Asma Khan: Stop Calling it Curry | What Now? with Trevor Noah

1. 0:00 – 2:00

   Trevor's hilarious cooking confession

   1. TNTrevor Noah0:00

      [upbeat music] So I love, um, pig trotters.

   2. AKAsma Khan0:06

      Yeah.

   3. TNTrevor Noah0:07

      Right? Uh, generally any, any like-

   4. AKAsma Khan0:09

      So it's like paya

   5. EUEugene0:10

      You can't call them hoof. You can't call them pig trotters.

   6. AKAsma Khan0:11

      Okay, any hoof.

   7. EUEugene0:13

      Pork.

   8. AKAsma Khan0:13

      Okay.

   9. TNTrevor Noah0:13

      Any hoof, any-

   10. AKAsma Khan0:13

       Whatever. Trotter is trotter.

   11. EUEugene0:15

       [laughs]

   12. TNTrevor Noah0:16

       Any hoof, any... You know what I mean?

   13. AKAsma Khan0:17

       Yeah, yeah. So we have paya. N- nehri.

   14. TNTrevor Noah0:19

       Is that what it's... Yeah, okay.

   15. AKAsma Khan0:20

       Nehri, yeah.

   16. TNTrevor Noah0:20

       Right. So pig, cow, you name it. Just like-

   17. EUEugene0:22

       Chicken

   18. TNTrevor Noah0:22

       ... anything with a hoof.

   19. EUEugene0:23

       Yeah.

   20. TNTrevor Noah0:24

       I'm in.

   21. AKAsma Khan0:24

       Yeah.

   22. TNTrevor Noah0:24

       I'm in. The gelatinous-

   23. AKAsma Khan0:25

       Yeah, yeah, yeah

   24. TNTrevor Noah0:26

       ... I love gelatinous food.

   25. AKAsma Khan0:27

       Yeah, yeah, of course. Yeah

   26. TNTrevor Noah0:27

       ... you know? So you can't really find much of it, especially like Hunanese, I think that's how you pronounce the cuisine, in, in South Africa. So Eugene one day says to me, he goes, "Yo, I... Why don't I, uh... I can cook that for you." Then I was like, "Shame, my friend, he's really-

   27. EUEugene0:42

       [laughs]

   28. TNTrevor Noah0:43

       ... this is, like, a lovely gesture-

   29. EUEugene0:44

       [laughs]

   30. TNTrevor Noah0:45

       ... but completely unnecessary."
2. 2:00 – 9:40

   Trevor vs. his "smart" stove

   1. EUEugene2:00

      universe conspired for, for this interview hap- to happen today because of what happened to me this morning. And I feel like you might be overqualified for this question, but you will indulge me.

   2. TNTrevor Noah2:12

      What happened this morning?

   3. EUEugene2:13

      It's not really a question. It's actually a, for a word we use a lot in India, calamity.

   4. AKAsma Khan2:17

      Yeah. [laughs]

   5. TNTrevor Noah2:21

      [laughs]

   6. AKAsma Khan2:21

      Oh, now I want to know what happened to you. You used the word calamity.

   7. TNTrevor Noah2:26

      [laughs] For you-

   8. EUEugene2:27

      That's not a, that's not a small word

   9. TNTrevor Noah2:28

      ... a word we use in India a lot. [laughs]

   10. AKAsma Khan2:31

       That's a loaded word.

   11. TNTrevor Noah2:33

       Ah.

   12. EUEugene2:34

       [laughs] So this morning, bought groceries. Two days with the groceries, and I thought to myself this morning, "Let me make myself egg and toast," right? And a little bit of Italian sausage. Then I try to turn on the stove. The stove said, "Do you have the app?" I said, "No, I don't have the app." Downloaded the app. Swear.

   13. TNTrevor Noah3:00

       Was the stove talking or does it write this?

   14. EUEugene3:01

       It writes there on the screen.

   15. TNTrevor Noah3:02

       Oh, okay, okay, cool.

   16. EUEugene3:03

       You see where, on the oven side where it's supposed to show you the temperature of whatever setting you are on?

   17. TNTrevor Noah3:07

       Yeah. It said, "Do you have the app?"

   18. EUEugene3:08

       Yeah. It says, "Download app."

   19. TNTrevor Noah3:10

       Yeah.

   20. EUEugene3:10

       "Searching for app." Then I downloaded the app. Then the app said, "Connect to, put Bluetooth and also Wi-Fi."

   21. TNTrevor Noah3:17

       For a stove?

   22. EUEugene3:18

       Stove.

   23. TNTrevor Noah3:19

       Oh, wow.

   24. EUEugene3:19

       Then I was like, "Okay, maybe let's give up on the oven. Let me go to the induction top side of it." Put the plate, put the pan, put the oil, switched it on. The stove said, "Do, do, do." And I was like, "We're on, we're in business now." Picked my temperature. Five seconds later, stove went off. Kept doing that. Went onto YouTube, tried to Google what's going on. At the end of searching, after five videos, it says, "For the induction stove of that make exactly, you have to have steel bottom-"

   25. TNTrevor Noah3:51

       Pans

   26. EUEugene3:51

       ... pans."

   27. TNTrevor Noah3:51

       Yeah, yeah.

   28. AKAsma Khan3:52

       Yes.

   29. TNTrevor Noah3:52

       That makes sense.

   30. AKAsma Khan3:52

       Yeah.
3. 9:40 – 15:30

   Meet Asma Khan

   1. TNTrevor Noah9:40

      in one of the last bastions for real.

   2. EUEugene9:44

      Oh.

