Demis Hassabis — Scaling, superhuman AIs, AlphaZero atop LLMs, AlphaFold

ℹ️ EPISODE INFO

Released

February 28, 2024

Duration

1h 1m

Channel

Dwarkesh Podcast

Watch on YouTube

▶ Open ↗

📝 EPISODE DESCRIPTION

Here is my episode with Demis Hassabis, CEO of Google DeepMind. We discuss:

• Why scaling is an artform
• Adding search, planning, & AlphaZero type training atop LLMs
• Making sure rogue nations can't steal weights
• The right way to align superhuman AIs and do an intelligence explosion

𝐄𝐏𝐈𝐒𝐎𝐃𝐄 𝐋𝐈𝐍𝐊𝐒

• Transcript: https://www.dwarkeshpatel.com/p/demis-hassabis
• Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/demis-hassabis-scaling-superhuman-ais-alphazero-atop/id1516093381?i=1000647410338
• Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/episode/6SWbwjYPs5WevIoCCiSByS?si=nCVFSRr7QGGI_STgbrOBDA
• Follow me on Twitter: https://twitter.com/dwarkesh_sp

𝐓𝐈𝐌𝐄𝐒𝐓𝐀𝐌𝐏𝐒 00:00:00 - Nature of intelligence 00:05:56 - RL atop LLMs 00:16:31 - Scaling and alignment 00:24:13 - Timelines and intelligence explosion 00:28:42 - Gemini training 00:35:30 - Governance of superhuman AIs 00:40:42 - Safety, open source, and security of weights 00:47:00 - Multimodal and further progress 00:54:18 - Inside Google DeepMind

🎤 SPEAKERS

• Demis Hassabis

  guest

• Dwarkesh Patel

  host

• Narrator

  other

🧾 EPISODE SUMMARY

In this episode of Dwarkesh Podcast, featuring Demis Hassabis and Dwarkesh Patel, Demis Hassabis — Scaling, superhuman AIs, AlphaZero atop LLMs, AlphaFold explores demis Hassabis explains path to AGI, scaling, safety, and Gemini Demis Hassabis outlines how large multimodal models plus planning/search (AlphaZero-style RL) are his likely recipe for AGI within the next decade, with current LLMs seen as “unreasonably effective” but still incomplete.

🔗 RELATED EPISODES

What remains scarce after AGI? – Alex Imas and Phil Trammell

Chip design from the bottom up – Reiner Pope

Dylan Patel — The single biggest bottleneck to scaling AI compute

Building AlphaGo from scratch – Eric Jang

David Reich – Bronze Age shock, the Neanderthal puzzle, & the sudden spread of farming

Jensen Huang – TPU competition, why we should sell chips to China, & Nvidia’s supply chain moat