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Tim FerrissTim Ferriss

How to Thrive in an AI World, Tips for Life’s Darkest Hours, & The Art of Sabbaticals (4K)

Brought to you by: Momentous high-quality supplements https://livemomentous.com/tim Helix Sleep premium mattresses https://helixsleep.com/tim AG1 all-in-one nutritional supplement https://drinkag1.com/tim Show notes and resources from this interview with Matt Mullenweg: https://tim.blog/2023/12/29/matt-mullenweg-2/ Texts: https://texts.com/ Automattic: https://automattic.com/ Matt Mullenweg's website: https://ma.tt/ Matt Mullenweg on Twitter: https://twitter.com/photomatt "What’s in My Bag, 2023" by Matt Mullenweg: https://ma.tt/2023/12/the-bag-post/ Matt Mullenweg (@photomatt) is co-founder of the open-source publishing platform WordPress, which now powers over 40 percent of all sites on the web. He is the founder and CEO of Automattic, the company behind WordPress.com, WooCommerce, Tumblr, WPVIP, Day One, Texts, and Pocket Casts. Additionally, Matt runs Audrey Capital, an investment and research company. He has been recognized for his leadership by Forbes, Bloomberg Businessweek, Inc., TechCrunch, Fortune, Fast Company, Wired, University Philosophical Society, and Vanity Fair. Matt is originally from Houston, Texas, where he attended the High School for the Performing and Visual Arts and studied jazz saxophone. In his spare time, Matt is an avid photographer. He currently splits his time between Houston and San Francisco. Please enjoy this interview with Matt Mullenweg! [00:00] Start [00:14] The Argentine Dr. Mullenweg. [03:23] Open source. [05:35] Secret hiring. [08:24] Matt is always on tour. [10:45] Texts. [13:15] How Matt chooses his next project(s). [17:38] Building a digital Berkshire Hathaway. [25:05] Why Matt’s excited about messaging. [28:16] How Matt discovers companies he buys. [29:06] RIP, Charlie Munger. [29:40] Worthy rereads. [32:24] My reflections on blogging, writing, and podcasting. [44:51] Tyler Cowen’s inimitable style. [45:40] Matt’s high school economics competition. [53:26] Cables. [54:23] AI spellcasting and community. [57:45] Developments that will amaze the future. [1:01:42] AI-proofing jobs. [1:04:26] Why Matt’s optimistic about future generations. [1:09:16] Data Liberation Front. [1:11:30] More open app stores. [1:16:33] Invisible tools (and weapons) of competition. [1:21:36] Online security advice for the layman. [1:24:25] WordCamp Asia. [1:30:16] Taking a sa-Matt-ical. [1:44:27] Rethinking nuclear energy. [1:46:42] Rethinking psychedelics risks. [1:57:40] Rethinking breathwork. [2:01:51] Coping with depression. [2:15:47] Rethinking TikTok. [2:17:21] Blogging: absurd and beautiful. [2:19:34] Rethinking Vienna sausages. [2:20:52] Pocket ranch. [2:22:32] Answering ancient emails. [2:23:44] The curse of the ultra-critical eye. [2:27:07] Rethinking meditation. [2:30:08] Bacterial dentistry. [2:33:57] Pocket party. [2:34:47] Parting thoughts. Tim Ferriss is one of Fast Company’s “Most Innovative Business People” and an early-stage tech investor/advisor in Uber, Facebook, Twitter, Shopify, Duolingo, Alibaba, and 50+ other companies. He is also the author of five #1 New York Times and Wall Street Journal bestsellers: The 4-Hour Workweek, The 4-Hour Body, The 4-Hour Chef, Tools of Titans and Tribe of Mentors. The Observer and other media have named him “the Oprah of audio” due to the influence of his podcast, The Tim Ferriss Show, which has exceeded 900 million downloads and been selected for “Best of Apple Podcasts” three years running. Sign up for "5-Bullet Friday" (Tim's free weekly email newsletter): https://go.tim.blog/5-bullet-friday-yt/ Follow the Tim Ferriss Podcast: https://tim.blog/podcast/ Visit the Tim Ferriss Blog: https://tim.blog/ Follow Tim Ferriss on Twitter: https://twitter.com/tferriss/ Follow Tim Ferriss on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/timferriss/ Like Tim Ferriss on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/TimFerriss/

Tim FerrisshostMatt Mullenwegguest
Dec 29, 20232h 36mWatch on YouTube ↗

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At a glance

WHAT IT’S REALLY ABOUT

Matt Mullenweg and Tim Ferriss on open source, AI, sabbaticals, and changed minds

  1. Matt Mullenweg explains his open source philosophy and how Automattic works as a 'digital Berkshire Hathaway,' using open APIs and plugins to lower coordination costs across acquisitions like Tumblr, Day One and Texts.
  2. He describes his optimism about AI and open source, expects roughly 10x model improvements next year, and says he now thinks learning to code is still worthwhile.
  3. Mullenweg announces a 2024 sabbatical, his first in 18 years, and discusses what success would look like, the temptations he fears (social media, news, screens), and his fear of irrelevance.
  4. Both men discuss depression, with Ferriss sharing resources and frameworks such as state-story-strategy, and Mullenweg sharing his own recent experience of apathy and a three-part checklist from his mother.
  5. In a lightning round Mullenweg lists changed views on nuclear power, psychedelic risks, breathwork, TikTok, and meditation, plus absurd habits like replying to years-old emails and carrying pocket ranch.

IDEAS WORTH REMEMBERING

5 ideas

Open source lowers coordination costs for a multi-product company.

Mullenweg says WooCommerce can build on WordPress without meetings thanks to open APIs and plugins, avoiding the duplicated incentives he sees at companies like Google and Salesforce.

Don't build on proprietary platforms that can pull the rug.

Mullenweg cites Twitter and Facebook cutting off third-party clients, and Apple shutting down Beeper, as examples of why open source rights can't be revoked.

AI's near-term business impact is still modest, but fast progress is expected.

Mullenweg says customer-service bots remain poor (the Ford dealership example) but predicts a 10x model leap next year and fast open source catch-up; he is building AI that shows users the steps so they learn.

Sabbaticals help the organization as well as the individual.

Mullenweg says a two-to-three-month absence exposes bottlenecks, creates leadership opportunities, and has rarely led to people quitting, even though he has never taken one himself.

Change your state before your story and strategy when depressed.

Ferriss describes a Tony Robbins-derived sequence: change your energy state first (cold shower, pushups), then your story becomes more enabling and your strategies more effective.

WORDS WORTH SAVING

5 quotes

Companies don't die from competition. They usually die from suicide.

— Matt Mullenweg

I guess I have a core assumption to my optimism, which is a fundamental goodness of human nature.

— Matt Mullenweg

Open source is the opposite. It's all about almost like a bill of rights for you as the user.

— Matt Mullenweg

the act of writing forces you to clarify your thinking.

— Matt Mullenweg

if you're not willing to do four weeks of things that will benefit you anyway, you shouldn't throw your Play-Doh in the microwave.

— Tim Ferriss

Open source and WordPressAutomattic's acquisition strategyTexts and multi-messaging appsAI, prompts and career adviceData Liberation Front and app store opennessSabbatical planningDepression and coping tools

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