   3. TNTrevor Noah9:44

      Right? It, because w- when I, when I was thinking of this conversation, I was thinking of who you are, Asma Khan. I was like, there's so many places to try and position you, but you exist, you spill over into more than one space, which is, which is what I think I've, I've always loved about you as a person. You're so dynamic.

   4. EUEugene9:59

      Mm.

   5. TNTrevor Noah9:59

      You know, y- you can say Asma Khan from Chef's Table. That's how a lot of people go, "Oh, yes, Chef's Table. I've watched Chef's Table," and it, it's, it's, it's, like, art that talks about food, and then it talks about culture, and then it brings you into a world. And, and it, and if people know you from there, they'll know one side of you. There are some people who know you from your restaurant in England, and they'll go, "Oh, I've been there. It's, it's one of the most amazing places, and the, and the food and the stories in the kitchen and, and, and the, you know, everything that goes into preparing this, this feast-

   6. AKAsma Khan10:28

      Mm-hmm

   7. TNTrevor Noah10:29

      ... is how I know you." Then I'm sure there's some people who know you f- back from India. There's some people who know you just from England, from getting your PhD. There's some people who k- you, you, you're this person who's so complex and so broad, and I feel like you have to be like that because of your life.

   8. AKAsma Khan10:45

      Mm.

   9. TNTrevor Noah10:45

      You, you're like a product of your life. Does that make sense?

   10. AKAsma Khan10:48

       Absolutely, it makes sense, and, I mean, you've explained it better than I could have tried to explain to someone else why I am, uh, this person who ... I see myself always, uh, you know, there's this kind of, in Sufi Islam, there's a lot of talk about this journey of the river into the ocean. That is, you know, the ultimate thing, but it's also what we say, that is when you reach fulfillment as well, and you reach that goal in life.

   11. TNTrevor Noah11:14

       Mm.

   12. AKAsma Khan11:14

       And as a river, I've, I've always seen myself as, as a force of water, and I moisten the earth around me, and I will never see the harvest that grows after I move on. And I break the, the bricks and the stones that block me and that block everybody, my color of skin, my name, my accent-

   13. TNTrevor Noah11:34

       Mm

   14. AKAsma Khan11:35

       ... my fabric that I wear.

   15. TNTrevor Noah11:36

       Mm-hmm.

   16. AKAsma Khan11:36

       So I have to be more than one kind of thing, because it's not just that we don't have a seat on the table. There are multiple reasons why you don't have a seat on the table.

   17. TNTrevor Noah11:47

       Mm.

   18. AKAsma Khan11:48

       I need ... You know, a lot of people after Chef's Table told me, "Oh, wow, you broke the glass ceiling. You was the first British chef on Chef's Table." But bill- underneath that, it's very nuanced. I'm layered. I have lots of other things that I am.

   19. TNTrevor Noah12:02

       Yeah, yeah.

   20. AKAsma Khan12:03

       But one thing I felt very strongly, and I would tell people that I, I am not standing in some glass ceiling with glass around me. I want to bring the edifice down. I want to break every door and every window that keeps out people like me. Not just women, men and women who are excluded from having a seat on the table, who are excluded. And for that, I've had to use, dig deep inside who I am.

   21. TNTrevor Noah12:31

       Mm-hmm.

   22. AKAsma Khan12:31

       So from my spirituality to my education, to being discriminated as a child and being made to feel unwanted, unloved, a surplus in a family, I clawed myself out of that to victory. And it's not that it's easy. I run a different race from a white person-

   23. TNTrevor Noah12:55

       Mm

   24. AKAsma Khan12:56

       ... a white man. I run a different race from a white woman because I've, in my race, I carry cultural baggage, my choice, but I have to go through fire every time to prove-

   25. TNTrevor Noah13:10

       Wow

   26. AKAsma Khan13:10

       ... that I'm good enough. But what happens is I come out glistening like gold. I know where I need to go, and this is probably why it helps, that at different times I can dig deep into something I learnt as a lawyer, my, you know, time in India, understanding the importance of solidarity between-

   27. TNTrevor Noah13:35

       Yeah

   28. AKAsma Khan13:35

       ... women. So it's not that there's one thing that I can lean on. I go through storms using different techniques because in the end I need to get to shore.

   29. TNTrevor Noah13:46

       My mom would respond to this by saying, "Amen."

   30. AKAsma Khan13:49

       [laughs]
4. 15:30 – 23:30

   Growing up feeling unwanted

   1. TNTrevor Noah15:30

      but where'd it all begin? So let, let's go to the beginning. Where, where, where would you say is the, is the most formative moment that starts your life?

   2. AKAsma Khan15:39

      I remember this so clearly. I remember when my brother was born, who was three years older than me. So I was three.

   3. TNTrevor Noah15:48

      Okay.

   4. AKAsma Khan15:49

      And the ... Everybody came because, you know, then you don't have a kind of Facebook text saying, "Oh, this is my baby, just arrived." Uh, this is 1972. And people came and didn't believe that I had a brother because it, you know, after the two girls-

   5. TNTrevor Noah16:04

      Mm

   6. AKAsma Khan16:04

      ... the boy was born, the heir to the family name. And I remember at that time being confused why everyone called me a liar because my mother did not celebrate. My parents did not light the house up or distribute sweets, which is a tradition in our culture. You know, when a boy is born, a lot of, a lot of sweets are given out.

   7. TNTrevor Noah16:23

      Oh, I did not know that. Okay.

