna behave, because you're thinking about the things that you wanna cause.

Lewis Howes 55:40 Right. Yeah, that's powerful. Um, I wanna wrap it up with a few final questions-

Mel Robbins 55:45 Uh-oh

Lewis Howes 55:45 ... 'cause I know you gotta leave here soon.

Lewis Howes 55:46 So, um, this one is called the three truths. And if it was the last day for you many years from now, and you've achieved everything you want-

Mel Robbins 55:55 Or if the plane crashes today.

Lewis Howes 55:56 [laughs] No, no.

Mel Robbins 55:57 Geez. [laughs]

Lewis Howes 55:58 You've achieved everything you want many years ago-

Mel Robbins 56:00 And it does, it does. I mean, what am I gonna do?

Lewis Howes 56:01 Nothing you can do about it, that's right.

Mel Robbins 56:03 Right.

Lewis Howes 56:03 Um, and you've written all the books in the world that you want to, the courses, the speeches, everything you've done. You've spoken to the world. But for whatever reason, all you have is a pen and a piece of paper to write down three final truths, and they have nothing else to be re- reminded of you or remember you by.

Mel Robbins 56:20 Are you trying to make me cry?

Lewis Howes 56:22 No, no.

Mel Robbins 56:22 You do this ... Oh, my Lord, okay.

Lewis Howes 56:23 Every, every episode we talk about this.

Mel Robbins 56:25 [laughs]

Lewis Howes 56:26 Um, so all your books are erased, all your videos are gone, the TED Talks with hundreds of millions of views are gone. You have a piece of paper and a pen. Three final truths that you would share with the world, and this is all they have to remember you by. What would that be?

Mel Robbins 56:39 Um, it would be that, uh, there's only one you, and there ev- there will only ever be one you. Um, so make sure that you listen to what your heart is saying and always do that.

Lewis Howes 56:54 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 56:54 I would say you can change your life in five seconds, and the moment that you feel the instinct to act, count five, four, three, two, one, then go.

Lewis Howes 57:03 Awesome. I love it.

Mel Robbins 57:04 [laughs]

Lewis Howes 57:05 It's a great answer. I want to, um, make sure everyone gets this book. This is gonna change your life, The 5 Second Rule. Make sure to go grab it right now. Get it on Amazon, get it on Barnes & Noble. Uh, go to your local bookstore. It's everywhere. Go get it, and send a message to Mel on Twitter or Instagram or Facebook. What's your... Is it the same handle everywhere?

Mel Robbins 57:27 Yeah, it's basically Mel Robbins.

Lewis Howes 57:29 Mel Robbins.

Mel Robbins 57:29 We use the hashtag 5 Second Rule. And one cool thing I want you to know, when you, when you spend the f- it's 15 bucks right now on Amazon, and I'm so proud, 'cause we're number one new release in four categories.

Lewis Howes 57:38 Congrats. Amazing.

Mel Robbins 57:40 Thank you. And, uh, more importantly, it's changing lives around the world. We taped 31 crazy awesome mentoring sessions.

Lewis Howes 57:47 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 57:47 And on the back page of this book, there's a little URL right here where you get them for free.

Lewis Howes 57:52 Awesome. Cool.

Mel Robbins 57:53 Yeah, so you get these videos that we shot at the house that are awesome about my Jedi mind tricks-

Lewis Howes 57:58 Sure

Mel Robbins 57:58 ... that I use-

Lewis Howes 57:58 Awesome

Mel Robbins 57:59 ... in parenting and relationships-

Lewis Howes 58:00 Yeah

Mel Robbins 58:00 ... and overwhelm and all that stuff.

Lewis Howes 58:02 Melrobbins.com/31sessions, and check out melrobbins.com to get more information. I'm excited. Uh, we'll link everything up in the show notes. Before I ask the final question-

Mel Robbins 58:13 Yeah

Lewis Howes 58:13 ... I wanna acknowledge you for a moment, Mel, for your incredible gift and contribution to this world. You are a unique, lovely-

Mel Robbins 58:20 [laughs]

Lewis Howes 58:20 ... inspiration, and I'm dead serious. I didn't know who you were before about a, three weeks ago, and I reached out to you, and I was just like, "I'm really curious about learning more about you and connecting with you," and I'm so glad that I did, because you are making a massive impact. So I'm so grateful we've connected. I'm so glad my audience gets to, to watch this and hear about you. And make sure you guys follow her, 'cause she's a game changer. Um, so thank you for being here.

Mel Robbins 58:45 Aw.

Lewis Howes 58:45 Yes. Thank you.

Mel Robbins 58:46 Lewis.

Lewis Howes 58:46 I appreciate it.

Mel Robbins 58:47 All right, right back at you. So listen, I've been stalking you for more than two years.

Lewis Howes 58:50 [laughs] Okay.

Mel Robbins 58:50 And so I feel like a little bit of a fan girl walking in to, to tape this.

Lewis Howes 58:55 Sure. Yeah.

Mel Robbins 58:55 And the thing that, that really jumps out to me is just you are a guy that is all about abundance and passion.

Lewis Howes 59:01 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 59:01 And the thing that is so rare in this world is people that open up their hearts and their influence-

Lewis Howes 59:07 Mm

Mel Robbins 59:07 ... to help everybody around you.

Lewis Howes 59:09 Right.

Mel Robbins 59:09 And so I just love your heart, I love your soul, and I love the generosity-

Lewis Howes 59:16 Mm. Thank you

Mel Robbins 59:16 ... of spirit that you have for the world. And it has been such a privilege and such a freaking fan girl moment-

Lewis Howes 59:21 [laughs]

Mel Robbins 59:22 ... to be here with Lewis.

Lewis Howes 59:23 Appreciate it. [laughs]

Mel Robbins 59:24 Oh, my God. And wear the headset and get to share this-

Lewis Howes 59:27 [laughs] I appreciate it

Mel Robbins 59:28 ... with your audience.

Lewis Howes 59:29 I appreciate it.

Mel Robbins 59:29 Truly. So-

Lewis Howes 59:30 Thank you

Mel Robbins 59:30 ... anything I can do to help you-

Lewis Howes 59:32 Thank you

Mel Robbins 59:32 ... you, you put me on speed dial, brother.

Lewis Howes 59:34 I will. I will. I have one final question.

Mel Robbins 59:36 Please.

Lewis Howes 59:37 What's your definition of greatness?

Mel Robbins 59:39 Of greatness?

Lewis Howes 59:39 Mm-hmm.

Mel Robbins 59:40 Hearing your truth and speaking it, no matter how your voice shakes.

Lewis Howes 59:44 Mel Robbins, thank you so much for being here. Appreciate it.

Mel Robbins 59:46 Thank you. Oh, I love you.