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Re:Thinking with Adam GrantRe:Thinking with Adam Grant

Esther Perel on the relationship baggage we bring to work | ReThinking

@estherperel is a psychotherapist known for her innovative approach to relationships. In this episode, Adam and Esther discuss the relational baggage we all carry through our lives and into our work, and how our differing personalities and relationship styles can affect collaboration and culture. They break down the differences between relationship- and task-oriented personalities, and consider the fine balance between risk-taking and rule-following that makes for a healthy relationship with ourselves and others. Host & Guest Adam Grant (Instagram: @adamgrant | LinkedIn: @adammgrant | Website: https://adamgrant.net/) Esther Perel (Instagram: @estherperelofficial | Substack: Entre Nous with Esther Perel | Website: https://www.estherperel.com/) Join us in person at a TED conference: https://tedtalks.social/events Become a TED Member to support our mission: https://ted.com/membership Subscribe to a TED newsletter: https://ted.com/newsletters Follow TED! X: https://www.twitter.com/TEDTalks Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ted Facebook: https://facebook.com/TED LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/ted-conferences TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@tedtoks Podcasts: https://www.ted.com/podcasts The TED Audio Collective is a collection of podcasts for the curious. The TED Audio Collective videos may be used for non-commercial purposes under a Creative Commons License, Attribution–Non Commercial–No Derivatives (or the CC BY – NC – ND 4.0 International) and in accordance with our TED Talks Usage Policy (https://www.ted.com/about/our-organiz...). For more information on using TED for commercial purposes (e.g. employee learning, in a film or online course), please submit a Media Request at https://media-requests.ted.com.

Esther PerelguestAdam Granthost
Mar 3, 202636mWatch on YouTube ↗

At a glance

WHAT IT’S REALLY ABOUT

Esther Perel reveals how personal histories shape workplace relationships and culture

  1. Perel introduces the “unofficial resume,” emphasizing that relationship history and early socialization patterns strongly influence how people interpret authority, collaborate, and respond to conflict at work.
  2. They unpack the persistent tension between autonomy and interdependence, arguing it’s not a problem to solve but a polarity to manage, with different people needing more “pliability” or more “solidification.”
  3. The conversation reframes “soft skills” as “relational intelligence,” a systemic capability that becomes more central as AI automates technical tasks and as organizations rely on human coordination.
  4. They argue that effective teams and cultures require complementarity (integrating opposites like task/relationship or creativity/conformity) and that polarization happens when groups outsource the “other side” to someone else instead of integrating it.
  5. They discuss practical implications for hiring, mentoring, mergers, and inclusive leadership, including how leaders should elicit minority viewpoints and how structured dialogue can reduce advocacy-driven reactivity and increase inquiry-driven learning.

IDEAS WORTH REMEMBERING

5 ideas

Work performance is shaped by a hidden “relationship resume.”

Beyond job history, people bring ingrained norms about dependence, loyalty, conflict, and authority that determine what it’s actually like to work with them and how they interpret the same manager differently.

Autonomy and interdependence are a permanent workplace polarity.

Perel argues the tension never disappears; healthy collaboration requires ongoing negotiation between “I” and “we,” with some people needing to become more flexible and others needing firmer boundaries.

Relational skills are becoming a bottom-line capability—“relational intelligence.”

As AI changes work, Perel claims value shifts toward understanding and navigating the relational system inside organizations, not just communication tactics.

Better matching beats moralizing: not every mentor/manager fit is right.

Grant’s example shows that valuing helpfulness can still lead to mismatches (e.g., with deferential students); explicitly acknowledging relational style fit can prevent quietly unproductive pairings.

Complementarity requires integration, not just “culture add.”

Bringing in a contrasting leader or team member only helps if both sides expect mutual influence; otherwise the “different” person gets siloed, or the system stays split and polarized.

WORDS WORTH SAVING

5 quotes

And actually, we don't call them skills anymore. It's relational intelligence because it's systemic. It's not just knowing how to talk and communicate. It's understanding the relational system inside companies.

Esther Perel

The same boss can often be liked by some and dis- totally disliked by others. Not-- Because a relationship is not just one person's personality. It's the dance between two personalities.

Esther Perel

Because helping others is actually an expression of autonomy that says, "You need me, but I never need you."

Esther Perel

Complementarity is the ability to integrate the two parts. The opposite of complementarity is polarization.

Esther Perel

Most relationship issues, most organizational issues, most systemic issues are complex problems that you learn to manage, paradoxes that you hold and not problems that you solve.

Esther Perel

Unofficial resume and relationship historyAutonomy vs loyalty/interdependence upbringingAuthority scripts: compliance, defiance, trust, distrustRelational intelligence vs “soft skills”Task-oriented vs relationship-oriented culturesComplementarity vs polarizationRisk vs rules, security vs adventure in teams

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