   8. AKAsma Khan16:24

      Yeah. And often when a girl is born, nothing happens. No fireworks, no, no, no kind of celebration because it's like, it's almost like a death-

   9. TNTrevor Noah16:34

      Mm

   10. AKAsma Khan16:34

       ... because the family has now got another burden. The girl-

   11. TNTrevor Noah16:38

       Wow

   12. AKAsma Khan16:39

       ... is not so celebrated. I remember from then on that nobody believed me because nothing happened, and I think that that and the way that my sister stood f- by me really transformed things because we are very obsessed about color, and I was dark-skinned. Uh, I was fat, but I loved cricket. I played on the streets with the street children. My parents ignored that. My father would come and ask me, "Did you get out? I hope you beat those boys," you know, "I hope you did well," and ... but would not say it openly. If he saw me on the street and drove past, he ignored me so that he did not have to acknowledge that he saw his daughter playing on the street, street cricket. But when people would tell me that I was fat and ugly, uh, in my extended family, and that nothing, you know, good would happen, that no one would marry me, which was the, like, the biggest thing they can say, my sister, who everybody loved, my sister still bloody looks younger than me. She's a year and a half older than me. She's a rock star. She looked, she still looks like a model. Beautiful girl, fair, long hair. She was the princess in the family, and everybody adored her. Everybody loved her. I, I don't think many people loved me. And she would hold my hand in the darkness away from everybody and tell me, "Asma, you're the warrior princess. When you speak, the earth will shake. One day the world will know who you are." I believed her.

   13. TNTrevor Noah18:11

       Wow.

   14. AKAsma Khan18:11

       I believed her because everybody who loved her- Thought she was great

   15. TNTrevor Noah18:16

       Mm-hmm

   16. AKAsma Khan18:16

       But that person believed in me. And this is why at a very young age, I realized one thing. If you speak up and you tell someone in the darkness, you don't need to be brave to speak up, say it in silence, do something. My sister by telling me I was the warrior princess, today I am the warrior princess, but it's because of her.

   17. TNTrevor Noah18:38

       Mm.

   18. AKAsma Khan18:38

       These are the transformation things that happened when I was very young, and I realized that my mother and father were not discriminating between me and my brother, between my- me and my sister, even though I know that behind my back, and sometimes in my hearing, I could hear people saying, "What's gonna happen to her? She's a liability."

   19. TNTrevor Noah18:54

       That must have been so hard, though.

   20. AKAsma Khan18:56

       Yeah.

   21. TNTrevor Noah18:56

       Like, you- you're growing up in a world where ... Because when ... You know, I think we take for granted how when you're a child, you're just a child.

   22. EUEugene19:04

       Mm-hmm.

   23. TNTrevor Noah19:04

       You're just being you.

   24. EUEugene19:05

       That's all you are.

   25. TNTrevor Noah19:06

       That's all you are-

   26. EUEugene19:06

       Yeah

   27. TNTrevor Noah19:06

       ... and that's all you've ever been.

   28. EUEugene19:08

       Yes.

   29. TNTrevor Noah19:08

       You know, when you're an adult, you get to look back on yourself as a child-

   30. EUEugene19:11

       Yes
5. 23:30 – 42:30

   Childhood, resilience & survival

   1. TNTrevor Noah23:30

      themselves in a new place in life that doesn't look like where they came from, and then they feel guilty voicing that they still have pain or hurt or-

   2. AKAsma Khan23:40

      Yeah

   3. TNTrevor Noah23:40

      ... Do, do you get what I'm saying?

   4. EUEugene23:40

      Absolutely.

   5. TNTrevor Noah23:41

      And then, but then what happens is they'll, they'll act out their pain, I find.

   6. EUEugene23:45

      Yeah.

   7. AKAsma Khan23:45

      Yeah.

   8. TNTrevor Noah23:46

      So I, I think, I think in, in life if you are hurt or if you're in pain or if you have suffered or you, you know, you've gone through traumatic things when you were growing up, if you're unable to voice those things, I feel like you will act them out whether you like it or not. And then people wonder why someone who's famous or rich or powerful, you're like, "Why is this person such an asshole? Why are they being like this?"

   9. EUEugene24:09

      [laughs]

   10. TNTrevor Noah24:09

       I, I think it's because they can't say their pain.

   11. EUEugene24:13

       It ... Yeah. You're right. I think it's vocabulary. I think when you're younger, your vocabulary is acting out. That's all you can do. Babies after they're born-

   12. TNTrevor Noah24:22

       Oh, yeah, yeah

   13. EUEugene24:22

       ... when they're, when they're hungry, they cry. When they can't sleep, they cry.

   14. TNTrevor Noah24:25

       Yeah.

   15. EUEugene24:25

       You know? So I think as you get older, but I also think when you ... There's something strange that happened to me. When I reached the age of what my dad was at the time that my parents divorced, I looked at their divorce differently. I looked at a man who wanted to do something else and ended up doing another thing.

   16. TNTrevor Noah24:43

       That's interesting.

   17. EUEugene24:44

       You know, I, I, I didn't look at a person who could- who didn't want responsibility. I looked at a guy who pushed away his happiness for so long and took on responsibility that he didn't want. And when he son- suddenly decided to stand up for himself, he had all of these people around him that needed him, and he chose not to be there because he wanted to put himself ahead. And your story so much reminds me of my aunt, 'cause my, my, my dad's mo- uh, sister was the only girl in the family, and she had four brothers. And every time something would go wrong, their wives, our moms, would go tell her, and no one cared about her story.

   18. TNTrevor Noah25:19

       Oh.

