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On with Kara SwisherThe untold stories of Trump 2.0
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At a glance
WHAT IT’S REALLY ABOUT
Inside Trump 2.0: tech groveling, AI conversion, and monetized power
- Maggie Haberman and Jonathan Swan describe how they rebuilt their book to focus on the first 14 months of Trump’s second term, discarding anything they couldn’t verify due to a smaller, more guarded inner circle.
- They portray a dramatic shift in Trump’s relationship with tech and business leaders, emphasizing both their eagerness to align with him and Trump’s delight in making that alignment public and performative.
- Jonathan Swan recounts a 2024 OpenAI briefing where Trump’s fear of AI flipped to enthusiasm after a ChatGPT demonstration, which the authors connect to a broadly hands-off early approach to AI regulation.
- The conversation depicts Elon Musk’s period of extraordinary influence in the administration as a destabilizing ‘presidency within a presidency,’ including clashes with cabinet officials and the elimination of USAID.
- They argue Trump’s second term features unprecedented monetization and blurred lines between public power and private gain, enabled by presidential immunity claims, lack of DOJ independence, and a pardon-centered incentive structure.
IDEAS WORTH REMEMBERING
5 ideasThe authors describe an unusually strict reporting standard driven by uncertainty and a smaller inner circle.
They say they discarded anything that wasn’t verifiable, including large amounts of earlier reporting, because they wanted the most accurate account possible of the first 14 months of Trump’s second term.
The book’s credibility, they argue, is reinforced by specific scenes that no one has directly refuted.
He says the circle around Trump has shrunk, making information harder to obtain, but notes the book includes detailed, unflattering scenes that have not been specifically denied by participants—only a broad Trump denial that it’s all fake.
Trump is portrayed as using humiliation and public signaling to test loyalty and display dominance over elites.
They describe Trump taking joy in public displays of deference—showing flattering texts as “trophies,” and creating moments that signal buy-in to his worldview, such as playing the “J6 Choir” anthem while guests stand with hands on hearts.
The episode frames Big Tech’s pivot as both ideological and transactional, amplified by fear of being left behind.
They argue multiple forces pushed tech leaders toward Trump, including dislike of the Biden administration’s approach to regulation and DEI, plus Trump’s willingness to reward allies and punish enemies; they also describe competitive pressure among rivals to “get in the game.”
A single hands-on AI demo is depicted as a pivotal moment shaping a hands-off regulatory posture.
Swan recounts a 2024 campaign meeting where Trump’s view of AI flipped after seeing ChatGPT generate a poem; Trump moved quickly from fear to asking how he could help OpenAI, which Swan links to an early “open season” period for AI firms in the first year.
WORDS WORTH SAVING
5 quotesYou begin with faul- false until proven otherwise.
— Jonathan Swan
When we were remotely uncertain about something, it went on the cutting room floor, uh, because we wanted to have the, the most accurate version of history that we could.
— Maggie Haberman
I don't think I'll ever do another book, Kara. Like, I'm really not being-- I'm not kidding.
— Jonathan Swan
This is something of a scale that we've never seen before in the American presidency, and it's actually not even close.
— Jonathan Swan
His, his shamelessness is his superpower.
— Maggie Haberman
SPEAKERS
Jonathan Swan
guestPolitical journalist and reporter covering Trump, and co-author with Maggie Haberman.
Kara Swisher
hostJournalist and host of the podcast "On with Kara Swisher."
Maggie Haberman
guestNew York Times political reporter covering Donald Trump and co-author with Jonathan Swan.
High quality AI-generated summary created from speaker-labeled transcript.