   19. EUEugene25:20

       No one ever said, "How's Auntie doing?" She would, she would make turns every time, 'cause she used to sell vegetables. So she would knock off from the, from the, from the rank in town, then she would make turns in every house to drop off a packet of something, onions, tomatoes, and she would sit around for a small chat with the kids. Then afterwards she would sit around with the wives and ask-

   20. TNTrevor Noah25:41

       How's everything going? Yeah

   21. EUEugene25:43

       ... "How's my brother be ... Is, is he behaving?"

   22. TNTrevor Noah25:44

       [laughs]

   23. EUEugene25:44

       Then she would ... The third turn would be her going to speak to the said brother to say, "But I think what you're doing is wrong."

   24. TNTrevor Noah25:51

       Mm-hmm.

   25. EUEugene25:51

       Then after, she would just cut a lonely figure going to the next, 'cause we lived almost in close proximity to each other. But no one ever asked my aunt how she was feeling and how she was doing. And now that you speak like this, I'm thinking, she was playing cricket with the boys and winning, and no one pulled her to the side and said, "You're doing great," and said it in public even.

   26. AKAsma Khan26:14

       Yeah. I ... It's just the thing I've ... The reason I speak and the reason why I'm unafraid-

   27. EUEugene26:20

       Mm

   28. AKAsma Khan26:21

       ... and we were discussing this before you joined, uh, uh, the table, is that I, I am here to represent first women in their graves, the unloved, the unwanted, those that never got appreciated, who never were told that the korma that you made was beautiful-

   29. EUEugene26:42

       Mm-hmm

   30. AKAsma Khan26:42

       ... or that, like your aunt, that, you know, every time you came for vegetables, it gave something extra to my table.
6. 42:30 – 55:00

   Cricket, courage & confidence

   1. AKAsma Khan42:30

      Why do you do ... I accidentally hit people with cricket bats.

   2. TNTrevor Noah42:33

      You know what I'm saying?

   3. AKAsma Khan42:34

      Yeah.

   4. TNTrevor Noah42:35

      I, I, I-

   5. AKAsma Khan42:35

      Yeah

   6. TNTrevor Noah42:35

      ... I'm giving the benefit of the doubt

   7. AKAsma Khan42:37

      No, no, no, no. It was, it-

   8. TNTrevor Noah42:37

      As the person who has-

   9. AKAsma Khan42:38

      It was a fight

   10. TNTrevor Noah42:38

       ... pushed him in a pool-

   11. AKAsma Khan42:39

       Yes

   12. TNTrevor Noah42:39

       ... you should know intention-

   13. AKAsma Khan42:41

       [laughs]

   14. TNTrevor Noah42:41

       ... versus mistakes. [laughs]

   15. AKAsma Khan42:43

       No. Yeah, so I, I did hit him, uh, because he was cheating, and-

   16. TNTrevor Noah42:47

       How was he cheating?

   17. AKAsma Khan42:48

       He told me I was out.

   18. TNTrevor Noah42:50

       Oh.

   19. AKAsma Khan42:50

       And I wasn't out. And we didn't have ... Because nobody wants to be an umpire.

   20. TNTrevor Noah42:54

       Yeah, nobody wants to be an umpire.

   21. AKAsma Khan42:54

       You know, in street cricket, uh, it's a kind of, it's mob rule. They all declare that you're out, but when the, when the bowler says you're out, then kind of too many people were saying that I was out. I was the only girl in the whole gr- gang.

   22. TNTrevor Noah43:06

       Right, but did, did the ... How did it ... 'Cause I wanna know-

   23. AKAsma Khan43:07

       Why did you hit him then?

   24. TNTrevor Noah43:08

       I wanna know which-

   25. AKAsma Khan43:09

       I hit him because I was not out.

   26. TNTrevor Noah43:10

       You were closest?

   27. AKAsma Khan43:10

       No, also I-

   28. TNTrevor Noah43:11

       [laughs]

   29. AKAsma Khan43:12

       Also, the bat was mine. I took the bat home.

   30. TNTrevor Noah43:14

       Damn, Asma was out here running these cricket streets.
7. 55:00 – 1:06:00

   How food became her identity

   1. TNTrevor Noah55:00

      your journey leads to food because, and forgive me if I'm wrong here, the girl who's out playing cricket and hitting people with a bat-

   2. EUEugene55:09

      Mm-hmm

   3. TNTrevor Noah55:09

      ... and writing poetry and playing guitar and, in none of these stories are you mentioning food. And yet sitting here with you at this table, your name is more synonymous with food than it is with cricket or with assault or with-

   4. EUEugene55:23

      [laughs]

   5. TNTrevor Noah55:23

      ... guitar or with poetry.

   6. EUEugene55:25

      Grievous bodily harm. [laughs]

   7. TNTrevor Noah55:27

      You know what I mean? So, so I wanna understand, like, w- where, where does that happen? You're growing up as this young girl in Kolkata, India. You're, you're forging your own path. But where d- where does food come in?

   8. AKAsma Khan55:39

      I love to eat. When I was growing up in India, I had always presumed that I would marry a prince, and I would be some princess in some palace, and I'd have lots of cooks and be spoiled. It wasn't something that excited me. It's not really something I wanted to do, but I kind of presumed, so I didn't know how to cook because girls didn't cook really, I mean, in our family because, especially my house, because my mother had a catering business, so we had more cooks-

   9. TNTrevor Noah56:03

      Okay

   10. AKAsma Khan56:04

       ... than everybody else. So, you know, it was, it was mad. Our house was, like, constantly f- full of food and, and-

   11. TNTrevor Noah56:11

       Ju- just to cut you off there, so help me understand. I, I don't know how ... You know, sometimes w- we'll, um, simplify India or make it seem like it's, like, one place everywhere.

   12. AKAsma Khan56:20

       Mm-hmm.

   13. TNTrevor Noah56:21

       The, there were some parts of India that I went to where people said most people sort of weren't cooking. They were just getting the food-

   14. AKAsma Khan56:29

       Yes

   15. TNTrevor Noah56:29

       ... from place. Is that, is that true? How does that work?

   16. AKAsma Khan56:32

       So, I mean, the thing is that there is ... I always find it challenging when people think India as, like, a kind of a homogeneous one kind of-

   17. TNTrevor Noah56:39

       That's what I, that's what I mean, yeah

   18. AKAsma Khan56:40

       ... and it's never like that. And there are huge differences from the north to the south, but also f- our food-wise, you know, there's wheat-growing areas where people have roti. There are rice-growing areas. Wheat can grow in drier l- soil.

   19. TNTrevor Noah56:53

       Okay.

   20. AKAsma Khan56:54

       And for rice, you need lot of water. Rice grows in water.

   21. TNTrevor Noah56:57

       Uh-huh.

   22. AKAsma Khan56:57

       Uh, and, uh, so there's, there's loads of differences. And we are a very ... Even three villages away in India, you know, the, the baghaar, which is the tempering of dal, is d- done differently.

   23. TNTrevor Noah57:09

       Hmm.

   24. AKAsma Khan57:09

       So we are, w- we're not a society where people are all together.

   25. TNTrevor Noah57:13

       Okay, got it.

   26. AKAsma Khan57:14

       There's huge differences in people. And in, in my household, my father and my mother never ate the same food. My father came from the north. If he saw a fish, and if he saw eye of fish, he would just, like, almost pass out. He found ... And my mother loved fish 'cause she, she grew up and was born near the ocean and the rivers. And my, my dad was landlocked, never saw fish when he was growing up. So there's huge differences with my parents. But because I grew up in Kolkata, which is the food capital of India-

   27. TNTrevor Noah57:44

       Hmm

   28. AKAsma Khan57:44

       ... a best kind of food, you know? It was where, you know, so many cultures, you know, were there. Uh, you know, the food there is incredible. I didn't learn how to cook because I didn't have to.

   29. TNTrevor Noah57:55

       Mm-hmm.

   30. AKAsma Khan57:56

       When my marriage was arranged, uh, with my husband, who was teaching at Cambridge University, through an aunt, and my poor husband was like, you know, "Oh my God, I don't think I wanna do it," I convinced him overnight.
8. 1:06:00 – 1:19:00

   Food, colonialism & injustice

   1. AKAsma Khan1:06:00

      the challenges that we face today, we have not used food as one of the tools to talk about justice.

   2. TNTrevor Noah1:06:09

      Yeah. Oh, that's interesting.

   3. AKAsma Khan1:06:11

      And, you know, there are, you know, there's things like that I will not use, I hesitate to use, like poppy seeds. In my, in Bengal, poppy seeds are, is used a lot.

   4. TNTrevor Noah1:06:20

      Yeah.

   5. AKAsma Khan1:06:20

      But because I did my first degree in history, I know why they're using poppy seeds. They're using poppy seeds because the British forced the farmers-

   6. TNTrevor Noah1:06:29

      Okay

   7. AKAsma Khan1:06:29

      ... on my land to grow poppy to get an entire population in China addicted-

   8. TNTrevor Noah1:06:36

      Opium

   9. AKAsma Khan1:06:37

      ... to opium so that they could get tea for free. Literally for nothing and exported. Their desire for tea, they used farmers, my brothers on my land, to grow p- and the problem is that when you grow ... And they controlled the price. It was a cash crop.

   10. TNTrevor Noah1:06:53

       Mm.

   11. AKAsma Khan1:06:53

       They controlled the price. They had a whole department controlling the price of poppy. The farmer had nothing to l-

   12. TNTrevor Noah1:06:59

       Mm.

   13. AKAsma Khan1:07:00

       No money left to buy food.

   14. TNTrevor Noah1:07:02

       Wow.

   15. AKAsma Khan1:07:02

       So his wife, the farmer's wife, poppy seeds are hard, crushed them, soaked it and crushed it so it fill the belly of the children. So they ate pop- they added poppy seeds to whatever little they had. I refuse to use poppy seeds. So it's, food is not just about my identity.

   16. TNTrevor Noah1:07:20

       Mm.

   17. AKAsma Khan1:07:20

       Food is also about speaking about injustice, and the fact that we don't talk about these things, it's almost like, you know, why should we talk about it? No, I want to talk about slavery. I want to talk about colonialism. I think that British s- children in school should be taught about the empire.

   18. TNTrevor Noah1:07:39

       Mm.

   19. AKAsma Khan1:07:39

       Yes, learn about the Tudor history and all of this-

   20. TNTrevor Noah1:07:41

       Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm

   21. AKAsma Khan1:07:42

       ... very good, and but you need to know so when you push a child, a brown-skinned, dark-skinned child, and say, "Go back home," you need to know why that person is there on the land, why they, you know, they were invited as guests after the war. So many family that has then ... I-

   22. TNTrevor Noah1:08:01

       Yeah, know why they're there in the first place.

   23. AKAsma Khan1:08:02

       Why are they here? Don't ... But the problem is they don't understand.

   24. TNTrevor Noah1:08:06

       Mm.

   25. AKAsma Khan1:08:06

       They don't understand. The wealth of Britain was built on the blood of my people, and I see so much of the food, the fact the spices were traded, and it's not just, you know, the, the Indian, East India Company, the Dutch East India Company-

   26. TNTrevor Noah1:08:26

       Oh, yes

   27. AKAsma Khan1:08:26

       ... the atrocity-

   28. TNTrevor Noah1:08:27

       We're, we're well familiar with it

   29. AKAsma Khan1:08:28

       ... and the atrocities. So I think that food should be a lesson in history-

   30. TNTrevor Noah1:08:35

       Mm
9. 1:19:00 – 1:27:00

   Why cooking is about people

   1. TNTrevor Noah1:19:01

      Ma- like you don't even understand. 'Cause when, when somebody prepares food for you, and, and that's one of the biggest reasons I, um, I'm so sad that we have food delivery services. Mm. I understand- You say this all the time ... they've made life convenient. Yeah, I understand it. Yeah. You say this all the time. But I think we take for granted, and we, we haven't yet studied what we lose when you don't hear the food being prepared, you don't see the food being prepared. You also, most importantly, do not see who is preparing your food. Yeah.

   2. AKAsma Khan1:19:32

      That is so important.

   3. TNTrevor Noah1:19:33

      Do you know what I mean?

   4. AKAsma Khan1:19:33

      Yeah.

   5. TNTrevor Noah1:19:34

      You don't see who is preparing your food. And to your point-

   6. AKAsma Khan1:19:38

      Hmm

   7. TNTrevor Noah1:19:38

      ... if we live in a world where we are separated from the labor that is providing anything for us, how can we then appreciate said labor? You know? True.

   8. AKAsma Khan1:19:50

      Yeah.

   9. TNTrevor Noah1:19:50

      How do we- Yeah ... how do we even begin to, a- a- and I, and I know some people might be like, "Oh, that's a, that's a..." You know, to, to reduce it to something. But I think of somebody like Mohamed Salah in, in, in Liverpool, right? Mohamed Salah demonstrably changed people's attitudes towards Muslims- Yes ... in and around Liverpool, and I'd argue in England. Right.

   10. AKAsma Khan1:20:13

       Yes.

   11. TNTrevor Noah1:20:13

       Just by being himself and doing his thing. Mm-hmm. But would the effect have been the same if you didn't see him, you just heard about the goals being scored, but you didn't know who scored them? Mm-hmm. That someone just scored goals for Liverpool-

   12. AKAsma Khan1:20:28

       Yeah

   13. TNTrevor Noah1:20:29

       ... and got assists for Liverpool. It wouldn't be the same. Mm. There's something powerful in seeing the person-

   14. AKAsma Khan1:20:33

       Yeah

   15. TNTrevor Noah1:20:34

       ... prepare the food. Who is this person? Oh, who are those people in the kitchen? Who is in my kitchen? Who's...

   16. AKAsma Khan1:20:39

       Mm.

   17. TNTrevor Noah1:20:40

       That thing is so magical, and I think it creates a gratitude in us that we, we've taken for granted.

   18. AKAsma Khan1:20:45

       Yes, yes. And I've, you know, I have a now, I'm just moving locations to, and a bigger site in London.

   19. TNTrevor Noah1:20:52

       Oh, congratulations. Congratulations.

   20. AKAsma Khan1:20:54

       Thank you.

   21. TNTrevor Noah1:20:54

       Wow.

   22. AKAsma Khan1:20:54

       It's stressful, but it has an open kitchen. And the thing with open kitchens-

   23. TNTrevor Noah1:20:59

       I love that

   24. AKAsma Khan1:20:59

       ... in, in London, especially Central London, because of the cost of rent, all kitchens are in the basement.

   25. TNTrevor Noah1:21:06

       Ah. To maximize on the space.

   26. AKAsma Khan1:21:06

       You don't see-

   27. TNTrevor Noah1:21:07

       You don't see the people

   28. AKAsma Khan1:21:08

       ... you, you don't see the people. They're where the bathrooms are usually, in the basement.

   29. TNTrevor Noah1:21:11

       Yes.

   30. AKAsma Khan1:21:11

       And it doesn't make sense because that's the money space. You know-
10. 1:27:00 – 1:40:00

    Why Michelin culture is broken

    1. AKAsma Khan1:27:00

       That's ... It's ... I, I never aspired for a Michelin star. I al- I ... Because Michelin is so, it's, the whole basis is excluding people like me.

    2. EUEugene1:27:13

       Hmm.

    3. AKAsma Khan1:27:14

       Because they, they're looking for a standard which is so French, which is so white, which is so much about alcohol pairing. It is about, you know, uh, the appearance. If I was given a one-inch food on a 10-inch plate, that this is Michelin standard. And I have something drizzled and dropped, and there's a poof and a puff-

    4. EUEugene1:27:33

       Hmm

    5. AKAsma Khan1:27:34

       ... and if I need to eat so much edible grass and edible flowers, I'd go graze in a field.

    6. EUEugene1:27:39

       [laughs]

    7. AKAsma Khan1:27:39

       I don't want it on my plate. And I don't wanna pay, sit for two hours getting one-inch food at a time. After the third one-inch food is, I won't even know what I'm eating.

    8. EUEugene1:27:47

       I, I always look at that standard and I'm thinking that was the biggest food colonization scam that has ever been perpetuated. People want to travel for so long for familiarity. They wanted to eat what they know everywhere they went. How crazy is that?

    9. AKAsma Khan1:28:04

       Uh-

    10. EUEugene1:28:04

        Then that became the standard of what good food is.

    11. TNTrevor Noah1:28:06

        But, but again, that, that one was an interesting one, is like when you look at the ... I love that you, essentially, if I, if I heard you, the subtext of what you're saying is like, we take for granted how political food is.

    12. EUEugene1:28:19

        Mm-hmm.

    13. TNTrevor Noah1:28:19

        And not political as in like, who did you vote for, not vote for. No.

    14. EUEugene1:28:22

        Mm-hmm.

    15. TNTrevor Noah1:28:22

        It tells a very complicated story of the people that came before it.

    16. EUEugene1:28:27

        Yeah.

    17. AKAsma Khan1:28:27

        Yeah.

    18. TNTrevor Noah1:28:27

        You know what I mean? There's no food that does not contain a story.

    19. AKAsma Khan1:28:30

        Yes.

    20. TNTrevor Noah1:28:31

        Who moved? Who was forced to move? How were they forced to move? What did they do to survive? It's all-

    21. EUEugene1:28:35

        Who were they forced to grow?

    22. TNTrevor Noah1:28:36

        It's all in the food, right?

    23. AKAsma Khan1:28:39

        Yeah.

    24. TNTrevor Noah1:28:39

        The same thing goes for those quantities of food. So if you, if you look at old, um, you know, like history, you know. And, and like we only have images, obviously there are no photos, but the stories that were told, what was the way you displayed your wealth? Through massive amounts of food, right?

    25. EUEugene1:28:57

        Hmm.

    26. TNTrevor Noah1:28:57

        The richest would eat gluttonous amounts of food.

    27. EUEugene1:29:02

        Mm.

    28. AKAsma Khan1:29:02

        Yeah.

    29. TNTrevor Noah1:29:02

        They would have banquets that would go on for days.

    30. AKAsma Khan1:29:05

        Yes.
11. 1:40:00 – 1:55:00

    There is no such thing as "curry"

    1. AKAsma Khan1:40:00

       bell.

    2. TNTrevor Noah1:40:00

       Yeah.

    3. AKAsma Khan1:40:00

       Mm-hmm.

    4. TNTrevor Noah1:40:01

       Actually, this is something I've always wanted to know. I'm confused by this. So when I was in India, I would say curry, and then people were like, "What are you talking about?"

    5. AKAsma Khan1:40:08

       Yeah. [laughs]

    6. TNTrevor Noah1:40:09

       No, really. So they'd go like-

    7. AKAsma Khan1:40:10

       Okay

    8. TNTrevor Noah1:40:10

       ... "What do you love?" And I'd be like, "Oh, I love curry." And they'd be like, "What, what do you, what do you-

    9. AKAsma Khan1:40:14

       [laughs]

    10. TNTrevor Noah1:40:15

        ... what are you talking about?" And then, like, once I said, like, even when I was there, I was like, "Naan." And the guy said, "Which naan?" And then I was like, "Naan, naan."

    11. AKAsma Khan1:40:21

        None of that.

    12. TNTrevor Noah1:40:22

        "Naan, naan." [laughs]

    13. AKAsma Khan1:40:24

        [laughs] Oh, my.

    14. TNTrevor Noah1:40:24

        And he's like ... And then the g- one guy said to me that, like, "Naan is bread."

    15. AKAsma Khan1:40:27

        Yes.

    16. TNTrevor Noah1:40:28

        And I was like, "Yes, I want some naan bread." And then he said, "No-

    17. AKAsma Khan1:40:30

        Oh, my God

    18. TNTrevor Noah1:40:31

        ... you, you're saying ... " And then he s- and then he ... It was so, so cute the way he said it to me.

    19. AKAsma Khan1:40:34

        [laughs]

    20. TNTrevor Noah1:40:34

        He's like ... He says, he says, "Trevor," he says, "Do you understand right now you're saying bread, bread?"

    21. AKAsma Khan1:40:39

        Yes.

    22. TNTrevor Noah1:40:40

        Then I was like, "What do you mean?" He's like, "You basically came to me and you said, 'I want bread, bread.'"

    23. AKAsma Khan1:40:43

        [laughs]

    24. TNTrevor Noah1:40:44

        Then I was like, "I, I don't understand." He's like-

    25. AKAsma Khan1:40:45

        I love the Indian accent in there coming through.

    26. TNTrevor Noah1:40:47

        He's like ... 'Cause he, he said it so, like-

    27. AKAsma Khan1:40:49

        Yeah

    28. TNTrevor Noah1:40:50

        ... he's like, "Yo."

    29. AKAsma Khan1:40:50

        As a matter of fact.

    30. TNTrevor Noah1:40:51

        Yeah.
12. 1:55:00 – 2:07:00

    The toxic culture inside professional kitchens

    1. AKAsma Khan1:55:00

       is all about, you know, impressing people, making them feel good. But when there are tears behind the wall in your kitchen, who are you actually looking after?

    2. TNTrevor Noah1:55:09

       Mm.

    3. AKAsma Khan1:55:10

       We don't look after your own. So then if the guest leaves and thinks that this is great, give you a five-star review, Michelin gives you a star, Michelin might give you three stars. What is that star worth when you have broken the soul of someone in your kitchen? And we are allowing this every day, and we have not been able to protect our own.

    4. TNTrevor Noah1:55:29

       I often think, you know, to, to the point you're, you're making about, um, the media, I often think i- it's, it's quite an indictment That, you know, and I'll use Hollywood as a shortcut for it, 'cause it's just one of the media spaces that has informed how we live, that Hollywood has been really lazy at finding ways to glamorize things that seem as if they contain no glamour.

    5. EUEugene1:56:00

       Hmm.

    6. TNTrevor Noah1:56:01

       A- and what I mean is this, is like if you think about how many industries Hollywood has taught us about and how they've shaped how people see them, you can't help but think that it now becomes a case of, like, the tail wagging the dog.

    7. EUEugene1:56:17

       Hmm.

    8. TNTrevor Noah1:56:19

       I'm yet to meet a policeman who didn't see police in a movie or on TV and think that that's what policing is.

    9. EUEugene1:56:25

       Yeah.

    10. AKAsma Khan1:56:25

        Hmm.

    11. TNTrevor Noah1:56:25

        You know? Simple example, we all at some point in our lives watched a TV show where there were police, where the one cop wanted the law to be done so badly that they slammed someone's head on a table or they-

    12. EUEugene1:56:38

        Hmm

    13. TNTrevor Noah1:56:38

        ... smashed them against a wall. And, and the story tells us that they are the good person.

    14. EUEugene1:56:42

        Hmm.

    15. AKAsma Khan1:56:43

        Yeah.

    16. TNTrevor Noah1:56:43

        Because they're willing to break the law to save the law.

    17. EUEugene1:56:46

        Enforce the law.

    18. AKAsma Khan1:56:47

        Yeah.

    19. EUEugene1:56:47

        Yeah.

    20. TNTrevor Noah1:56:47

        And you're just like, "Wait-

    21. EUEugene1:56:48

        Yeah

    22. TNTrevor Noah1:56:48

        ... no. But if you ... What are you doing?" But the way it's portrayed to us, like, that's the way you do it. At some point it's like, "You know, turn off the cameras. I'll get this guy to talk."

    23. EUEugene1:56:58

        Yeah.

    24. TNTrevor Noah1:56:58

        And we at home like, "Yeah, turn off the cameras."

    25. EUEugene1:57:01

        Hmm.

    26. TNTrevor Noah1:57:01

        "Screw their civil liberties."

    27. EUEugene1:57:03

        Hmm.

    28. TNTrevor Noah1:57:03

        "Eh, get them to talk." You know? And, and then i- th- they do the same thing with, like, the military. They go like, "This is how you do it. You go to that country and those people are savages-

    29. EUEugene1:57:11

        Yeah

    30. TNTrevor Noah1:57:11

        ... and you, you shoot them all."
13. 2:07:00 – 2:09:00

    The legacy Asma Khan wants to leave

    1. AKAsma Khan2:07:00

       in kitchens, that no one else has done so far. And I asked my father that, you know, when I die, do not bury me inside the fortress and the palace. Bury me on the street so that everyone can walk past, and I want them to ask, "Who is she?"

    2. TNTrevor Noah2:07:17

       Mm-hmm.

    3. AKAsma Khan2:07:17

       I want the world to know this story because I want them to know that you could succeed. You could be kind. You could be graceful. You could be, you know, caring about the community, and I'm very successful. I want people to know you can be successful without being scared.

    4. TNTrevor Noah2:07:35

       No, that's why you're here, and that's, that's... I mean, when I, when I told the team, when I was like, "We've really got to get Asma on," they were like, some people were like, "Who's Asma?" Some people were like, "Oh, from Chef's Table." I was like, "No, no, no, forget all the things you know. You just, you just have to meet this person." And so I'm glad, I'm glad you came and joined us today. This was amazing. Thank you.

    5. AKAsma Khan2:07:54

       Thank you so much. Thank you very much. I'm very-

    6. TNTrevor Noah2:07:56

       This was, and now, I mean, we have to, we have to go and eat the food now.

    7. AKAsma Khan2:07:59

       Yes.

    8. TNTrevor Noah2:07:59

       I don't think I've ever been this hungry-

    9. AKAsma Khan2:08:01

       You have to come-

    10. TNTrevor Noah2:08:02

        ... in a podcast

    11. AKAsma Khan2:08:03

        ... and women cooking, magical. You've got to come to our house.

    12. TNTrevor Noah2:08:06

        No, I mean, that we know. That you can't even like.

    13. AKAsma Khan2:08:08

        Yeah.

    14. TNTrevor Noah2:08:08

        But just, like, now

    15. SPSpeaker2:08:11

        [upbeat music]

    16. TNTrevor Noah2:08:12

        [laughs]

    17. AKAsma Khan2:08:14

        My stove, apparently. [laughs]

    18. AKAsma Khan2:08:18

        [laughs]

    19. TNTrevor Noah2:08:18

        Eugene, download the app, Eugene. Download that app, Eugene. Let's get going.

    20. AKAsma Khan2:08:22

        Oh, God.

    21. TNTrevor Noah2:08:23

        Asma Khan, thank you so much.

    22. AKAsma Khan2:08:24

        You're very welcome. Thank you so much.

    23. AKAsma Khan2:08:25

        Thank you.

    24. TNTrevor Noah2:08:25

        This was lovely. Thank you very much. Thank you so much for watching the episode. If you enjoyed it, pass it on to a friend. If you didn't enjoy it, pass it on to your friend still. Let them suffer for a change. And don't forget to engage with us in the comments. Uh, if you wanna, uh, suggest a guest, maybe there's questions you want, maybe there's ideas that you have, you can chat to us. We will read through the comments, and we'll get into it. Either way, I appreciate you taking the time. Thank you for hanging out with us on What Now? And remember, we do this for you, so we would like to hear from you. Till next time, thank you. [upbeat music]

Episode duration: 2:09:00